Why the Paid TBC Classic Level Boost Is Not Bad | A World Of Warcraft Rant Video

WoW Classic Cataclysm Classic Discussion
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I have been saying that for about 2 years now: If one of the most experienced and highly paid game designers in the business tells something about what a gamer audience wants, maybe, just maybe, people with zero experience in the field, should listen :stuck_out_tongue:

The usual “counter” to that is “well, I’m a gamer, and I disagree!!!” which is about as clever as saying “Well, it’s my lung, whos that Pulmonologist who studied medicine for 3 decades to tell me what to put into it”.

People tend to forget that Allen was talking about a majority, about the gaming-community as seen from a business perspective. Yes, some people may want things as they were 2 decades ago, but how much that matters in the big picture, is a different question.

A good example for this is, or will be, Diablo Immortal. Yes, redshirt-guy was hilarious, and the presentation was almost laughed off stage, but here is the thing…these few thousand people who were at the event, don’t matter in the big picture. Mobile games are WAAAAAAAY more profitable to the gaming industry compared to PC titles (https://www.battery.com/powered/wp-content/uploads/2019/01/4-1024x576.png) and Diablo Immortal is the right decision from a business perspective, rgeardless of what some people on the forums think.

And, and this is really hard to admit for me, it’s not as if I, the self-perceived “oldschool gamer” haven’t changed. I played classic using logs, analysing my plays, collecting buffs, getting BiS gear, stacking consumables…I am not the guy from 17 years ago, who went into MC with an Admirals Hat, thinking he was the bees knees because I wore *gasp* T0 warlock chestpiece!! :smiley:

So in a way, this…

…is not entirely untrue regarding myself.

3 Likes
84

that was funny ^^ i got you

yeah i found that out while writing my bachelor homework, wich topic was related to videogames. It was crazy how big the moneydifference is, its actually crazy. So crazy that i checked that like 5 times to be sure abd to be right about that statement in the homework.

85

Again, mage boosting.
Yes, mage boosting is the lesser evil.
And yes, mage boosting should have been gone a long time ago. I made a post about mage boosting asking Blizzard to fix it in november 2019.

Mage boosting is bad, but at least it still takes some time, involves ingame interactions and unless the boostie buys gold from gold sellers, which should be a reason for a ban btw, it is emergent player behavior. Like those warriors asking for gold to tank, warlocks asking for gold to summon other players or hunters asking for gold for DMT buffs. These all exist in the game.

You just keep spamming 1 IQ arguments that have been discussed a long while ago while adding some random buzzwords like “strawman” “what-ifs” etc that you don’t even understand the meaning of.

You just made a fool of yourself and the like/dislike ratio in your own video is just a proof how shallow you are. Thanks for letting us know of this, so that we can avoid you in the game after this point.
(I just feel bad because I clicked the link and increased the view count, damn!)

1 Like
86

No that’s not a what-if. It is a fact, Is it already TBC? Did they state it’s the final change? Are we already raiding with the actual drums?

I rather stop talking with you because you are obnoxious with your what-if statements and ‘‘putting oil in to fire’’ which is a subjective thing. For me it’s bandaging the problem until fixxed. You see it as oil.

Agree to disagree.

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Ok dude if this helps you sleep, its fine.

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Again, read what I said. I know about the dislike / like ratio. From analytics, people don’t even watch the entirety to the video before they put like or dislike.
So that’s is not a meter of doing good or not, especially on a cleaving subject.

It is not the lesser evil because you are talking about boostie buys gold form gold sellers like they are a minority. I never saw that many rich guys as in classic. EVERYONE farms gold and has a mage / hunter to make gold right? The inflation of the company is truly made by players and only a minority uses the gold buying service right???

You take an argument like Warlock sums and Warrior tank service and use it while now knowing my stance on it. That’s a fallacy. Warrior tank service is not boosting, that’s just a warrior offering his service for a run, he isn’t going to carry the dungeon while you are afk? He isn’t going to boost SM while you are at the entrance of the dungeon? It is just Tank service, which did exist in 2005 :slight_smile:

Fallacies, you are the one trying to understand them, you keep on using them without knowing.

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I sleep fine, just try to get an healthy discussion but what I only get are keyboard warriors,doing ad hominems, using fallacies, doing what-ifs to try to win the argument, while i’m not trying to change your opinion. Your opinion is just your opinion.

You rather fight future wars while i’m trying to stop the actual war. ( Fight your future fear, while i’m fighting against the actual problems the game has.)

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I I I IIIIIIIIIIII i do everything right and you guys a terrible, but iam divine ! Come to my infinite knowledge and bath in rays of godlike understanding. IAM IN FACT THE MESSIAH OF PRO-BOOSTING AND I WILL CONFINCE EVERYONE… because ONLY I posses the knowledge and breaking wisdom to do so (speaking with Sona´s voice from LoL)

This was a sign for you that its fine, we can end here. Why do you oversteped that ?

You remind me of someone… someone that does things different from the words they used…mh… ahja…it was blizzard.

