Fine, then i guess we don’t really have much to talk about atm then - Classic content wise xD? Post on your main going forwards, then we can talk. I do wonder why you don’t want to post on it though, for once ish?
Again, wishing everyone peace and love… its only a game at the end of the day, we all have bigger RL problems atm.
Stay safe, and definitely take care all!
You too Miylee, stay safe re this current environment; we all find ourselves in.
Yeah, but the things you are repeating are unsourced, made up and plain false.
I Agree xD
This IS my main.
Why would I do that? Posting on my Classic character would make absolutely no difference, except perhaps I’d get a few “LOL Firemaw-Horde!!!” comments. Miylee is a name I’ve used for years, I’ve posted on this toon for years, I will continue to post on this toon for years. She is my posting avatar.
Avoiding people in my speciality. My place of work is still open though.
Yeah, no. I’ve shown Burton threads from Nostalrious proving that such a system was attempted.
You people have shown me nothing, you’ve simply repeated “no i want to pug in battlegrounds and still be able to compete”. No matter how many times I’ve told you of consequences, you’ve repeated “nu uh, we can fix those too!”
Then when I offer you a solution to your “i wanna pug” problem, a solution that offers NO consequences at all, you ignore it. You ignored it because my solution also offered you no reward. It’s funny that you all claim to want fun, but also want the same rewards as the people actually trying to earn them.
Of all the people here, you are the worst. Burton and Digi just want to be able to chill out and play without having to jump into discord with strangers. Operations is the same, albeit more aggressive. You though? You want to reshape the game to fit your memories. You think altering the game to stop people from playing the way they are now will force them to play how you want, to play like the inexperienced players of old.
You are delusional, your vision of Vanilla will never come to be.
You can recreate old games, you can’t relive old memories, and you are living proof of everything that the Classic naysayers ever said.
You know exactly what ‘main’ i was referring too?
To clarify… use your main Classic Character going forwards Miylee.
All you have ever said is “nostalrius did it” and “I thought it was bad”. Literally zero details. No details about how it was implemented, no details about what happened other than some vague “bots and AFKers xD”. You literally have nothing to bring to the discussion.
No one is trying to shape vanilla to their memory though, that’s just you misrepresenting the situation (which seems to be your go-to tactic). It’s just a fact that the current level of premade abuse was never a thing in vanilla and it completely takes out a huge part of what made vanilla vanilla: pug battlegrounds. You can keep denying the earth is a spheroid all you want, but that doesn’t make it flat. It just makes you wrong.
To Clarify… No.
I’ve also provided the link to an old forum wherein arguments were taking place. Would there be arguments if you got your magic “everyone is happy” ending? No. The misery was shifted to other people, and the ability for PVP honor bots to be competitive again was brought back.
You are. You’ve literally said time and time and time again “changes are good if they make the game like Vanilla”. You refuse to accept that your memory and experience of Vanilla differ from somebody else’s.
A huge part of what made Vanilla fun FOR ME
I spent years on the wow forums, I’ve seen every single “please give us Vanilla servers” thread, I’ve seen everybody talking about the pros of vanilla, what they loved and what they hated.
Most came to the concensus that they love the community, that they loved having to group up with people and work together.
Not one single person ever said “I loved signing up for a game by myself and ignoring my team and friends”.
Funny. Denial and delusion are your traits, not mine.
My bad qualities are stubbornness and lack of tolerance towards things that I deem wrong. I don’t sit here saying “no no no no this will work because i want it to because vanilla was different”. I sit here saying “No, changes are what lead us to retail. Changes to Classic have been bad. Players don’t react the way you want them to, you’re not going to get your happy ending”.
Okay, then i will bottom line it for you Miylee. I will not read any more of your reply other then the quoted, because i actually want a direct reply to my question on your main classic char? I think you and someone else here replying on this forum are the same poster/same account?
Now, you can actually call me out and prove me wrong? If you do (within 5 ish mins) i will gladly say i am wrong. I Have no problem in admitting i’m wrong
Post on your main classic char within 5 mins of this comment plz? Because i know you are watching atm?
People not reading what I’m saying is nothing new to me.
And I don’t care if you think me and Bodie are one and the same. People can actually share the same views, you know.
I definitely agree on the last part of your comment. Everyone do have different options, that’s what makes the human race so special imho.
But you still have NOT answered my question, just ‘sidestepped’ it? 
I’ve answered you multiple times, I’m not posting on my Classic character. Miylee is my forum poster.
Do you actually think somebody as stubborn as me is really going to change a posting character just so you can say “oh you’re not Bodiesan, guess I was wrong”.
