Brigante I love your posts. They show many things in other perspectives 
You’ve got me interested here.
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All the respect for my fellow Kaldorei fans, but I feel like alot of the threads lately are just complaining for the sake of it.
As stated before, we got in one patch more then the Darkspear Trolls, Gnomes, Worgens and Taurens combined ever got in World of Warcraft.
Lets just await and see what 8.2 brings us before we start complain again!
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I think its an RP perspective, I’ve done tabletop RP for 32 years, LARP for 26 years, and played Wow for about 10, I can get behind different characters and their motivation. I just always post on my Horde main because a) he’s GM of my guild, so I am more than often on him, and b) I like being transparent in who I am and what I am saying.
I mean -None- of my characters are happy about what happened to the Night Elves.
Brigante Summerisle is under suspicion because he and his Dragonhawk riders flew to rescue civilians, specifically children from the burning tree, even though alliance shot at them. He is firmly on Team Saurfang in this matter. He is however, a patriot, and stands by his Regent Lord. For now…
Nabaal absolutely deplores the loss of life, he is a gentle soul, for all that he is a hulking Vindicator, and now believes that Sylvanas is beyond redemption, he served with the Shattered Sun Offensive, so knows that not all Horde are ‘Evil’, but this time they have gone too far.
Keanagh Moonspear doesn’t -care- about the morality of the War, he was a Druid of the Cenarion Circle, but he has disavowed that now, he cannot stand by and be neutral when such atrocities happen, he -is- one of those Night Elf Terrors of Darkshore, one of those Druids who now rips apart any Horde he sees, nature, Red in Tooth and Claw.
Gallery Fitzjinx has started filing the bullets for his sniper rifle. Horde want to play hardball? He’ll play hardball. They’ll soon learn the only worse thing than a sniper, is a sniper with dum-dum bullets. Only thing worse than that? A Sniper with dum-dum bullets who is of his nation’s special forces who is so small you can overlook them. He learned lessons the hard way in the Deep Black of Gnomeregan.
I don’t think I have any characters, in fact, who are actually Pro- what Sylvanas did, and many who oppose them violently, or at least morally. I mean it was a clear act of atrocity, there is no whitewashing that. Equally, however, the constant victim complex gets old, especially when we see that the Night Elves themselves are not taking this lying down, but have gone back to their roots, which surely was the thing people were complaining about them not doing?
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Thanks for agreeing with me. It is illogical that the Horde can even be standing without crumbling from both the inside and outside. Your faction survives because Blizzard allows them to, and writing has to be based on the fact that your faction has to survive for balance. We can see this throughout the game. Murder a bunch of Kirin Tor mages in Silverpine? No sure they are cool with it. Mass murdering civilians/innocents while blight/plaguing the land and letting various Scourge forces to join your faction? Naaa the AC are cool with it. Mass Azeriting mining which is directly killing the planet? Naaa ER are fine with it. Capturing and experimenting on Death Knights because they couldn’t win a battle for you? Naaa EB are cool with it. Mass destruction of forests, the genocide of the Night Elves and plaguing the lands? Naaa CC are fine with it all good.
You telling me that it isn’t some sort of Horde favouritism which is keeping the Horde alive and has done so for some time?
I try to keep neutral about this faction bias bs but I really can’t help myself when arguing against people like you.
Yes my Bois are special to me <3. They help me call sh*t out when they don’t need to.
You just play the part so well.
Well, your first entry into this thread was talking to Призраклеса in regards to Night Elves about the dying race, trying to compare the Forsaken and Night Elves lost the same. So yes you opened yourself up to this discussion and now you tried to pin it all on the “Night Elf Whine” and trying to leave without actually discussing anything, just ignoring it.
Now you are back here after I called you out.
You are oversimplifying the entire thread at this point. Regardless you opened it up to that, I further commented. You responded with the following :
Yes there is! A Vastly outnumbering force attacked by surprise with a defined route of march, with the intention of not necessarily holding territory, but getting to a specific location as fast as possible, they were stymied and delayed at almost every juncture.
