My bad then. My apologises too.
I am allways on my own trying to fight my way trough everything ,i dont mind that at all i just love to play and enjoy the awesome story of world of warcraft.
When you play like that you dont need boosts or whatever.
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Right. You did read that those are gold prices? And are we really dealing with people spending in excess of £200 just for a chance of getting some good gear?
I dislike the token immensely, but, its just not logical to say so many people are chucking rl cash at these things. If anything the large acclimatised gold means these things do go on but then we can look at the systems in place that force players into buying.
Yes we do. I personaly know at least 3 ppl that bought gold. Theres a limit of 10 tokens per month btw but still ppl buy lots of gold. They even create different accounts just to akip the limit ans buy more.
In Pvp purchasing of boosts is a legitimate issue not because of the resultant gear of the boostee but rather the fact that geared glads blight the lower bracket whilst boosting throwing off the MMR system.
The fact a clueless Andy has good gear means they ain’t gonna stomp jack in the bracket they end up in. Them “stomping” in random BGs is a complete non point. I don’t sincerely believe people will buy boosts for say 1.8 gear only so they can rank their rating to stomp in low brackets. I just don’t see that. The issue is the means by which it is done (the glads in the low bracket)
Boosting in pve is a non issue as it’s a non competitive environment anyway. Regarding places it’s very easy if one uses RIO or even does a bit of inspecting to detect whether the guy applying was boosted or not.
These people literally pay money to get gear for the sake of it, to make the trivial content they do easier. The only people whom use pve boosting properly are Alts of boosters.
The ones who pay it otherwise are fools IMO. It will show on RIO, you win nothing but pixels that become redundant next patch and will still lose out on group places to people with the experience who have done it properly, so you’ve skipped nothing. You’ve just bought gear that is essentially useless regarding pve because in content where it matters people WILL inspect closely to see whether you’re the real deal. The “whatever” ilevel you get through buying KSM is worthless because there will always be guys and gals with similar ilevel but way more runs behind them as they climbed, they’re instantly more attractive, they get the spots. A guy with KSM with a whopping 16 keys run total just isn’t that attractive. It isn’t the meal ticket people think it is because it screams “my backside was carried hard”. You’d be needing to pay obscene amounts of gold to get the amount of runs required before people stop viewing you as a boosted joe with your KSM.
I mean I wouldn’t pay that money just to make my dailies a bit quicker. But hey it’s their money. They wanna do it to “feel done” despite doing bugger all in the game they can be my guest.
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Well more power to them if they’ve got that cash frankly, I don’t believe average Joe is doing these things at all.
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Average joe isn’t.
You need to spend over 200 quid to get the keys for KSM alone, and that’s worthless. People won’t invite you for 15+ keys in Pugland when they see you only got a one timed 15 of each key and that’s it. It screams “I was boosted”.
You’d be needing way more keys run at that level to dispel this illusion, probably minimum triple the money spent, possibly more.
Because even if you boosted to get these extra runs, people can see who they were run with and can see if it’s “the same crew” who got you the first timed keys. If it is, they will assume boosting rather than “push team” especially if your entry into the team (and very first keys being run) were with these people at a +15 level.
People don’t join a “push team” from the void, with no prior key experience, at +15. It just doesn’t happen that often shy of someone maybe being a high end heroic/mythic raider and deciding to do keys with their mates, but even then you’d see evidence of them pushing the keys up to start out their push.
So if someone’s very first key is a +15 and they’re applying to pug rather than running in a closed team, it’s pretty guaranteed they boosted. Even if you’re an awesome raider with like 249 ilevel, people just won’t invite you into a +15 with zero score.
Beyond the valor upgrades buying KSM is a complete waste of time.
I’m from the day before yesterday. Real Money - buy boost/gold from sellers - Get boost pvp/pve - best gear - win.
Yeah, that challenger player with his shining duelist gear is now going from 1500 to 1700 lol. Gear is not enough to make a challenger a gladiator or even a duelist. Maybe he can grind his way to rival, but he hasn’t exactly won anything and is forced everytime to buy a boost because he’s going to get kicked everytime becayse his experience doesn’t match his skill.
The only reason boosting is annoying in pvp is because you find glads or boosted players at lower ratings making the game unpleasant for other players.