I never named names Miylee? You are making the comparison, not me? Again, i will ask for you to post on your MAIN CLASSIC Character within 5 mins of my response?
Do you really have to?
And again, no.
“Do you really have to?”
We will call it a day dude.
Stay safe bro, seriously.
Edit* If im wrong about this; then i will whole heartily hold my hands up and apologise. The fact you wont post on your Main makes me very sceptical tbh.
The thread in question is just some people yelling at eachother about different systems that are mostly not relevant to classic. It’s almost entirely about the effects of “multiqueue” which is not relevant to classic because in classic the retail “multiqueue” is used and your queues for other battlegrounds are paused while you are in a battleground.
It’s also about how those things interact with dodging premades which is not relevant to classic either because that was fixed.
When it comes to the relevant discussion about split premade/solo queue it also seems like plenty of people in that thread think the system that matched premades against eachother is a good idea, so it doesn’t even really fully support your argument. When Borton pointed this out to you, you just said “I ignore that part because reasons, and I already showed you why you are wrong” or something along those lines.
Everyone can review this at https://forum.nostalrius.org/viewtopic.php?f=46&t=30232
Here is where you misrepresent what I’m saying to make it sound like the scary changes-will-lead-to-retail boogyman (which is literally your only argument). It’s not about my memory or anyones memory. It’s about the cold hard fact that in vanilla the vast majority of battlegrounds were pug vs pug. Anyone who played vanilla knows this to be true. Pug games were a huge part of the gameplay experience in vanilla.
It’s not relevant what was fun to me or anyone else, the reality is that pvp in classic looks nothing at all like pvp in vanilla. That is the argument for a change, because any change that brings pvp closer to what it was like in vanilla will make classic a better clone of vanilla. Even if you were to assume the majority of that thread supports your conclusion (they don’t) then it’s still not directly applicable to classic because the technical circumstances are vastly different.
This is yet another example of you misrepresenting the reality. pug battlegrounds aren’t magically solo battlegrounds. Players who play in pugs don’t ignore their team and a pug queue will not turn battlegrounds or this game into a singleplayer game.
I didn’t play Vanilla retail myself but I don’t think this is an extraordinary claim, so i accept it. There was probably way less premades in Vanilla retail as people claim.
But what people suggest would just replace one unauthentic behaviour with a system that is unauthentic leading to a new behaviour that is even less authentic. In fact, it’s so unauthentic that it has never excited in this game ever. The consequences are unown, it has never been done; especially not with the Vanilla ranking system that is based on grind and not skill. How would it affect ranking? How would it affect botters and afk leechers? No one talks about that.
Right now we have an authentic vanilla pvp system and queue for WSG/AB. People then choose to play the game in a different way compared to Vanilla retail for various reasons.
You want to replace this authentic system with a change, something new, something unauthentic, and the result would be a behaviour that is even LESS authentic then what you are replacing, because at no point in Vanilla would pugs never faced premades like the change would lead to. And you don’t even know if it would be more fun because there would be other changes you don’t think about, for example, less honor and rep probably. Maybe a ranking lock at rank 6 or something. Stuff like that, you don’t know and you have no control over that. Blizzard would probably manage to make puggin feel pointless and boring. And then people would complain about that and ask for changes and now they can use the other change as an argument for their change.
And on top of this, you have my own argument that adding any change will lead to more demands for changes. If Blizzard add a change to make the game “fair” and “more fun” that change would validate all other changes people ask for and that change would be used as an argument forever for everything. It would make the game feel like retail again where anyone can make any kind of stupid suggestion and it’s all valid somehow.
And on top of this, people will play less premades in later phases when most people are done ranking. So I predict that the problem for puggers will solve itself. I am looking forward to pug some BGs in my T2.5 gear and oneshoot people. Will be fun. I would not be surprised if people start to complain about the insane burst we will see soon in pvp. I bet people will ask for changes for that also.
Yes, I know exactly how this board works.
Hey would you look at that, both me and bodie were typing at the same time.
Ever get that feeling of de ja vu? That’s exactly what this board is.
It doesn’t matter what plenty of people think. Plenty of people through Garrisons would be good. Plenty of people thought that trying to seperate each spec from it’s class would be good. Plenty of people through LFR would be good.
You people can’t seperate what’s “fun” and what’s actually healthy. You could ask a child what they want for breakfast and they’d say cake, would you allow your child to have a diet of cake?
That’s what I said, is it? I could have swore I said “I linked the thread to prove that private servers actually did try seperate queues”.