I carried on and gave you a reason why and explaining why X and Y makes no sense and you got salty and pinned it to Night Elf whining before quitting. If you don’t want to argue it then fine, sure whatever just go. But don’t try and make it out to be something which is completely false. You just come across being a child.
Not all of us can be satisfied with coming up with our own headcanon/custom scenario on who/what and why it happened. Nor can them people such as myself just simply drop the fact that their favorite race who has been slapped from time to time now pushed into the dirt even further and people such as yourself saying it is fine and we are just whining.
And I do agree to a certain extent that the Night Elven “whine” about how their race has been treated is becoming to much. But don’t pin everything about Night Elves on “whine” such as you tried to do here. I also fully agree with Blizzard not having some anti-Night Elf cult in their writing department. But over the course of WoW how they have been protrayed then it is hard to say firmly that they are at the very least not compentent enough to write the Night Elves so that they can be more than just to make the Horde look strong.
“Oh wow Garrosh almost pushed the Night Elves out of Ashenvale, look how strong the Horde is under him”
"Oh wow Varian just showed this 10,000+ year old Night Elven leader patience and knowing when to attack, defend and use XYZ to your advantage. What a brillant leader Varian is.
“Oh wow Sylvanas has pushed the Night Elves to the brink of destruction, look at how smart, brillant and a master-tactian she is.”
“Oh wow Anduin told the same 10,000 year old leader the Hordes plans on how to defeat the Alliance by divide and conquer and Tyrande agrees with him, before in 8.1 going back on what she has just said to solo take Darkshore.”
You get the point… I hope.
You’re implying it, either that or compared to the Forsaken that it isn’t that bad. If you actually knew how bad this was then you wouldn’t whitewash every time someone mentions the Night Elves in BfA to whining.
Lore/story inconsistencies, several sources claiming different things, plot holes, characters and people acting stupidly. And all in a space of 3 weeks. Normally retcons and sorts takes years to happen, when new information comes out. This was in a matter of weeks.
Take Saurfangs reaction to the Tree being burnt down, he does the following :
Elegy/Good War - He sits down at the beach with some of the other soldiers watching the horror unfold
In-game - He just walks off with Sylvanas without saying anything.
Old Soldier Cinematic - He confront Sylvanas about what she has just done.
Warbringers - He is nowhere to be found as Sylvanas stands alone watching the tree burn.
4 different version, sure you can patch them altogether, it will come out looking worse than a abombanation. But I guess you could make it work if you are willing to accept Saurfang just feels like doing all 4.
How about what happened in Ashenvale?
In-game and Wowpedia states that all of Ashenvale was taken by the Horde and no soldier or civilian was spared.
Elegy/Good war and War effort states that it was just a blitz through Ashenvale with most of the outposts able to hold off the attack.
Not like every Night Elves in Ashenvale dying in one scource or most of them living in another is a big thing right?
These are just 2 off the top of my head. Do you see why it is bad now, argubly for many one of the worst?
Constantly comparing it to the Forsaken in the SoL. How both sides have lost cities etc… Yes if you believe that then you are downplaying what the Burning of Teldrassil/WoT really is.
Yes, but you are using the fact that the Alliance is winning to say that there is no bias to the Horde.
So go on please, characterise this statement.
I don’t get what you mean by this, so I will rephrase what I have put.
There is good and bad writing on both sides of this faction war. Your side is only standing because the Horde needs to be a faction and thus other nations, races, neutral orgnisastions and so on don’t do anything to punish you from your actions.
I have already listed a lot when responding to Zarao’s comment above so just read that part again if you want updating.
The Alliance mining it is a direct caused by the Horde doing it. The Horde cannot be allowed to have such an advantage and if no one else will stop them because then the Alliance has to. Yes it is wrong for the Alliance to do it but it is necessary for the survival of them and the planet at this point.
