Tbh gear is not the problem, it is fine as it is. The problem are within the classes / Specs, how imbalanced they are compared to eachother, some specs are just insanly overpowered for for PvP and the fact that it is just way to much self healing in this game now.
Yea, except gearing through pvp is not a viable choice. If you want gear to matter for pvp, add a viable way to get the pvp gear.
Nonviable pvp gearing method? No gear mattering in pvp. Why should people be forced to pve to do pvp? Back in the day you needed 1-3 items from pve tops to be at the top of your game and still you weren’t that much above an average pvp only player.
Based on what?
When I go and look up the top PvP players, all of them have geared up through PvP.
Are you sure about that? Because according to
worldofwargraphs(.)com(/)pvp-stat(/)best-players
they are mostly pve geared
they should just bring back pvp vendors already it was a much better system than what is in place now
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Thanks for that.
I need to admit that not all of them have geared through PvP only. The players who play PvE have predominantly PvE gear. But you can see that there are PvP players only (Xaryu) who have only PvP gear.
Anyway, if you play only PvP there is no problem for you to gear up if you win in arena.
Anyone who says its okay that you must farm pve gear before you can actually do pvp, is simply a retard. Sorry but this is the true.
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Actually, you can do PvP from level 1.
So here is the thing. You can PvP with green gear if you want, there is no problem with that.
The problem with having to do PvE in order to have BiS is that gear does not last and it is harder to motivate people who dont like PvEing as much.
Other than that, in general, it is absolutely normal in a MMO RPG game the BiS items to come from different types of sources.
Agreed. But you can nolonger be casual about it.
Back in the day it was simpler. Get max lvl? Farm a bit of gold and buy starter pvp gear, farm some honor, get honor gear, do some more arenas, start on your conquewt cap. Oh you are really good at arenas? Well here’s a higher conquest cap for you so you can gear faster.
I think that the changes came from the fact that it used to be much easier to farm PvP gear compared to PvE.
I’ve admitted more than once that I am the “i play with my bro” type of player and there are expansions that i have literally played only with my bro and I havent seen anything from them. Anything. Basically, hit max level, go to the capital, game over (just queue and queue and queue). That was it for me.
I kind of like it that the game engages players more now and I think that is how a MMO RPG should be.
The thing I dont like is that the achievements you make in game dont last long. This is how it should not be in a MMO RPG in my opinion.
That may be true that you geared up faster through pvp
But in PVE that gear was MUCH weaker than.
I remember back in cata when I was doing zul’aman 5man dungeon on my unholy dk (it had full conquest gear), I had a friend (that I actually taught how to play unholy ![:slight_smile:](https://d1bg94bbsh66ji.cloudfront.net/en/wow/images/emoji/twitter/slight_smile.png?v=6" ":slight_smile:")
) outdps me in what its name… Those dungeons where you could find echo of Sylvanas, Tyrande, Baine?.. Well that’s not the point…
He was crushing me in dps despite of using same talents, same rotations etc. So for both outdoor pve and raids/dungeons, pvp gear was not all that great.
Heck, he loved rubbin it in so much that I actually started pve not a week later… (Was purely pvp player back then, or more precise, purely bg/wpvp player)
Small edit: It did make you dang tanky though.
True.
However, I feel that your character should be consistent whether you are doing PvP or PvE. I am not a fan of grinding for PvE and then for PvP.
I feel the current system is mostly OK. If you are a hardcore player, now there are extra challenges for you and you need to play different aspects of the game more. Recreational players will not be able to do everything you’ve done and you will keep your advantage throughout the expansion.
Recreational players can still progress just by doing LFG (BGs included) and they can get to see the same content as hardcore players but a different face of it. This is what Blizz insists on doing and probably is for the better because by allowing everyone to get to know the game, you enable them to fall inlove with it. This is good for everybody as a more accessible game means more players, better players and better competition so a better game as well.
I think what we need to see more is BiS items coming from PvP only.
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I don’t know… Maybe it’s the old person in me speaking, but I think pvp and pve should be kept apart as far as possible
WM is pve, with pvp strapped on = wpvp.
Pvp is pvp. Instanced or not and should follow same rules in every case. Or do you want legion wpvp to happen again?
Except it’s not. Bg/Arena is pure pvp. WM is wpvp, which is mixed pve and pvp. Next time in a zone, take a look at the wqs, etc… pve. With pvp bolted on = wm. That’s the game mode. Want pure pvp open world? Ask blizz nicely, I’d play it.
I’m happy with same gear in all modes and gear mattering, doesn’t bother me. And my gear is poor hehe! Legion stat templates didn’t bother me either, just play the game imo.
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You having to choose between damage to mobs and objectives (pve gear) vs the increased survivability to survive unwelcome ambushes or mix n matchibg dor the best result to you is what made it the most fun for me in places like tol barad, wintergrasp, timeleas isle, halaa and various other wpvp zones of thr past.
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Could be fun, but seems people in general don’t want that.
And there’s a reason WoW survived 15 years and those didn’t.
It’s an RPG. Gear should matter. Progression is the core of RPGs. Don’t like it, go play Counter Strike or Call of Duty.
You don’t speak for everyone. Go play whatever weeb game doesn’t use gear.
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I already covered this argument. I notice you couldn’t help with an attempt at belittling before making your point. If you need to do that, It just shows me you are emotionally biased, and are looking for an excuse to feel like you’re skilled for relying on gear. You aren’t.
Now, we could argue “gear doesn’t impact that much”; it does, more so in world PVP than BG or Arena. You saying it doesn’t make a big impact is simply a lie. Of course, it is all relative when using words like “big”.
The PVE carebears will flock to this logic however because they like that gear can allow them to have the edge. If you need gear, you don’t truly care about finding out who the best players are, and are not interested in true competition. If you think like that, you are a fake pvper.
“RPG therefore geared PVP” is still a non-argument, I direct you to the post I made earlier in the thread that explains exactly why this is a non-argument.
And in response to Kelduril :
I don’t speak for everyone, but geared PVP isn’t real PVP because it is Player versus gear. Gear doesn’t do everything, but it does enough to potentially completely change the outcome, and to cause the better player to lose to a less skilled player.
Fundamentally, the problem is that worse players can win against better players by relying on something outside of superior tactics/skill.