Same goes for pve. Buy token–>Get golds–>Pay a full carry–>Get a couple of pieces and a nice achievement–>Get kicked from the other groups because you don’t have the skill–>The achievement becomes useless–>Character becomes useless unless you boost again–>Win nothing.
Yes, WoW Tokens have made the game Pay to Win, but honestly it doesn’t affect me. I’ve always bought my WoW Tokens with the little ingame gold I can scrunge up each month and honestly I don’t care WHERE my hard earned gold is going if it means I get 30more days of playtime. Buy gold with real money on boosts, BOEs and useless stuff from the BMAH, I don’t care.
I wont bother with the folly that p2w fiasco. Either everything is pay 2 win or nothing is.
Will just ask 1 thing. What do you accomplish by “proving” that WoW is pay2win.
Lets say that you have convinced me that WoW is p2w. Ok? And? Now what? What was about to happen? Should WoW server’s have been hit by lightning now?
As you can guess it = nothing happened.
If proving that WoW is p2w would change stuff. Say it becomes banned in country X guess country X doesnt allow such games and etc. or WoW could get a tax hike cause of it. Then yeah, it would be worth arguing simply cause there is a point to do so.
Right now. All this p2w debates are worthless simply because regardless which side “wins”, it doesn’t change anything. Its just debating for the sake of…debating.
As the saying goes… “The dogs bark but the caravan carries on”.
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But you don’t Win anything, you haven’t won the game.
That is not the problem, problem is people who provided those services. That is why it’s P2W in that sense.
It’s a good question to ask yourself “who are the players that would provide these services if the only LEGAL thing they can do with the gold is to get time to play the game?”
It’s not really P2W as people try to portrait it and just wrap it in a box of “that’s that and end of story” unless you are trying to hate the game.
Don’t hate the game, hate the players.
Well you’d surely have been used to boosts then? They were pretty rife during WotLK.
So, nah, ‘nowadays’ this is not a pay to win game. You’re about just over a decade out of date, 13 years to be precise, come November, to try and make that statement as if it is ‘nowadays’.
This is nothing new, just the methods may have changed.
It is rather tragic watching all these dishonest repeat quotes “WoW is p2W!!!”
Oh really? But you’re still subbed. So you think this is dishonest, but yet you’ve been supporting said dishonesty for longer than the longest sub period runs for.
That means you were OK with it before, but are only complaining about it now, because the ‘cool and brooding’ kids are doing it.
That is dishonest.
6 months is the longest sub you can buy. So anyone who is subbed now, was completely -fine- with the Token system, and because they presumably have played the game at some point between WotLK and SL, are also cool with boosting.
The Sheer hypocrisy therefore, that these people are showing, in pretending that they object to the current game based on some sort of moral principle, is complete rubbish.
Just say you don’t like Boosters? Hell, I’ll agree with you, I hate 'em. But that’s because I’ve never seen the point of them. WoW isn’t a game you can ‘win’ in that way. It’s not like the old 80’s games, where you played them off a cassette and there was a finite amount of levels. Then “Congratulations, you Win”
Yeah, well, you just went to the local computer game shop with your money from your paper round wages in hand and bought a new game, didn’t you?
That doesn’t work with modern gaming, because most of them in the MMORPG genre are sensibly set up so that you -Can’t- win the game.
If anything, these people who are -buying- boosts (As opposed to like, mates giving a mate a leg up by helping them) are actually the losers here.
Think about how devoid of reason or self respect you would have to be, to hand over real cash, convert it into a game currency, and then pay strangers to give you gratification.
Just think about that. They are using real money for a stranger to give them short term gratification.
Plus what are they winning? It’s going to be meaningless with the next patch anyway! You can’t Pay to Win in WoW, because you can’t -WIN- at WoW, I mean what are the criteria for Winning WoW?
There aren’t any. “I have an amazing Arena rating” “Cool for you, I don’t, because I simply don’t give a damn about PvP How many mounts you got?”
“Err 60?” “Medicocre, I’ve got hundreds, you’re rubbish” “I Completed this raid and got this cool item, how cool am I?” “Not very cool, I’ll probably get round to that at some point when I can be bothered” “But I did it last night! How cool is that?” “Did you get boosted for real money?” “Yeah, there was thi-” “Shut up, stop talking, you’re an embarrassment, you’ve achieved nothing.”