Welcome to WoW xd.
You responded to it thus allowing yourself to be opened up to it.
Bias doesn’t always come in the form of winning, please understand that already.
Every race, faction and neutral organisation should be aware of what Sylvanas has done. The WoT and mass genocide of the Night Elves wouldn’t, no just can’t be kept quiet from spreading. And if people don’t understand that Azerite mining is killing the planet then Magni has done a p*ss poor job of telling everyone about it. Considering he is telling peoples such as the bloody Centar.
People should know that Sylvanas is evil by now not even being part of the factions. The same way people knew the Lich King was without getting into contact with him or either faction. This isn’t meta-knowledge only known by a few. How would you hide the plague being used from places like Gilneas, Silverpine and Hillsbrad away from the worlds eye? Killing Her own soldiers at Lordaeron and the Wrathgate from anyone beyond the 2 factions?
Her killing Garithos would be meta-knowledge because no one in game knows how he died (at least as far as I am aware). That would be a example to use. But not any of this.
Considering what the Horde is doing and how the PC is following said faction then yes, it would make little sense to give someone working for the faction which is killing the planet through Azerite mining the Heart of Azeroth. Even after Magni told them to stop but was ignored?
Like before, bending the rules to allow the Horde to get the HoA. That would be called bias towards the Horde and not the Alliance.
Do you seriously not see why this would be a issue? If the game wasn’t built around balance/gameplay mechanics? To give the Horde PC who is apart of the genocidal tyrant who’s Azerite mining is killing the planet a bad thing?
Or just “you are destroying our lands and our people thus we are gonna destroy you”. No them keep neutral by any means is stupid no matter what. They should be marching their forces to war and lifting the fighting at Ashenvale as we speak. Nor should they allow the Horde to talk through Felwood so they can use it to flank the Night Elves.
The saddest part is I can actually claim the CC has helped the Horde more for allowing them to march their forces into Felwood without trying to stop them.
How sad…
Both sides have suffered from bad writing, I have nor will ever dispute that. But the Night Elves have suffered the worst from any race in the game and argubly more than the Horde in this expansion. Both sides deserve better.
There is plenty wrong with the Alliance starting the war. Mainly this :
How would the Horde even stand a chance if the Alliance are the ones to start this war? Look at the war effort in 8.0 and Nathanos’s comment in 8.1. This is after the Horde gets the upper hand with the WoT and the bulk of Azerite mining. Now taking away this inital upper hand they have got and your faction would be done in mere months. How do you balance that exactly?
If anything the last faction war and how it started was pretty good all things considered Varian started it and Garrosh just did what he had to by invading Ashenvale because he wouldn’t let his people starve in the streets by lack of supplies. Any chances of peace were dashed by the Twilight Hammer cults and had nothing to do with Garrosh. You have everything you wanted in this, the Alliance being the ones to start this, the Horde having no choice but to do what is needed for them to survive and start the invasions. Being good and bad on both sides. You can bring up the issue you have now about the Horde somehow being able to stand up to the Alliance (even with the throwaway line of “the Alliance didn’t commit fully to the war until the bombing of Theramore” but still, the execution of the war was handled far better than what we have now.).
The reason why miners getting killed set off an argument wasn’t the idea of it, it was the fact that people said this is what caused it. Skirmishes happen all the time between either side through the entire games lifecycle.
Furthermore Anduin as a character would have to be pushed to the limit to start a war. And ultimately no one but Sylvanas wanted this war and had to convince everyone that it was needed.
And I can make the argument that the Alliance is just a plot device to once again make you question what it means to be Horde as most of the interesting stuff is related to the Horde while we are just the “white knights” here to save the day and let you off… Again.
That is up to you, perhaps if you knock off the whine part whenever you encounter a someone posting a Night Elf comment at you then we could get somewhere, otherwise we can just go back to slapping each other if you want.
