just asking for a friend
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My friend told me because âthey were never viable in the history of WoWâ
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lock is always s tier atleast1 specc like rog mage
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Yet right now there are almost no Rogues of any spec in that bracket. Explain.
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You feel the vengeance of ânever viable f tierâ Ret Paladins.
Rogue players are nothing but OP class abusers.
The reason why you donât see many rogues right now is pretty obvious : theyâre all playing ret 
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Because people reroll into most broken brain dead specs, BM/DEMO/RET/FISTWEAVER
While the first sentence is once again some pretty idiotic statement that just generalizes for no reason (aside from LOL ROGUE LETS DOWNTALK), Iâm quite afraid the second sentence is mostly true. Those same players who were DH in BfA, Arms in SL, then Outlaw, then DH into Assa in DF, have shifted to Ret now.
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is always a retri with a combination of bm,demo or warrior
Well after SL itâs understandable that people have PTSD after playing against Rogues. Literally every spec had something broken in that expansion. Sub probably had the most gimmicky one shots in SL between all seasons. Assassination had that stupid Sepsis one shots killing people through pre-wall at 70% hp and Outlaw being unkillable at some point. You have to wait until people forget. It will probably happen soon as Rogue was never as broken as Ret. Maybe when there were 3x Sub one shots. Ret on the other hand is broken in every aspect. For me the most stupid change in Rogue was Cloaked in Shadows because it insanely buffed Vanish and Shadowmeld and overall defence of Rogue.
Anyway saying that Rogue is broken now is similar delusion to defending Judgement of the Pure or overall Ret rework.
Couldnât agree more, why else would have people abused the op state of rogue for years and now just hop onto the next broken spec until it gets nerfed and they can abuse rogue again.
Itâs not only SL, it is basically every single expansion, except for MOP maybe where a lot of specs were as broken as rogues.
I wouldnât say they were always broken. There were situations like WoD Combat, early Legion Assassination that needed 35% agi nerf or Cata Rogue with legendaries but overall Rogue was good not really broken. It had very few seasons when it wasnât at least A Tier. SL though was the pinnacle of broken Rogue.
People got ShS Ambushâed 15 years ago and still nurture hatred towards Rofue for this today, so, no, I donât think this is going to happen.
Like, look at this other classic guy. What can I say !
Is demo really broken? I tried some games on mine and itâs feels horrible, canât cast anything and you face melee cleave 24/7.
Also seen venruki played with 1 yesterday the guy was doing crap dmg every game trying to survive endlessly with like 0 pressure.
Dark pact get legit os even though the overall demo lock survivability is pretty strong (I guess the best tanky caster en but not sure).
i heard bigmecs calling it the best specc in the game rn and thats even w rets beeing that op so yea i think its broken
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If he said that as a thug cleave pov ofc cause demo can ruin their setup every go but from what Iâve seen on stream it never does anything crazy in terms of dmg.
Seems only perform well in premade 3s
In my opinion, rogue will always be broken because the class design of spam able stuns as the most overtuned cc ingame is broken and they have the most and the most frequently stuns.
The damage, ms and the other toolkit just decides of how much broken they are from my perspective, not if they are.
Sure, there will always be this one rogue coming up with what ever idiotic argument to defend its op state, but that doesnât change the fact that it was mostly rogue that dominated the 3s ladder in the past 15 years with just some very few exceptions which were mostly just a few weeks before it was meta again.
I wouldnât say hatered. Itâs âPTSDâ. Rogue is historically the best spec in ladder PvP. Ironically it never won Blizzcon until Blizzard allowed people to use addons. I feel that the amount of information and addons are one of the reasons why PvP looks like it does now. People have all the information possible. Nowadays Grounding a Trap is only possible if guy isnât standing on top of the healer or he doesnât throw a Trap already so I can use Grounding while Trap is mid air. Everyone has a weak aura of Grounding being used. Same goes for many other spells. I know that my friend in Wrath Classic has a weak aura that shows his Tremor Totem was targetted. Itâs just stupid. People âgot betterâ where in fact they just get better and better addons. The pace of the game has to be faster and faster because players do less and less mistakes and itâs like a warfare race between players and Blizzard. AWC shows that no matter how fast the meta is AWC games will still go into dampening.
I feel that once players would lose some information and have to rely on own awarness then meta can slow down and players will die because they will make more mistakes. It will also become less scripted.
In all fairness I believe that there is a place for every class and if possible every spec in PvP but then many things have to change. Iâd love to see every Rogue spec in the game being good and maybe being complimented by the other partner like in Legion Sub played Frost RMP, Assassination played Fire RMPala and some dot specs while Outlaw played with Ele/Enha/Ret for example. That should be the main goal of the game. Other thing I think should be a priority of the design is creating more proactive spells with idea of outplay/skill play in mind. Like I said in the past any matchup with Hunter and Shaman being against each other was about Grounding Traps. It was an exciting mini game that allowed you to outplay your opponent and have huge impact on the game. Spells like Judgment of the Pure on the other hand are against the idea of PvP. Not only it does something passive while doing damage but player doesnât even think about it. No Ret player currently is holding Judgement to dispel something since itâs such a short CD.
Iâd say the main difference between Rogue since SL and Rogue in the past is defence. Rogue was never as good defensively. Currently it has one of the best toolkits CD wise. Only Ret probably can compete atm. It has a lot to do with Cloaked in Shadows that was nerfed multiple times and still is extremely strong. Rogue in the past was high risk â high reward. You had to keep him doted or not allow him to restealth and then you could reliably beat him. Best players with their positioning could still find ways to restealth and do well. With Cloaked in Shadows introduction Rogue can Vanish whenever he wants no matter what. In SL it was so op at some point that there was that clip of Affliction Warlock popping all CDs on him and Rogue just Vanished and then Stealthed again behind the pillar like it was nothing. The problem with Rogue since SL is that itâs not high risk anymore.
I donât feel that WoW would ever be as fun as it was in the past because of how community changed over the years. People are tryharding way more that they used to. Majority of players quit A tier specs and reroll to S+++ whenever something new pops up. They also have dozens of weak auras and optimize everything. Thatâs why Wrath will never feel the same. Well most of the players are frustrated with WoW more often than they are actually having fun. Add lack of proper testing before patch releases and you get current WoW.
April Foolâs patch notes arenât funny when PvP is in such state. Till Wednesday half of the roster is shut down with 1 stupid PvP talent that shouldnât be added to the game at all. To be fair adding Healerâs Dispel to Ret at 8 sec CD would make more sense because at least player would have to be aware of his healerâs plate and use it when itâs necessary.
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Please, donât be like the rogues. For what do you need great defensives if you have spam able control? They donât understand that question, hopefully you do!
A stun isnât just an offensive cd, its also great defense because a stunned target donât deal any damage.
Beside that, there have been times where they had a 30% wall on 15 seconds cd with 5 second uptime for example or massive self healing through out the expansions. I can remember times when recup was so strong that even the second wind would have been envious!
You can literally check arenamate to see that statement is factually false lol