Previously, Burton (not Borton) said that private servers didn’t try seperate queues and I was making it up.
The result to the seperate queues as Chaos.
I’m not mis-representing what you’re saying, you aboslute oath. You LITERALLY said, WORD FOR WORD: “Changes are good if they make the game feel more like Vanilla”.
You’ve said that several times.
Yes, it is. Your experience of Vanilla wasn’t the same as everybody else’s. Each person experienced things differently.
Yes, and in Vanilla, the vast majority of guilds never touched Naxx. Most guilds took months clearly Molten Core, most people took months levelling to 60.
Notice any difference? This isn’t Vanilla
This is Classic, a recreation of a game lost to time. It isn’t a time machine, it isn’t a fresh game that people have no knowledge of. It’s an old game that people know off the back of their hands, it’s an old game that people not play efficiently.
Falling through the ground was a huge experience in Vanilla, I don’t see that happening here.
Neither does raiding or farming, so that’s a redundant point. Think everybody in Vanilla stocked up on protection potions? Think everybody in Vanilla took Eningeering? No, they didn’t.
It’s a false argument. You’re not getting Vanilla back and nothing you do will change the game to be more like Vanilla.
Seperate queues means you’re going to see a hell of a lot more AFKers and bots than you saw in Vanilla.
It doesn’t matter what people support. People browse forums to complain, that’s what forums have always been for.
The results of Nostalrius’s experiment had nothing to do with technical circumstances, it was entirely to do with the player base. The same playerbase that are here.
No, it’s not.
False. Pug battlegrounds will alter the honor farm methods. They will once again bring back Alliance-only premades, and they’ll make it so it’s more efficient to play by yourself than with friends.
Given the fast queues for Alliance players, people will have open massive cross-server discords where they’ll jump in with one another when they recognise each others names, essentially creating makeshift premades. If you think players wont do whatever they possibly can to get an advantage, you’re as delusional as I think you are.
The ONLY way Blizzard could get a solo queue to work is if the games were split between rewards and no rewards.
Reward queue would work like it does now: Sign up by yourself or with friends and play as normal.
No reward queue: Sign up solo only, play for fun.
You want fun, right? You definitely want your fun “vanilla” experience and to not try and alter the game board to suit yourself, right?
You’re still just ignoring reality and substituting your own imagination. I have sufficiently shown that you have no real argument to anyone willing to listen and I’ll leave it at that because you will obviously not respond to reason.
I am going to quote all of your text because i think you have a valid response in parts.
Bodiesan, i get it i do, really! To try explain what was ‘vanilla/re classic content’ back then is kind of hard for PvP imho. Especially for ppl that have never experienced the original version of the game in this situation. What i will say - is times have definitely changed, from the inception of vanilla (and what Blizzard wanted to achieve back then).
I CAN definitively say that the way that the current BG’s meta is (AB/WSG specially at this state… is 100% what Blizzard DID not intend.
Now i’m not trying to take anyway the ‘No Changes’ line. i do actually agree with it. BUT… this wasn’t how it ‘played’ out for me (or anyone else PvP’in back in the day). I Also rolled horde - so i had the ‘hard end of the stick’ back then.
I remember 5+ hours of an AV, that was EPIC btw. I also remember WSG/AB premades. But its totally unrealistic to now in this day and age walk into ‘back peddling’ Easy Mode player premades 90+ % of the time. Ranks took a LOT of hard graft back then, im also talking the top ranks.
AV was working as intended, and yeah, i read your post about alliance starting the moaning… but we both know that there was way too much horde QQ for that ‘fix’ to be made initially from Blizzards perspective. Blizz fixed the alliance queue system secondary to that main fix as they knew it was an issue, then done it all in one go.
All i am asking for… is ONE single fix to premades in BG’s. I get premades, but i do not get the fact that ppl want an easy path to top ranks.
You’ve done nothing of the sort. You’ve disrearded everything that anybody has ever said to you and sat in your own little “but this isn’t Vanilla” bubble.
And you’ve constantly tried to take the self righteous highground, as if wanting something that comes at the cost to somebody else suddenly makes you a morally better person. You’re a lot like a socialist trying to fight capitalism.
What you’re asking for is too much. You’re asking for a permanent solution to a temporary problem.
When the PVP gear is no longer BiS, less people will be premading for it. You’ll still have a few premades, but not as many as now. Instead though, you’re going to have people geared to the teeth one-shotting you.
And no, premading isn’t actually “easy”. Premades still have to be good if they want to win, they dont get a 50% increased health and damage buff when playing with friends.