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I’ll put it bluntly: I think that arguing that Blizzard is favouring the Horde by not writing a story that utterly destroys the faction, is very, very stupid.
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And what part of your faction will be destroyed exactly? Will the Horde be permanently crippled by this? Or will they be forgiven again?
And from past experiences you end up getting more out of genocidal wars for losing than the Alliance does.
But regardless it is stupid yes, but stupid appears to be the normal among us at this point.
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All the respect for my fellow Kaldorei fans
Why though? Kaldorei fans are very toxic, and would trash all over other Alliance races if it means that Tyrande and her animal toy can rule the Alliance. This thread is the evidence. I’ve certainly never seen a Human fan open such a thread, nor a Dwarf, Gnome or even Draenei fan.
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That is Rich coming from you Arctur.
When did I ever open a thread like this one? Believe what you want, but I never started a thread centered around Horde bias, not on these levels for sure.
If you can’t handle having your race get ton of lore (War of Thorns + Elegy + Patch 8.1), go play another MMORPG. There are countless out there, some of which have no Humans at all in the spotlight. But quit literring the forums with these threads.
You’ve started plenty of threads glorifying the so called “superiority” of humans and of course… Anduin.
You argue your points in toxic and malicious ways and even when people agree with you completely you have to come for them and get so defensive over nothing. Despite them agreeing 100%.
Edit - I have never once “littered” the forums with these threads so you can retract that statement. And I’m completely fine with humans having the spotlight, as for every other race. I wish others would get more of a spotlight tbh.
By “Plenty of threads”, you mean one thread that states facts about Anduin (and has devolved into trolling because this forum is biased against Anduin, the second post of that thread literally makes fun of me even thought I stated only FACTS), one thread about Kul Tiran Mages (that were added into the game), one thread about the Shrine of the Storm, one thread about the miserable state of Derek Proudmoore and… I think that’s it? Oh, Yeah, one thread about the fact that I should be given a choice in Patch 8.1 because I don’t want to take orders from an ingrate who damns the needs of the Alliance.
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I don’t know, but i think that this:
And spinning to the point you end up concluding this:
Is the most ludicrous and absurd logic i’ve seen in a while.
“Blizzard is Horde Biased because they write stories that don’t destroy the faction”. What the hell??
Enough that Blizzard is drawing circles around the Horde and pushing them back and forth with over the top and stupid acts of evil to drive the narrative forward, stuff that almost automatically triggers immediate reprisal and tear the faction apart…but now players have to also put up with stuff players say about Blizzard being biased towards the Horde because they don’t get to also just wipe the faction? Are you for real???
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By “You” I mean Night Elf players in general. OP has opened a lot of Night Elf threads in the old forum about the same tiresome subject.
Just because i pla a night elf you instantly demonise me?
You think I am not sick of these threads too? Especially when they attract aggressive little trolls like you
Oh, I see, just because I am a Human player and am tired of the repetitive Night Elf fanbase, I must be an aggressive little troll. But thank you for proving my point even further.
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Is that why near enough every member in your faction in 8.0 was completely fine with everything Sylvanas has done to both the enemy and her own allies? Why else does your faction survive exactly if it isn’t in some way, shape or form writing from Blizzard which allows them to survive? Which allows them to go toe to toe with the Alliance when they have no right to? When they should fall apart yet stays stronger and more united which is comparable to the Alliance in 8.0?
Stupid writing is stupid writing and funnily enough both sides have suffered just as much as each other and I’d argue that the Alliance has suffered more from stupid writing compared to the Horde. Considering it took the Alliance being massive idiots for this to even kick off in the first place.
If this isn’t the case then please apply this sort of logic to the Alliance as well and see if the results are the roughly the same.
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you realize that blizzard wrote them the way they are, do you?
Blizzard wrote Sylvanas stupid evil.
