Blizzard should bring back Quinton Flynn and apologise to him

So long as it concerns the sphere of private interactions there is nothing you can do i’m afraid. Should or ought or otherwise.

As the law stands, the law has no right to sanction you before charges are made - which is what happened in this case. THIS is what “Innocent upon proven guilty” refers to.

Whether private individuals can jump to conclusions and shun you, not give you business, treat you as if you had done a thing or not, that isn’t within the remit of the law - because this stuff is them using their freedom as if their right. People can disassociate from each other for any reason they like really and that includes believing things which are yet unproven to be true.

Now if damages can be proven (outright defamation, libel) you can sue people in civil court for it and that will usually put a stop to it (but only so much as you are punishing it) but as for the stopping the whole "people jumping to conclusions and joining in witch hunt mentality) there’s nothing you can do to stop people doing this proactively outside of restricting personal freedoms.

It’s not ideal, but it’s how it is. 90% of the stuff concerning these kinds of cases has NOTHING to do with how the actual law works and everything to do with how private individuals behave and the social punishments they visit upon people as a result of their ignorance.

So I agree in that you’re talking about the right target here “We, as a society” that’s the issue. It’s not the courts, the powers that be, the law, because as regards to what their remit is, they’re doing it properly. The issue is “wider society” loves to behave like this.

And it’s not restricted to “one side” as well. You see this kind of harmful and nosey speculation on all sides of the political spectrum. You see it with people snowballing about additions to games/media such as “LGBT stuff” and flapping their hands about “where it leads”.

Humans LOVE drama and love an excuse fabricate outrage, I suspect because out lives (by and large) are so cushioned these days, it’s a way of inserting “controlled unpredictability” into our lives to make them dynamic.

I’ll check out the reocmmendation. Mikkelsen is a fine actor. Loved him in Hannibal.

It also also happens less than “the internet” seems to act like it does. If we take the tone of this thread as a snapshot, it seems to a vast majority of people here the very idea that an accusation could be true is complete fiction, so it would seem they imagine that false accusations are everywhere they look.

Regarding my own situation, i’d had to weather the rumour thing. As I mentioned in my post where I spoke of my career in education and as of yet not falling foul of this sort of thing (despite working with a lot of women, including in a 1:1 capacity) I mentioned two times where female students developed a wierd fixation on me and in one of those cases, although not outright accusations of misconduct, one of then did begin a process of alluding we had a level of contact that was fiction which they started to communicate with others in the group.

The difference is the way I conducted myself up to that point and consistently so meant I could easily show evidence so as to “at the first hurdle” of it being brought into my awareness, I could instantly expose it as fiction before my superiors had an opportunity to even ask me further questions about it.

So yes, more rumours may as of yet afflict me, there’s always the chance, but I take a lot of small, sensible steps to render such potential rumours baseless from the word go.

Men gets accused by woman : result man’s life blown up.
Men get acquitted: result man’s life blown up, woman walks alway laughing.

That’s the real world, thousands even probably more examples of cases.

Few can fight back, not everyone has the means to do so. Take Johnny Depp vs AH, bizarre, and she almost got away, but his career is still in ruin. Most men get destroyed, as in divorce cases, I’m sure men will learn at one point, if they do marry, to protect themselves, they need to.

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I see you got TL3 :smiley:
have fun posting gifs and pictures xD

https://eu.forums.blizzard.com/en/wow/g/trust_level_3?order=added_at

Yet another example where a post only considering the idea the man could be innocent.

Play through your example again, but now consider that the man is guilty, and he gets acquitted. How does that impact the woman’s life? Not only has she been violated, but now people think she’s a liar and false accuser despite the fact she was correct. She would be villified out of her place of work and chased off, AND been assaulted.

It seems to me that people honestly don’t give a single crap about this potential at all. It’s always about “men being falsely accused”, please consider for one second, that some of these accusations are legit, and they can be a hard thing to prove, and that everythingt you said here about how a man’s life can be ruined, can apply to a woman in that situation too (where she is assaulted) but in addition to that, she’s suffered a violation.

“In the real world” there are false accusers yes, but there are also women whom are sexually assaulted by someone at work say, and nobody believes them it was assault- that she “led him on” or “gave consent witthout saying yes” so when she does take it to court, and fails, HER life is ruined.
In the real world both sides get screwed over, but to me, one gets a rawer deal when it goes wrong than the other, which is why it is how it is. It really is a “no real winners” situation, but I don’t think behaving as if the “real world” is full of false accusations and there’s no chance any of these women could be right is honestly reasonable. It’s a very biased point of view to view things like that. Surely you have to at least consider that some of them would be making legit accusations?

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You keep turning stuff around like people are pretending that women don’t actually get assaulted, When the whole point of the subject is about mens life being ruined from false accusations. So of course that’s going to be talked about more. What do you want people to say in the thread? “sexual assault is wrong and should never be done to women” it’s like stating the obvious. It doens’t matter what anyone says , Witch hunting and assuming guilt can’t be excused.

