genuine question here . what’s the point of a +10 key if it’s not gonna drop better gear than a +9, especially with new upgrade system and crests, the difficulty barely changes , isn’t this just a filler ? like half of other keys . is there a logic behind this ? i don’t think having this many levels help smoothing the transition either ,or does it ?
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I have no idea. In BFA (especially season 1) scaling was more aggressive and it worked nice. Every keystone level felt rewarding.
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I always jumped between crest levels (and affix amount); +5 key for new alts first, next +8, +11, +14, +16 … rest in-between seems unnecessary
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Every level improves gear.
9 drops the same end of dungeon gear as 10, but 10 gives better weekly vault.
11 then gives the same weekly vault as 10 but better end of dung and so on.
This offers a smoother difficulty curve. If you wanted to make that curve harder, let me remind you of when tyrannical and fortified used to be level10 affixes, creating walls for people. You are literally asking for that, for mini walls. Something the community asked to have removed. So your issue is not with blizzard, it’s with the people asking for tyr/fort to be moved.
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does it tho ? having +10 but not going from 9 to 11 help with anything ? i know the vault thing but removing +10 would change nothing imo. if you can do +9 you can do +11 too and the transition would be smooth
I like this question. It dose make me wonder if we can condense some key levels and make the scaling more aggressive
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You would be surprised how many people sit at this level and get gear. It’s not uncommon particularly early in a season
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It feels that way now because everyone’s overgeared and knows tactics. But at the start of the season, it felt different. And for beginners, it probably still feels different now, unless they get carried by overgeared group members.
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i felt the same way at start too. not saying it’s too easy i just don’t think +9 and +11 have difficulty difference that requires another level between them .
yeah my toon is over that level i stopped playing it in 2nd week because felt boring now trying to get ksm and i realised we could work without half of these levels . why does +12 and +14 exist. +10 is also really bad because you’re almost doing the same thing as you’d do in a +11 but you don’t get the crest
Ofcourse it does, more key levels means each keystone increase has less of a jump upwards in difficulty to make.
If they reduced the key levels. The difficulty spike would have to be larger per increwse to offset the reduction in key levels.
Yes gear dont go up every key level, but RIO and the leaders key does, which is the reward for timing the content.
Because for most of my chars it took quite some weeks to go from 12 to 14. Especially on my tank. And i am still not feeling good enough for 14’s on my dps, but am for 12’s. Not to forget 14 adds another affix, so i often go for 13’s on multiple chars for weeklies.
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just because you can doesnt mean general playerbase can .
i know its hard to realise to many people whwo run 17-20 keys but very many keys below 15 end up as failure and groups break up.
especialy +14 is very harsh wall for many casual groups in lfg.
over years i have been in many low keys that never finished runs because to many bad / undergered people join those hoping for free carry run just becuase its "lol +9 "
i feel this especialy hard on my rogue on which i am a really really really bad player and cannot even slightly carry those groups - for example brackenhide is horrible to play on keys like 12-15 if you dont have at least 2-3 people to hard carry group . really really bad experience because most healers avoid this place like plague and you end up with extremly bad and undergeard healers there.
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Which usually means no interrupts and hope the healer can carry. Which is something healers can’t anymore in DF.
I feel like the levels are there for mainly new players to improve skill, but it is not working as intended. There might as well be less keys levels, or higher key skips to get to your goals quicker.
There are a lot of new players which is a good thing, but not if they are unguided and get carried to up to 11-16 range and are playing spectator mode. There needs to be some kind of tutorial for new players, that teaches things like interrupting and defensive/offensive cooldown usage in a 5 player AI dungeon setting or something. (Tank/Healer/Dps - Class/Spec specific)
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but isn’t that the point of the m+ scene a (challenge) you don’t want a +9 or a +10 so you pump harder and faster to make sure your rewarded with key level you want… I mean what more do you want? should blizz just hand a weekly loot for simply logging in?
that’s not what i meant tho. +10 , many keys before +7 are not necessary for anyone, it’s not about skill here because there aren’t many changes. you can do +2 and +6 back to back but when you get to +7 things change, you can do +8-9-10 back to back but +11 changes things.
so basically, what i’m saying is, the difficulty jump isn’t smooth even tho we have so many keys in between. also i’ve read some posts here about struggling with 14 etc. that’s usually about gear, because you don’t get enough gear between 10-14 so it becomes harder. the filler keys don’t help or change anything that’s what i’m saying here. every key that doesn’t drop a higher ilvl than the prior one should be removed and i can assure you that we will have the same gameplay experience. we’d do 2x +9 instead of doing +9, +10.
i know you’ll say what good will it make , it can help shortening the grind
that has nothing to do with what i said , just remove +10 it’s useless , +9 to +11 is not less smooth than +10 to +11. that’s my point
Good question.
Having too many key levels also means that the player-pool is spread out more, or rather that you’ll have a harder time finding people for your keys.
To clarify: many people only search for a specific keyrange.
If you search for +17 only keys in the range of 16-18 will show up, thus if you make the key-spread smaller, you’ll have more people searching for the same range of groups, which is a good thing… especially to find tanks or healers.
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my point exactly…
Well, there’s quite a difference between 15 and 17. For sure i am not tanking 17’s yet (tried though) but i am pretty comfortable on 15.
but doesn’t it also have something to do with your gear ? i feel like my gear is the thing that’s stopping me everytime i do keys. also 15-17 difference is kinda not the same as 9-10 . like benzine said new crests make people focus on specific keys and we already have issues with tanks and healers