Blizzard wrote Baine, Lor’themar and everyone else stupid passive.
“The Horde” did nothing. Blizzard did.
And they did so with the intent to end the faction war in some way.
I hope it doesn’t end with “Alliance wins because good”, but only because i’m a Horde player and would hate another one of those. Purely from a motivational standpoint, the “Faction War”-Addon is 3 Months old and I have 0 Motivation to dislike the Alliance. And even next Patch, when they kill Rastakhan it’s still way less then the Horde (that Blizzard wanted) deserves.
Noone i know wanted a Horde that’s like what we got. And it feels bad to get kicked by Blizz for being evil, and by other players who are as disappointed in the story as we are for not being kicked hard enough by Blizz.
We all want the same thing, a good, coherent story with believable motivations for everyone. But Blizz seems to think classic good vs. evil is morally gray…
I’m going to bed now ![:stuck_out_tongue:](https://d1bg94bbsh66ji.cloudfront.net/en/wow/images/emoji/twitter/stuck_out_tongue.png?v=6" ":stuck_out_tongue:")
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That…doesn’t make a whole lot of sense, do you mean that you are easily fooled, or that I am some sort of internet trickster God like Loki with a modem? (Again showing his age, umm, a wireless connection, or USB, I don’t know, a Trickster God with the Internet!)
But not the person who brought Night Elves into it, you admit that, yes? Also, apologies for having to actually go and do RL stuff. It did turn into a Night Elf whine thread however.
Thing is we have been here multiple times. Nothing has changed since that point apart from the Night Elves look more badass, and the Horde get a slap, and yet here we are again… Also, use of the word ‘salty’ does not a credible argument make. It is also, assuming I understand youth jargon, incorrect in its application. I am not ‘salty’ about anything. Some one actually said the Alliance deserved a bit more of a victory, in fact, why yes, it was me.
My apologies for having to pop into work for a few hours, I needed some of the office hardware. Sorry if that seems childish.
Except that has not been said. No one has said it was ‘Fine’. We -have- said it was whining, but not that it was ‘fine’.
Well they were. I mean I am the first to decry that absolute knucklehead, I loathe Garrosh, but, Book Garrosh was competent, Game Garrosh was an absolute thumpmonkey with the tactical nous of a stunned Kitten. Bad writing? Again? For the Horde?
I agree. Atrocious writing. 10,000 years doesn’t make you smart, with old age does not always come wisdom, look at who voted for Brexit, but yes, Tyrande was handled awfully in that, especially as Varian was not a million miles away from being a pink Garrosh in terms of temperament.
Well, given that she failed at both of her objectives, I wouldn’t say she is that brilliant…
Hang on, so Tyrande actually grasps the point and against her personal desire for vengeance sees what is being said, and does the painful but smart thing? That’s not her being dumb. That’s her being smarter than most other rulers in WoW.
I know exactly how bad it is. I mean exactly. It is a massively divisive factor within the Horde community on AD, not the community, the characters rather. Firm lines are being drawn between those who would back Saurfang, and those who back Sylvanas. I do not think anyone is under any illusions as to how bad it was.
And it isn’t every time people mention Night Elves. If you had paid attention I was -exulting- at the fact that the ‘Terror of Darkshore’ made the Night Elves look like the terrifying forest ghosts they should always have -been-, rather than being hippy-fied. That’s what I want! I want the absolute savagery and sylvan mystery, the blood on the grass, the Horde bodies strung up from trees a la ‘The Predator’.
We finally get that, and what is the response?
“Oh we only get to kill Rastakhan and destroy the Horde Fleet and ransack their city…”
What fresh slap in the face is there to the Night Elf Fanbase now? What slap is there? Perhaps, just perhaps, people would stop complaining about Night Elf whine threads, if there were not so many of them repeating the same mantra?
I just read them. No they don’t.
That is what is described as happening.