If there was a thread with actual victims in it and the whole discussion was about what happened to them, It would be in bad taste to mention fake accusations, However this thread is about that subject. You wonder why it’s being discussed more than actual real accusations? Isn’t it obvious why?

It’s like trying to silence the issue because another exists? both are wrong. However you can see from this thread, Everyone thinks sexual assault is bad, while not everyone cares what happens to people with fake accusations, hence the point of the thread.

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Well said! But it seems we got a white knight in our midst :smiley:

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What a load of crap :stuck_out_tongue: I don’t have to reply, Baltic already did that for me.

This topic is about a falsely accused man, so that’s why we’re focussing on it, got it? Ok!

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It’s not about whataboutism or bad faith.

The reason I mention women being assaulted is because the entire reason we have this “act first” culture is because of the probability of the accusations being true warrants it. Therefore it’s extremely vital to remember this because many here seem to discuss the whole trend absent of it, as if that’s not the reason it’s done in the first place.

So yes, I will remind people of this fact, lest they forget and convince themselves that all such accusations are false. It’s not me derailing, it’s me saying “and this is why we have this going on, remember that” because way too many people seem to think it’s done simply because the world “wants to screw men over” or some nonsense.

I’ve said it more than once - this does not mean I think that men whom get their lives ruined by false accusations are “fair game” or a good thing. I’ve said the opposite several times. I simply take the view that that fallout is less significant than the fallout of “getting it wrong” when a woman has actually been assaulted and it would seem the powers that be agree with me on this.

I don’t see what is so hard to understand about this. It is perfectly plausible for me to go “this is bad, and this is bad, but I think we should do X because the second thing is worse”.

And I would’nt know if everyone here thinks sexual assault is bad, because it seems that it’s rarely brought up, and when it is, as you have just demonstrated, i’m being told “it’s not part of the issue”.

If the probability of a sexual assault being legit isn’t “part of the issue” when talking about whether a company is justified in taking precautions when an accusation is made, YOU are arguing in bad faith because you are setting the debate on your terms only.

I agree that blizzard should apologise to QF and attempt to open dialogue with him - i said this clear as day in the other thread. The fact blizzard got it wrong doesn’t mean we should tear the whole building down though.

besides, my post you replied to was in reply to someone whom was bringing up a generalisation about how these accusations go in a general sense, not specifically about the treatment of men under false accusations as they were making a comment about the prevalence of this in the real world and how it’s everywhere. That similarly has nothing to do with the specifics of what should be done where a man in a known case is known to be falsely accused, as it’s just ranting about how popular it is (a comment on the likelihood of it, which by proxy is a comment on how many of them are possibly legit) - but interestingly it’s only my “off-topic” post which is being focused on here, because presumably my position disagrees with your thinking whereas the poster I replied to seems to agree with you. Pretty pick and choose if you ask me?

That’s why I replied to what I did. You may disagree it was warranted, that’s fine and I can see why you may say that and I respect that so i’ll step out either way. Just want to point out the matter as I see it. You’re applying a very forensic level of “topic relevance” to my post that you aren’t for other posters here that are making general rants about “related but not quite” stuff- just like mine, and the only difference is they seem to be on your side of the fence.

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Actually that isn’t how it works, or in the UK at least. Making false accusations can, and has landed women in Prison. I don’t know about the legalities of other countries, and I agree that the sentences should be higher for false accusations, but you still do go to prison for it.

Been married, been divorced. You still actually have a lot of protection, it isn’t as black and white as angry twitch kids make it sound. There isn’t some ‘anti-man’ conspiracy going on. I said to my Solicitor “This is what I want, make it happen” and I got what I wanted. The fact that I was male never came into it, and certainly wasn’t a contributory factor towards the verdict.

Sure, Pre-Nuptial arrangements can be a good idea, but at the same time they’re a bit skeevy. “Sure, let’s get married, and make vows to love each other for our entire lives, but hey, like, can we sign this, because I don’t actually trust you” How the heck does that work? How do you build a relationship on mutual distrust?

I wouldn’t ignore them if they had proved me wrong. But they haven’t. So that isn’t an issue.

Because they haven’t. They were paid for a set contract, they still have their credits on IMDB and ACX and places like that. They’ve not lost their work, they still have it. Just because it was later replaced by another Actor does not mean they have lost their work. It is still out there, and available for anyone who wants to contract them in the future -Including- Blizzard!

Well what is the point? Seriously, what is the point here, what are people expecting apart from head nodders going “Yeah, totally man”. Because all I am seeing is a lot of people who know jack all about how VA works showing fake outrage and waving pitchforks. The instant someone who -does- know how the industry works goes “Actually, that isn’t how it goes” the Twitch and .pol generation go mad!

Plus my favourite Stalker of course, but they do that on every post I make.

Lets be fair, it is never OK to throw someone under the Bus, but come on, let’s face it, we should have seen the signs…I mean Jimmy Saville looked like a wrong’un even in the Seventies… :stuck_out_tongue:

Umm, I think you might want to revisit that statement, or are you seriously saying that we should ascribe Guilt without investigation? Because surely we should be ascribing Innocence until investigation. I think you might have worded that wrong.

