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188

So after not playing 2 seasons and having a rio score that goes for the current season to run 15s, you thought you could get into M15 by just whispering while not having the rio?

And relying on only your experience from months ago?

Whats next? Are you gonna pick up soccer, play for a few months.
Quit soccer, and in 2 years you go to the national team and say: hey guys, i am your new teammate?

People are not only using rio wrong to assemble groups, some people also really are thinking they can hop into any key level just because they once did said keylevel months ago.

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189

I am in 1 for 4 years already :thinking: They are very very real.

190

WoW is not like soccer, your physical form not matter as in soccer as long you can move your mouse and have lucid brain… Example is my PvP campagin, each time i want 2200 i get it, no matter which season, i can never get dull for that, same goes as m15. Comparing wow to soccer where people physical condition matters is just bad compare… in WoW you can weight one year 70 kilos another year 100 killos and still be gladiator right?

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191

Is it really that exagerating that people ask for a +14 freehold timed when applying for a freehold 15? Really? I just wiped 3 times on lord stormsong in a NORMAL dungeon. Just putting things in perspective.

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192

Oh i got your point. Guess you could see it like that.

Other than that. I don´t think thats much at all. What Praetorian is going on about is the scorce itself i think. As in just the score decides weather you are in or not. Which is imo wrong. Its essentially chinas social score system that everyone is up in arms if it is mentioned. Which is a bad system. The problem is that if i had completed a +14 freehold and would apply to a +15 freehold i wouldn´t be invited because of the score eben though i fullfill the requirement. (assuming there is no better option in the invite menu that is)

At least this “dehumanization” ( a little dramatic i know, but i don´t know how to describe it better) from person to just number is what annoys me about it.

EDIT: Yes you know why you are wiping? Because no one takes time anymore to explain stuff to new players or bad ones. No one explains stuff anymore and just saying “read a guide” turns many people off.

193

Never mind, you didnt get the point at all.

Makes sense, since you also seem to think you can apply to m+15s while you didnt even run m15s in the current season.

Read the reply again and then my comparison will surely make sense to you. although i highly doubt it.

194

I even explained it :thinking:

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195

I have to say your comparison with the national team is wrong (sine most groups are not on that kinnda level). It would be more akin to going onto a soccerfield and asking the guys that are there if you can joinn playing them and them declining you because they are having a tournament between friends.

Your compariosn would work if one would apply to the MDIs^^

196

Well then they are just stupid. We can´t have everything. But its very nice of you :slight_smile:

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197

Most of the times i use this logic when assembling groups.
Having a timed 1 or 2 keylvls lower of the dungeon i am about to play or a untimed same level run of said dungeon.

Even when i play with friends, we sometimes miss timers due to various reasons, from DCs to reallife events that require attention at that very point during a dungeon (kids / dogs / cats / girlfriends / wives / neighbours etc etc)

So thats why i would invite people with untimed runs for the keylvl i am about to do.
The score doesnt tell you the whole story, nor does it give you the guarantee you will time your key no matter what.

Heck, last season i invited some 4k score player on an alt to join a run with us, and he didnt really know anything about his role and how to deal with certain mechanics with his class.

So it surely doesnt tell the whole story, and you will still require a brain yourself to ‘‘filter’’ the right people. (i.e.: not invite a dude with 0 untimed runs, because that just isnt a thing)

198

The point wasnt about the level of play.

Its about the fact that Praetorian thinks he can hop into any M+ group of the same level he did play months ago, without having the experience right now for said dungeon.

So then, my example would work perfectly.

Either way, routes / dungeons changes during seasons and on a weekly basis due to affixes.
So i get the fact he gets declined even tho he ran 19s back in season 2 (which is 1 year ago now) his experience from back then just doesnt tell me anything to invite him to my group right now.

199

More untimed dungeons means more experience :grin: Do you think i got my +22 temple timed as my first temple key? There is a lot of poor tauren blood spoiling involved :smile:

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200

Hahaha, you worked hard for that!

Thats one of the other things, i tend to see people get ‘‘crazy’’ over people with a few untimed runs, and go like: he should be really good.
While in reality, there is no such thing as that.

At some point, the untimed runs must be outweighed by timed runs of the same level for sure. (in before we get people with: 100 timed runs, 2x 15s and 98 +2s timed!)
But using that as a metric to determine solely if the player is good or bad just doesnt cut it.

Same goes for ‘‘just’’ using his or her score, it doesnt tell the whole story.

201

Yeah i got that what i meant was that your arguement could be misconstrued that way.

202

Then we are on the same page :slight_smile:

my bad!

203

I do agree that some people may not know mechanics. But above 10 is not where people should be learning. They should go at +5.

I hate when people assume it’s only on key owner side.

204

Its fine. ^^
I just never understand players who make such a big deal about all that min maxing that just leads to stuff like raiderio or logs. As tools for oneself they are great, but manny people just use them wrong (as in force others to confirm). And thats what annoys me about them. People are judged before they have even spoken a word or had a chance to show their worth (my issue with it is mostly in raiding tbh).

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205

Please do, this Addon makes people toxic.

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206

Most of the time, yes. Getting told “f-off scrub” or something like that isn´t nice. I was told off many times with a “Sorry your score is to low”, or something like that, (in a +8 or so btw.) which really sucks but is ok.

207

TLDR: We need more customization baked into WoW to be less dependant on 3rd party things like rio / simcraft etc.

Min-maxing has a place for those that raid for world first etc.

But the trend that emerged the last years towards the fact that ‘‘everyone’’ has to play the meta comp for M+ or they want X or Y tank during a M+ season because the high score dudes use that aswell is the issue.

rio is a tool which i myself find helpful in creating my own groups to run M+ and i try to use it only as a tool.

People telling others about their score being too low or calling you names because of your score feels weird and i dont get why people are so busy with other people’s scores and feel the need to tell them.

We are all playing a game we enjoy and we get our enjoyment at different levels, be that in mythic raiding / mythic+ (+5s or +28s) / pvp or just transmog farming / mount farming etc, and i have the feeling this gets ‘‘judged’’ by the people that think you need 1000 rio score to run some +5s on a casual basis.

But down the line, like many addons we saw in the last years be it rio or gearscore, they are created to give players a tool to judge the people they are about to play with.
Which in essence is fine to some degree if used accordingly.

Gearscore got redundant at some point, because Blizzard introduced ilvl being shown on armory and ingame with the group finder / character info.

At the end of legion, i had hopes that the M+ ui would be accessible not only by yourself but also by people who want to invite you to their groups to determine if you would fit within the group.
It did get an overhaul, and overall i think it looks a bit better but the real functionality isnt there.

I have been saying it in multiple topics but it doesnt seem to happen, i was under the assumption of Blizzard adding a better and more functional M+ ui / group finder ui into Shadowlands to reduce the need for Rio or just outright ‘‘óutplay’’ it.

But that doesnt seem to be the case.

And why would i want something like that?
We are playing a game for fun / entertainment and nowadays you need to keep up with addons / scores / websites / simcrafting / change your ui (standard one is just too basic at this point and could use an overhaul) to play a game.

I would love to see more customization offered from blizzard to reduce the mess that is currently out there in terms of addons / 3rd party websites etc.

1 Like