Right, so how much extra is needed before we hear the end of this? I mean there surely has to be some scale that we can look at and go "Ah, yes, now the Horde have suffered as much as the Night Elves. Not the Alliance, just the Night Elves. What is the point at which people would go “Ahhh, that’s justice!”
Examine that statement again and tell me how it makes the slightest shred of sense.
That…does not make any sense as a request, what do you mean?
Well, I certainly hope they wouldn’t punish me, I don’t live on Azeroth, and your suggestion, taking it less frivolously, is that all the ‘neutral’ organisations should merrily band along with the Alliance and smash the Horde, yes?
That is what we call Bias.
Two Wrongs do not make a Right. You can’t complain that X doing something is evil, if Y then starts doing it as well, especially if you are Y.
I fully understand that. It would be nice to have developed and well thought out story, characters with some depth to them other than moustache twirling monsters to satisfy the fact that the chaps in white hats get to ride in and be heroes again. Only way we get those, is if they go over to the ‘White hat’ faction. Oh, and Zappy Boi, I suppose.
Yes, and if they were smart, they would wait for the two power blocs to tear each other to pieces, given that they are -both- mining Azeroth and killing the planet, or did you forget that Darnassus was being used to funnel mined Azerite to the Alliance? I mean the Ebon Blade is on no one’s Wintersveil card list right now, The Cenarion Circle seem to have disappeared up their own bum, but wouldn’t be pleased with either Faction, and lets not forget Teldrassil was not a sacred thing, The Earthen Ring I can’t explain, so won’t try to, but they are still likely to heavily Horde Dominated, the Argent Crusade are in the worst position of all to try and cause trouble, trapped between a Horde Nation to the North, and the remnants of one to the east.
As to Sylvanas being evil, well, again, as I say, welcome to Horde Story writing, do you think -anyone- is happy with that?
So Both Factions then?
So you would see a situation, where one playable Faction gets a vast material advantage over the other playable Faction?
You don’t see that as Bias?
If there wasn’t one every week, that would perhaps be easier. Perhaps, here is a revolutionary concept, if every latest announcement from Blizzard, even when it confirms the Horde is getting a slap, wasn’t rebranded as “Another slap to the Night Elves,” people wouldn’t be getting so sick and tired of the whole thing.
Just a thought.
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Perhaps all of the above xd. I was going to be rude but there is no need for it really. Or need to intentionally be rude at the very least as it is easy for me to get heated and lose my head along the way during a argument xd.
Well no, you continued that persons discussing thus opened yourself to a response regarding the Night Elves. It is one thing to drop it because you don’t want to discuss it, sure might be a bit annoyed not gonna lie but it is far better than just labelling/insulting everyone on the way out. Otherwise we get to a situation where we are now, arguing other petty stuff while agreeing on other things. For me personally I didn’t think I was being whiny at all and you shouldn’t at the very least paint everyone with the same brush.
Also ofc, IRL matters should always take priority over the forums.
The Night Elves have defaulted back to what they were originally portrayed as in Warcraft 3. Giving something to a race what they should have gotten at the start of the game isn’t rewarding. Especially when it is meant to be grateful for such a gift after everything that has just happened.
Don’t worry, we might have genocided your people, destroyed the majority of your army, raised your people back up who are willing to now kill you while your Wild Gods, CC and your allies will barely help you but here is some Night Warrior buff (which besides on Tyrande is basically useless because as the Horde you go around killing Night Warriors and raising them back up with ease, what an amazing upgrade). And yet we have tons of people (including myself to a certain extent) who dislike or are worried about Tyrande’s power level because she has just become the Avatar of Elune which could lead to so many problems down the line.
It is funny tho’ when I go back and see the amount of Horde players take the p*ss out of the Night Elves in the WoT scenario when it was live are now angry and complaining about the Night Elves finally being able to take on the Horde which they should have done from the start.