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Yikes, You paraphrase me and then say that I try to convince people while i said i’m not here to change people’s opinion.

You are obnoxious w/e I will now ignore you. Love how you tried to imitate me while you are the guy saying that the pro-boosters are wrong and trying to convince people on how bad it is.

maybe you should play some LoL again, since you have the same toxic attitude as a Gold 4 player.

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You keep misrepresenting retail like it’s some kind of abomination akin to the pay to win MMORPGs. And you keep comparing a simple catch up mechanic for those that did not play classic vanilla to something that actually impacts gameplay in any way.

Level 58 boost, or no level 60 transfers. Take your pick. In the former option, you, as classic vanilla player, have an advantage. In the latter option, it’s a completely clean slate for both parties. But YOU want to have your cake and eat it, alienating any new players in the process.

I enjoyed reliving the classic leveling experience. I did it at my own pace, sating my OCD with clearing every quest in the game and only doing dungeons after obtaining all the quests for it.

I am no longer the bad youngster I used to be, though, so I can’t enjoy taking 6 hours in Molten Core anymore when I know I am more than capable of doing it in 30 minutes. This already changed for me in TBC.

I doubt he’s unhappy, because Blizzard’s earning plenty for what probably cost them very little to actually make. Doesn’t make him right. And neither do any of your statements above.

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Again if this helps you sleep, its fine. I just showed you how people think of you,

if you dont enjoy that than maybe you should change something. Go ahead call me obnoxious for the third time if this makes you happy. But to this date you never made a valid point and you were one month late to the party. I never had any intention so p*ss you off, it was your choice to feel like that.

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Had to turn it off after you spent 10 minutes talking in circles around the same argument which has nothing to do with why people dont want the boost in the game, also you said it yourself propably around 15 times in the first 10 minutes of your video.
People that say they dont have the time to level actually do have the time they just dont want to do it because they dont like the leveling which is exactly why people call em out on that crap argument because it is by definition hypcritical you dont get to knitpick the content you enjoy the most in an rpg, like whats next people say they dont like to raid but they enjoy the gear should we have it in a shop too? give me a break.

1 Like
95

I went from feeling meh about the boosts when they were first announced to being against them after I saw the ballad of the level boost, so I came here wondering if this video would change my mind back. But the video was made so obviously with only the pro-boosting point of view in mind that it’s hard to take seriously. And not only it is one sided, the arguments for being pro-boost don’t seem that well thought out. Some of the arguments made in the video:

“People buy boosts from mages anyway” - So instead of fixing that, you’re going to make the issue even worse by offering an easier alternative. This reminds me of some NRA talking points where they say guns should be allowed since you can kill people with knives anyway and then they wonder why more people are killed in the US than in most other places around the world.

“Bots exist anyway” - Yes bots exist, but their impact would be far greater. If someone is between smoking a cigarette per day and a couple packs per day, you don’t say “Well, he’ll be smoking anyway so I guess it doesn’t matter what of the two he chooses”.

“Let’s hope Blizzard develops a system to ban bots” - If Blizzard hasn’t been able to stop bots for 15 years, don’t get your hopes up that they will develop a magic algorithm for TBC Classic.

“People don’t have time for things they don’t like, so if you give them a boost they will make time for attunements etc. while they don’t have time for leveling” - How do we know that they will actually like doing attunements, or getting their pre-raid bis or farming for gold? Would they be justified in taking a shortcut for those things too if they wanted? If someone just wanted to play some arenas with epic gear to stomp some noobs would he be justified in buying carries to get that epic gear and should Blizzard make a service to cater to him? Why is leveling the thing that’s just ok to skip?

I hate the notion that because of mage boosts there are no groups for dungeons and it’s justifiable to new players to not have to do that content. First of all I’ve leveled multiple characters to 60 without a boost. I’ve always seen groups being formed for the popular dungeons, DM, SM, ZF, BRD etc. You might not get things like DM:W easily anymore but unless you’re on a dead server you should be able to find groups if you want them. Also even solo leveling, even when it sucks, it has meaning. It can build camaraderie through shared experiences. If I say about how getting Sida’s bag from those oozes or all those vulture gizzards from blasted lands sucked, nearly all alliance players are going to understand me and have an emotional reaction to that statement (although for some players that emotional reaction is schadenfreude because they got that bag from their first ooze). As the OP was saying in his video when trying to defend microtransactions, the main thing that differentiates classic from retail is that this is a world, not a lobby. How you get there matters. Even though the boost is supposed to be to bring in new players, I think those are the ones who should really level normally the most. If you’ve leveled to max before then it’s not going to have too much of an impact on you to do it again. But going through that rite of passage at least once helps you connect better with others that have done the same and really drives home the importance of every single character, and the difference philosophy from retail where you’re practically expected to have lots of alts and everything is designed to accommodate for that fact in the first place.

Also to address a point from your posts here.

