That was never her intention. You are making headcanon. What you are honestly proposing here is that Sylvanas would risk the entire battle just to test one guy’s loyalty. You are making her out to be dumber than what I proposed.
That was literally the plan from the start. That is the whole reason they invaded. In order to not Accept that was Sylvanas did was dumb, you are arguing that her entire plan was dumb!
No, she did that because she had no contingency plan. She even said she did not predict this outcome. Learn the lore please.
Imagine there still being an undercity.
And the Horde goes “Well, Undercity is safe, to Silvermoon it is!”
How about you do it? He was on board for the war, and Sylvanas herself stated the Zandalari had joined them at the start of 8.1.
Blighted Gilneas against Garrosh’ orders, abandoned the Horde during Legion, burned Teldrassil without informing the other Horde leaders etc. She is far worse. Baine and Saurfang are trying to stop that.
Its just Sylvanas is morally ugly character. Horde is not internally evil, thats why Saurfang and Baine happened.
I like Baine 10x more for this. If you dont like something you act to change it, unlike “muh Honor” so far.
Vol’jin betrayed his warchief as well on paper, no one hated him for that.
Without that type of Horde where there is generally them type of people/the honorable side then there is no reason as to why the Alliance wouldn’t wipe out the Horde as they continue to constantly be evil.
And no, Sylvanas has been actively ruining the Horde from what is should be and for me at least permanently tainted the Horde as a concept. I highly doubt many people like the current direction in which the Horde has gone in as not only has it been done before but it has been pushed further than the last time.
Voljin didn’t afraid to say it to Garrosh’s face, Baine not only is not able to call Sylvanas for Mac’Gora, he does all his schemes secretly, just for Sylvanas to never know
He’s just a coward who forgot things like Tauraho when helping the Alliance
Because Horde is not just Sylvanas-by doing this he hurts all the Horde
Or you think after Alliance victory they will not want to gdt all the Ashenvale? Or Azhara?
This kind of actions is just a treachery, even though I hate Sylvanas too
“Is he the BOMB THIS TIME?!”
Damn, that’s a powerful line. I love that they portray Jaina as an actual human, with traumas from the things she’s been through.
I also loved Baine in this cinematic. What a compassionate and empathic man
She had the battle won. Horde was on the shores of Darkshore. And yes, maybe its a headcannon, but thats how it see it, you see it as stupid move. Difference between us two. Then call it what it was without being bias.
Im arguing that for her it does not matter the outcome, she dealt the first blow and provoked the war. Her plan was to make Kalimdor Horde dominated and she would achieve it with any outcome. But later made her morally wrong.
Your opinion much?
Sadly I would imagine Teldrassil instead of Lordaeron.
Yeah with your brilliant plan, blight would have prevented that.
Yet not having Zandalari fleet. Also Rastakhan was much more untrustworthy towards Horde then his daughter.
Edit: Tricking whole Alliance and Night Elf armies and securing an easy win in coming battle.
Horde and Alliance are most Nations of this world and the most powerful ones.
the Neutral Factions are not a threat to either side without either sides support.
They got their military power in Legion from the factions.
Why don’t people understand this?
Most Neutral factions are not military power houses…
Ugh… why so many comparisons… Do you expect all the characters to behave same way and have their b@lls dragging on the floor. Saurfang did stand against her from the start and see where he ended up? Alone.
And aint nobody forgetting anything. Sylvanas is more at-hand problem then old hatreds. No one wanted this war, except Sylvanas.
Wait… Didn’t she blight Gilneas against Garrosh’s orders though? I remember from the Worgen questline where an undead approaches her in the Greymane Manor and asks her if they’re gonna use the blight, which Sylvanas replies with “Of course you fool!”
Or something along those lines. It’s a long, long time since I did that questline though, so I might be wrong.
Actually, everything she said was correct. Sylvanas was forbidden from using the Blight after Wrathgate. She burned Teldrassil in a spur of the moment decision that had zero consultation with anyone else. She has brought the Horde closer to destruction than Garrosh and his ‘orc purism’ ever did.
Wonder why they felt like giving this moment a fully fledged cinematic, but left both Rastakhan funeral and Baines incarceration as some lame machinima. Those were far more pivotal events.
I’m personally tired of having Jaina staring in her 10th cinematic in this expansion…
Regarding its content, sorry, but it failed to make me empathise with Jaina.
I’m really sick of “Here’s Jaina. She’s real sad and it’s all your fault” constantly coming up in Horde questing.
Specially after stuff like Dazar’alor.
It was a nicely done cinematic, and Derek (and the ship!) were some neat narrative assets.
But couldn’t care less about the Cow right now. This dude has just decided to openly nullify whatever could be salvaged from the war campaign, and did so in deference for the leader that has just raided and killed the Horde newest ally.
I’m sure that Blizzard will end up forcing a scenario that has us dealing with a Garrosh 2.0 with the Forsaken being batted out of the story like orcs were in MoP, but for as long as I personally have the choice to pick the opposite side of these quests, I’ll do so.
Because even if I’m not as blind as to not see how the abrasiveness or Sylvanas rule might be detrimental and clashing with some relevant Horde values, being morally challenged is a thousand times better than a defeatist mindset that has the ‘honourable’ side sneaking behind the factions back and rendering Horde deaths as worthless.
Or causing extra ones down the road.
Like, how are the Zandalari supposed to feel when discovering that their newfound allies go behind their back doing these sort of things for the ones that have just killed their king?
And what’s the point of a war story that the Horde is both losing and feeling horrible about??
Edit: And I’ve consulted a few friends that main Tauren and the consensus still seems to be about Baine being portrayed as a rather weak and sad character that lacks spine/courage to actually do something useful. I get that Golden likes to portray him as this fluffy teddy bear you should hug and comfort. But the character needs decisiveness and resolve.
Polls regarding Horde player feelings about him, still have his character rather low for the Warchief role.
The alternate choice was to whittle her troops down to the last man in what was an absolute meat-grinder of a conflict, while the blight is despicable Garrosh was intentionally trying to weaken the forsaken.
Because you are blind to see from where Baine is coming from. For Sylvanas the ends justify the means. But not for Baine or rest of the Horde heroes.
Yes it was Hordes chance to swing the tide, but at what cost? By repeating 2nd Theramore? Baine had been there and had seen the devastation of treacherous plan (exactly what Jaina refers to in cinematic). Horde has suffered by the hands of a tyrant and amoral Warchiefs, no one wanta to go through that again. When Azeroth is dying Sylvanas provokes war.
Crap. Garrosh was sending her troops into the meat-grinder during the wall assault. After the confrontation they had, she said she will do it her way. Once she failed, she went all blight happy about it.
It is also really funny to me that everything goes, because the enemy might be dangerous.
“Poor Sylvanas, the Gilneans made her do it! THEY HAD IT COMING!”
bonus facts:
1.She mostly drove away the civilians. The military remained behind.
2. She pretty much blighted half the country, instead of carefully applying it on a smaller tactical scale.
The eyes of Hellscream are upon you more than any other.
Do you honestly think Garrosh would have let the Forsaken back out of the conflict/take defeat? I don’t disagree with your post but Garrosh was very victory by any means (which also runs in tandem with the Forsaken/Windrunner’s own attitude). The Forsaken would have likely used it anyway but there will always remain the element of “Garrosh wants his results”.
What are you actually chatting? Don’t put words into my mouth, my post was focusing on Garrosh’ own attitude towards the conflict and the Forsaken.
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