Sure the Horde also got slapped at Darkshore, but if you want to compare the slap the Night Elves got before a lot of Darkshore became red… Well lets not make this to whiny now shall we?
It was a more of a word to say in the moment of writing up admittedly, you just left while basically insulting everyone on the way out (at least from my perspective), to me normally that would mean someone is annoyed/p*ssed.
Not the fact that you went, but don’t insult people on the way out perhaps. If you are going to poke the bear then expect the bear to retailate. Simple as that.
So why is it whinning for exactly? Lets clear the air on this part. Why is it whinning saying how the Night Elves got treated?
Inconsistent writing for Garrosh perhaps, but I still firmly believe that Garrosh was one of the best Warchiefs (to a certain extent before physico’ mode) and one of the best villains in the game. Perhaps my personal bias of him does cloud the bad side of him somewhat. But the point remains the same, the Night Elves getting pushed back Horde when really they should just highlight that the Night Elves were used just to make the Horde look better.
Glad we can agree on something through the argument xd.
I know but people on here and Blizzard themselves keep telling me that she is meant to be brilliant when her track record is just filled with failures.
That then she goes back on what she says in 8.1 to cause conflict within the Alliance? She is inconsistent with everything she does and goes back on what she says every other day. Another way to make Anduin look a lot more smart/wiser than the average person of his age.
Ultimately these points I listed is what come down to a certain fallacy (which I can’t think for the life of me what it is called) where the Night Elves are just used to make X look better.
Look at how strong the Horde are, they just obliterated the Night Elves in 3 weeks.
Look at how wise and smart Anduin/Varian is for schooling Tyrande.
And so on. It has just got to the point where doing this has dimished the Night Elves from ever being good, or just normal. Now they are a laughing stock at how much this has been done to them in order to make the other side smart.
In terms of the actual damage/scale of said event then the SoA doesn’t come remotely close to the WoT. In terms of the War Effort then ye it is a massive blow to the Horde and their campaign against the Alliance.
I agree, it is a massive blow not only to their race but to the Horde as well, but not in terms of war stats, loss of life, loss of land and so on. And personally this it what people mean when they say it isn’t a big deal.
If not then they are wrong I do agree.
And yes I do agree that the Night Elf threads are getting out of hand, having someone like Malfurion posting updates in every other thread instead of having one is annoying. But still that shouldn’t mean you whitewash everyone and call them all whiners. You just hurt yourself in the long run.
" There, Lorash explained that the kaldorei outposts in Ashenvale were already attacked by hundreds of rogues. "
" Lorash then went to check on the other outposts in case his colleagues encountered issues. At that moment "
" The champion returned to Astranaar, which was now occupied by the Horde’s armies. All of Ashenvale was secured. "
" Their outposts were taken by surprise, falling one by one, the guards poisoned. Not even the civilians were spared. The loss of life was clearly visible by the abundance of wisps. "
From Wowpedia, must have missed this part hmmm.
According to Wowpedia it isn’t, and when Blizzard main lore site is giving conflicting details about this then you can see why it is one of the worst written events in the game. How there was this much lack of communication between the teams writing this is astonishing. All in a matter of weeks I might add.
Well if you want it to be “even” then perhaps a genocide of one of your races is in order, with the killing of the majority of your army while everyone outside just watches. Then they can be raised back up and kill the rest of your kind.
No I doubt anything will come remotely even to this unless something like that generally happens. But at the end of the day I want good writing and a good story to take charge regardless of faction pride or balance or whatever. Give back the Night Elves old land you took off us in MoP (Azhsara and Stonetalon) and make Moonglade Alliance. Assuming we win the war ofc’ and not get destroyed by some third party threat which is the only way you can win at this point. From here if the Horde survives (which they will… yay game balance) then if they want to expand then it should be through another means beyond taking Alliance lands. You have plenty of Troll tribes which will follow Zanadalar and join you. You have the Venture Co’ and Streamwheedle who can have stories which involve joining the Horde. And from that you can gain power, balance and equalness without it being at the behest of the Alliance. You can quite literally take Tanaris, fully take Southern Barrens, Thousands Needles, some of Duskwallow marsh and have the same amount of zones as the Alliance does in Kali’.
