When it has something to do with gear then those keylevels have their purpose to get more gear and then get higher. But i am 433 with 4 setbonus, so i wonder it is a gear thing.
As someone who mostly pugs my way up to KSH (2500+ rating), my opinion is that ilvl 433 is indeed a bit low-ish to begin doing +17 keys safely. A good ‘starting’ ilvl for +17 is around 437 (and even then you’ll probably be struggling a bit still at the start).
Opinions will vary of course.
I’ve predicted that long time ago, but people accused me that i want free loot 
2 Likes
Sounds like every keylevel serves its purpose 
what’s the purpose of +10 ?
why would anyone do +4, +6, +8, +10, if they can get the same loot from prior key and i know vault gives different but if you’re pushing keys you don’t wait for +4s reward from vault for a week you already go to next level, and if you play for the vault you focus on crests on low levels which makes the rest of the filler keys useless. difficulty doesn’t change that much at low keys it starts changing a lot after +15 and then you have yourself a loot dilemma like benzine explained where people simply don’t do some keys
For people who are progressing 9 to 10? The key is 8% harder. That is significant.
what’s stopping us at %8 then ? make it 50 keys with %2 difficulty difference each ? i don’t think it’s well optimised considering the loots, chances, playerbase
I am not sure what your argument is? 
Blizz is using 8% and 10% (+10’s-+20). I think that is quite reasonable, and i for sure notice the progression.
i find the keys that doesn’t drop higher loot from prior keys useless and i think they have a negative effect but that’s my opinion ofc. we can agree to disagree
+10 drops a higher vault than +9.
aware of that. i was just trying to see a logical reasoning behind this but i still don’t see enough reasons why half of these keys exist. i don’t feel difficulty changing between +9 & +10 , it gives the same loots, vault don’t matter because if i’m doing +10 i’ll already try +11 for the crest and do it so vault will drop 11. having 10 feels like spreading players too much for something that’s not worth it and wasting time . but that’s obviously my own opinion. we don’t have 20 difficulty levels in raids and people do just fine. not saying mythic plus should have 4 levels but your explanation for 20+ levels did not make sense to me
So that the difficulty increases gradually. If a keylevel is too easy you just +3 (or +2) it, jumping you up in key levels. Eventually you get to a point where you can only +1 a key.
The vault rewards also vary ofc.
| Keystone Level | End of Dungeon | Weekly Great Vault |
|---|---|---|
| Mythic 2 | 376 | 382 |
| Mythic 3 | 376 | 385 |
| Mythic 4 | 379 | 385 |
| Mythic 5 | 379 | 389 |
| Mythic 6 | 382 | 389 |
| Mythic 7 | 385 | 392 |
| Mythic 8 | 385 | 395 |
| Mythic 9 | 389 | 395 |
| Mythic 10 | 392 | 398 |
| Mythic 11 | 392 | 402 |
| Mythic 12 | 392 | 405 |
| Mythic 13 | 392 | 408 |
| Mythic 14 | 395 | 408 |
| Mythic 15 | 398 | 411 |
| Mythic 16 | 398 | 415 |
| Mythic 17 | 402 | 415 |
| Mythic 18 | 402 | 418 |
| Mythic 19 | 405 | 418 |
| Mythic 20 | 405 | 421 |
The difficulty changes by 8-10% per key level which seems about right. A 20% increase would be too much and many people would easily do one key and upgrade the key on a+3 which would then be a HUGE jump up in difficulty.
1 Like
i don’t think it would as long as we get our gear from previous key. is it too much in raids ?
It is a bit too much since you can just get to 437 farming +11 but then can’t get above 437 until +16. Making 12-15 keys feel pointless.
3 Likes
agreed again, you don’t wait for the vault you try to push as many as you can so vault giving higher loot in higher key makes no sense to most of the players until they’re done with their weekly push. don’t forget about the fact that many people who play m+ got their ksm in first few days this season.
Yeah for me it is just progressing. When i time a key i go key +1.
In BFA we had the problem we had progression till 10 keylevels which resulted in +2 certain keylevels but not even being able to do the keylevel +1. Hardstuck on bosses not killable. It is not fun to +2 a +7 and then not being able to finish the +8 at all in 2 hours.
I agree …it’s weird now that you can get 437 gear just by doing a 11 keys
1 Like
It depends on your view, are you doing M+ for loot or for rating?
I know this seems like an obvious question, and for many people it doesn’t matter as the answer will be “both”, but I have plenty of friends who are fully maxed out in gear, and they only do keys to push rating at this point.
i don’t find the m+ concept fun at all so i do it for ksm and leave it there tbh so don’t carea bout either of them but i also need both of them. pushing rating part is different than my thoughts on here i totally get that but having these filler keys feels unnecessary to me