Are they though? I’m casting a bit hard doubt on that. Too many? yes, Billions, I really strenuously doubt that.

Well, I mean, you are an example of this, to be fair. Anything that does not agree with you is some sort of conspiracy, instead of being adult enough to take responsibility for your own words.

Have you ever read a newspaper, or a book? You’d be amazed how many words are in them. You type exactly as much as it needs to convey the point to your satisfaction, that is how it works. Otherwise War and Peace would be “Yeah, Bear in a cape, bloke is unhappy in life, another bloke is in a loveless marriage, she cheats on him, oh unhappy bloke gets badly injured, is dying, realises he -does- actually love his wife, then dies, oh, and Napoleon invades Russia” That’s just how language works, sometimes less is more, but equally, sometimes you need more, or what you end up with is lesser in quality.

He wasn’t Fired! VA work doesn’t operate that way. He did his contracted pieces and that was it. He was paid, you move on to your next project. If your stuff is replaced, who cares? You still got paid!

Has anyone considered the fact that -HE- might not have wanted a new Contract? Wanting some time with his loved ones and no pressure, after an incredibly traumatic experience? Or are we too busy waving pitchforks and complaining about Cancel Culture (Ridiculous term) and SJW’s?

Thing is, none of you seem to want to listen to someone who actually works in the Industry and knows how it works, you just want to be angry at -something- and that’s fine, I can understand that, I did too, especially in my teens, Gods I got angry at everything, but the point is that what you are getting angry at here is standard business practice! It is how it works! You replace a VA, you need that new VA to record all of their stuff. This has happened before. Anyone remember the Scandal about Dave Mallow? No, you don’t because there wasn’t one. Was he replaced with Gideon Emery, why yes he was.

Seriously, people shrieking about it are -creating- the very problem they claim to hate. Don’t you see that? And people using the phrase ‘Cancel Culture’ frankly cannot be taken seriously in any sensible discussion.

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Don’t need to take it literally. Million, sound better?

I think his point was that whatever the outcome of the case the accused is screwed no matter if they’re innocent or not.
If you get accused you’re pretty much sentenced on the spot as a “bad guy”.

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So that’s the new thing now, let’s ignore cancel culture. You think it’s not there? It’s happening all over the place, but when you mention it, it’s not serious? It’s as serious as can be.

But point taken, I have the same with the word racism, when people can’t win an argument “throw racist card”.

And not going for a pre-nub, to show you 100% trust your future wife (as in, if you go for it, you don’t trust your wife), what nonsense, you need to protect yourself. Maybe in your case things worked out, but in many cases it didn’t. Whatever you worked all your life for, gets taken away. I don’t think so.

Is she doesn’t get that, then she can look for a different partner. I don’t believe in that women are sweet i and innocent.

Have a good day Sir (I assume) white knight!

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I dont : D, far from it even,I dont even have any trust level at all : p

the victim complex, holy hell

wah wah straight white guys really are the most oppressed group amirite?

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I am that old I watched the original :stuck_out_tongue:

Granted it was on reruns but still.

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It is a really difficult thing for both sides and yes in some and probably even most cases the accuser is correct.
This problem is really difficult to have a black and white solution for.

The problem that I see it as is that it is considered fine for some collateral damage as long as the majority of incidents are stopped.
Which to me at least in very immoral.
Both in the social justice world and the legal systems it is considered acceptable to have a couple of innocent people getting wrongly accused or wrongly sentenced as long as the majority of cases turns out justifiable.
That to me is not an ok way to go about such serious matters.
2%, 1% or even 0.00001% of cases being someone innocent getting blamed and/punished is too much.
It have to be 0.
Going about preventing or punishing crime or misconducts with any collateral damage is the wrong way to go about it.

Now I know it works on a surface level and in the majority of cases but it’s more an easier band aid solution than an actual solution.
Yes we should combat crime and misconduct but not at the expense of innocents.

I can’t offer a solution to all the problems and there will always be bad guys no matter how we evolve as a society.

But having our society go: “Whoops”. When we punish or blame the wrong person because we usually get it right is not the right way for our society to go and will only lead to more and more cases of it happening.

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The moment someone posts things like “he assaulted me” on Twitter, that should be immediately discarded. Go to the police. You’re either an idiot or someone who knows that it will start a lynch mob by posting on social media.

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Assumption and lack of reading comprehension.

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Many times this stuff happened years ago which makes it hard to go to the police.

It’s pretty much what started the “me too” movement. More and more women coming out against people like Harvey Weinstein saying “this happened to me too”. It’s easy to dismiss one voice (and sure, some are attention seeking nutters) but “immediately discard all of them”? No.

Thats the problem with all of this. People jump to conclusions without all the facts and most certainly without nuance. Would you outright dismiss a well respected actress who has a lot to lose if she posted this on twitter? Really?

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