Wouldn’t that be a better way?
Regardless I don’t think justice will ever happen as the unwillingness for so many people to see Sylvanas die is huge regardless of if they are the vocal minority. Mainly because it is a protest just so the Horde won’t kill another of their warchiefs and not because she is just toxic to the game in a position she is in currently.
Bias comes in more forms of just getting X to win, that does make sense. Being bias isn’t just about winning. I don’t see what you don’t get about this.
Explain why something cannot be bias just because they are losing. Explain to me please.
They don’t have to join the Alliance to fight the Horde, they can fight in their own ways without being apart of the faction. Having the fight you isn’t bias because you made them your enemies by what you are doing, or at least should have done. But these have gone back on their core identity and beliefs to allow you to wage your war without outside interference.
Tirion allowed Sylvanas to do whatever she wanted, such as blight/plague the land which they are trying to clean up, mass murder and genocide civilians and innocents to be used int he war machine. Commit war crimes of a mass scale and the invasion of neutral counties for her (and the lesser extent the Hordes benifit) and he just stood and watch. Garrosh compared Sylvanas to the Lich King and she said the only difference between her and him was that she “served” the Horde.
Why would Tirion and the AC just stand there? Oh wait because of balance. We can’t have him attack the Horde, that would be unfair. Bending the rules to allow your faction to survive yet again.
The CC/Wild Gods have just watched the Horde ramage through Ashenvale and Darkshore, Allowed them access into Felwood. All while burning the forests around them and destroying the land. Killing their own people, probably family anf friends. Watching them burn down the tree fulled with innocents/civilians. Now in 8.1 mass destruction of the forests continue with plaguing and deforestation along with the rasisng of the fallen and killing the spirits.
But naaa the CC, Wild Gods and Cenarius keeps neutral. Takes a blind eye to it all and continue their normal day.
Why would they do this? Oh wait it is because that would be unfair to the Horde ofc’.
I’d call this bias, that the rules don’t apply to you. That you should have a world wide coalition against you.
Yes, there is also a thing called “the lesser of two evils”. A victory for the Horde would basically mean the end of the planet near enough. Your faction is the root cause for this.
Because the story is any better here? I thought you just said you realize how bad the WoT event was just above?
Like before both sides have suffered.
The Alliance would stop if the Horde is defeated, especially with Anduin in charge. And if by some reason they don’t then at least they would use it for good and not produce weapons of war.
No but I’d expect them to care about the capture and experimentation of their people over what 6 years? They did it during the DK starter zone to save themselves from the Scarlet Crusade.
Yes, but it was still a holy site by druids, blessed by aspects and held the majority of the Night Elven population. They would care and care about the Night Elves a lot more than the Horde.
If anything they should be more involved with the Horde and trying to stop what they are doing, if not completely cut them off. They cannot possible just accept what the Horde is foing like there is no problem.
Doesn’t matter, they should stand up for what is right. If even the Lich King thinks Sylvanas is going to far then that should be enough to know what what Sylvanas is doing is bad. They should be at war and fighting.
A large % of people on here seem to be.
No. I have explained why.
From a lore/story prespective then the Horde shouldn’t get it ofc’. It would be stupid for Magni to willingly give it to them. Can’t you actually see this?
Like before, bending the rules. Horde PC shouldn’t get it but they do because of gameplay/balance.
I see that as bias ye. Thanks for agree with me.
It would help indeed, I am one of the people who tells X to post in the same thread. And this is coming from a “whiner”.
You helped in turning this into that be responding to it and carrying it up. You could have just left but decided to have one last jab which is where I fully came in. And here we are, arguing about it.
But where are my manners? Feel free to continue.
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