Now, I don’t know if I can trust that statement since you say in the video that you are playing more retail while here you claim “I’m more of a classic guy tho”, but if that’s true you’re missing a golden opportunity. Instead of having 10 people buy boosts, have those 10 people level together. You don’t care about how easy it is to find a dungeon group in your server when you can make 2 groups just with friends. If anything, the fact that 10 people who could have experienced the leveling process together are buying boosts instead is one of the better anti-booster arguments made.

3 Likes
96

So u say 10 ppl who DONT want to play classic SHOULD play classic just so they can play TBC?
Im rly a pro-boost-guy. Mainly because (in MY OPINION) leveling in classic is terrible. But i rly dont understand why ppl are so against skipping old content? And classic IS old content for TBC-Servers. Its 1 boost per account ONLY for TBC-Servers and a char with level 58 and green crap gear. So whats the big point here?

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The big more objective point is that having 1 boost per account even if it’s only for TBC servers and with green crap gear, will make botting much much more profitable since they can get straight to the gold making part, there will be no one to report them while leveling and even if they get caught they can use a boost in another account since they can get straight to the gold making part.

The more subjective part (aka my opinion) is that going through that leveling experience, even if it sucks at times is what makes you invested in your character and makes the enjoyment when you get gear or hit a new milestone that much more bigger. Also my point was that even if normally the classic experience is terrible, when you’re doing it with friends it shouldn’t be. Normally I hate spamming dungeons and all my characters I leveled mostly by questing. Still, I am looking forward to spamming dungeons in a really degenerate manner with my guildmates when TBC launches.

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The BIG botting-industry will NEVER have a problem with having enough max-level-characters, trust me. I doubt they will even use a boost for real money, when they can just boost houndreds of chars with other bots.

Yeah and thats it: YOUR opinion. No offense here. But there are a lot of ppl out there who DONT feel this way. For example: Me. I hate pretty much every part of classic leveling phase, with our without friends: class balance, quest design, running from A to B 50% of the time, and so on.
I found a nice quote in an other thread here:

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I’m not going to respond to all the fallacy statements you just pronounced.
I never EVER said that i play more retail than classic.
I make more VIDEOS about retail pvp because, those videos have little bit more sence than how to get R14 or how to form a premade on classic etc.

I am more of a pvp guy, but I do like classic leveling, classic raiding and classic dungeons.
Stop trying to shove statements and categorise me into a point where you will say ‘’ Go back to retail’’, because i see it coming from miles away.

If you read the forum post, you will see that i’ve explained my video plenty of times.
Also, I didn’t make a video with views from both sides, since i feel there is plenty of videos for that ( Ballad of the level boost comes in to my mind, altough this video is a little bias for being a 2-side story).
I made the video to share an OPINION, with also raising awareness to the fact that there is alot more problems in classic at this very moment before we could even talk about the boost.
Did you watch the whole video? Did you read the whole forum post? Because I clearly stated, multiple times, that I would be against the boost if the boosting meta didn’t exist.

Your personal experience with the game ( finding groups to level with) is perfectly fine, but I’ve played Phase 1 through 6, and you need to admit it ( or not i don’t care) that Phase 1 was the most awesome experience to level through, and that Phase 3-6 is a nightmare for people having only 2/3 hours to play per day ( and that’s alot for alot of people).

Why can’t people relate to the fact, that it is not because of laziness or instant gratifications that people don’t want to level. It is because, they genuinly, don’t like VANILLA, but like TBC content more.
1-58 even with revamped talents etc, ISN’T tbc content.

Why can’t people understand that, the fact that mage boosting ( pala boosting inc) exists, reduces the amount of new people coming to the game?
I would say now with the TBC announcement, you have a little ressurgence of people alting and rerolling. But not everyone follows wow daily, they give a chance and go if they don’t like the new player experience.

Why do I know why they like attunements /raids/ dungeons / grinding but not leveling 1-58? Because they played TBC when it was released or on private servers.

I like that you have taken the time to answer, but i dislike the fact how fallacious your comment is towards my take. It is your right to dislike the boost ( and nowhere did i say that you needed to change your stance), but it is my right to state the contrary. Again, I felt like there was too much talk about the boost, and not enough about the actual AND FACTUAL state of the game. We are all talking about future this future that, and not about the state the servers are.

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Look, people are trying to force classic leveling on people liking only TBC and really ONLY tbc.
I like both, and i also like WOTLK and garan fkin teed they will also offer a lvl 68 boost except for DK’s blablabla, because people DONT WANT to get forced into things they DONT like.

It is hard to debate with people that talk about bots, because they don’t know that the main problems of bots, is the playerbase being c***s and buy those golds, doing GBID runs, Going for these Mage boosting, Doing the mage boosting themselves accepting gold from a player that bought gold on any shady website.

Opinions and What-If’s are not constructive arguments for a discussion, so why are people acting like they are?

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I don’t have anything against people who play retail, the reason I said it is because you seem to flip flop whenever it seems beneficial. Have you watched your own video? At 15:19 you say “Retail is maybe more competitive, which is why I’m playing more retail at the moment”

Speaking about changing opinions to suit your argument.

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gg ma man, i told you ^^