People who remember the older school of computer games generally aren’t going to pay for a boost, because we know that utterly it would be a completely shallow and unfulfilling experience after the initial euphoria.
“Ahah, I have Won at this Game, Because I knew a Cheat Code from a game magazine (No Internet really back then 
) to make me win! Hahah, I feel great”
Taps fingers on computer
Shouts downstairs
“Mom! Can I have another computer game?”
“We just bought you one this morning!”
“Yeaaaah but I finished it!”
Now obviously there is a difference between paying for a boost, and mate doing you a solid and helping you out, but you get the idea.
Still, fact remains, if you played between WotLK and have a 6 month or less Subscription, then complaining about boosting, or WoW being Pay to Win, is as arrant a piece of hypocrisy as can be imagined.
Because you supported a game that allowed it.
So all these people, and I mean all of them, who complain about WoW being a P2W game can climb off their high horse, because it never bothered them one damned bit, until it started to look ‘cool’ to complain about it.
Yeah, they look -so- cool…
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Well yes you do. Like literally - you win bgs and arenas easier than others on your mmr cuz of good gear. Ofc you cannot “win” wow because theres no end but you can complete milestones like raids, certain lvls of m+ (15 or 20) or destroy opponenta with same expirience in game but with much worse gear. So it is kinda winning.
But for real. Do you rly arguee about smth that you dont even know definition of?
“noun uncountable. /ˌpeɪ tə ˈwɪn/ DEFINITIONS1. in online gaming, the practice of buying in-game items that give a player a very big advantage over others.” - looks exactly like what Ive written ealier or to be more specific like current WoW. So stop with this nonsense that you dont win anything. And check definition of thinga you dont understand so next timw you wont make fool out of yourself.
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Unfortunately 2 arguments play against it.
1st. Having a 252 item is an advantage but not a huge one over 239. The adventage is not big enough for a clueless guy to beat a seasoned experienced WoW player. You can equip a random guy to the teeth with 252 but it woun’t “guarentee” a win in an areana fight or high dps charts…IF the guy is absolutely clueless about his class.
If there was an item which say “Equip this to give you +5000000% more damage to your every attack. This item can be bought only with money from the shop”. Then we may talk about pay to win. Right now, it does not. Beeing boosted does not afford a huge advantage over others.
2nd. You only buy a boost for a service. There is no guarentee that the item you are after will EVEN drop. Personal experience → Have farmed like 50 mists last season and still didn’t get the trinket. So the boostee can unload all his money but still end up with nada cause of bad luck with the rng casino. So buying a boost does NOT guarentee that you will also grow in power from every run.
So this “huge” advantage of other player are? A chance to get 252 item which the guy will be clueless on how to use anyway?
Aha…I think just buying a flask from the AH will give you a “bigger advantage” over a non flasked guy. 
Belive whatever you want. I showed you definition and you are still “oh but its not that big”. Im done here. I wont arguee with ppl that cannot figure out that they dont have right even when facts are in front of them. Enjoy the game. I wont but Im gonna stick with forums till my sub runs out in october.
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A definition which is flawed and you can twist it all you want.
What do you consider a “huge advantage” over others? An “cash shop only item” which can oneshot people alone? WoW doesn’t have that.
Ok…any advantage over somebody else?
Well in that case everything is pay2win then? If I can afford a flask from the AH then I have an advantage over somebody who doesn’t use flasks or can’t afford them?
Dang…you want to tell me that I everytime I bought a flask for the raid, I was paying2win? Oh daaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaang 
Indeed. You should listen to your own advice as well.
Show me where did I mention smth like item that allows you to oneshot. Max ilvl pvp gear will give you big adventage over ppl that didnt start ranking yet. For example in wpvp or bgs or even arenas cuz lets be honest after boost is over boosties start looaing and they end up in low rat arenas with super good gear and on that lvl it gives them adventage.
Yes because of token. You can buy token for real money and then you can buy whatever you want in game.
By uaing flask you get better stats which is advantage over someone who has lower stats.
If you bought it for token gold yes you are.
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Well then guess Wow has been pay2win from the beginning? There were gold sellers way before the token came(I think it came 6.2 or something right?).
Heck every online game is pay2win then cause every online game has its…boosting market since gold sellers and boosters are not something WoW unique only.