Little to no effort? Harder to play than pretty much anything else
There it is again. Mage and rogue are the hardest classes to play. Others just need to l2play.
Season after season, year after year, expansion after expansion and many trainingwheels later, itās become a self-replicating mantra for many of these players. If they are not S tier, they will pull out their hair and mald that they canāt kill people in a cc as easily as they do.
3 Likes
He wasnāt talking about comps, and the video also literally says āall mage specs have a relatively simple rotationā.
What this guy didnāt get is it is hard to perform with those specs on the top level as the guy who made the video says, now what makes it harder at the top level you might ask?
The enemy. Once the enemy knows how to shut you down it gets harder and harder to pull your tricks off, but it doesnāt mean your SPEC gets harder or that you lose your abilities.
Why would others need to l2play if they play such an easy class? 
Jokes aside
Sub rogue canāt kill anything if their kill target and/or healer gets out of the cc. They deal about no damage right now. They rely entirely on their team mates to kill while they only do cc. Fire mage is really strong though, and has enough burst for the both of them, which is why RM(X) still works.
First, you should not confuse damage rotation as an indicator of spec difficulty. Every damage rotation in the game is easy to learn. It is when you have to do other things at the same time it can get a bit more complicated.
Second, spec difficulty is very determined by the comps. Playing a mage in a caster cleave such as fire mage + elemental shaman, or playing fire mage + warrior, is very different from playing RMX.
That is exactly what it means though. If your enemy has a lot of tools to counter your kit it will be a lot harder to play the spec because there are more cds you need to be aware off, and the timing for when things needs to happen becomes even more critical. Especially while playing a setup based comp. It is all these small detail and communication / awareness of the entire team together that makes it hard to play. Not so much the spec alone.
Other comps such as melee cleaves, in the contrary, only needs to make sure they use their offensive cds at the right time and avoid to overlap defensives.
There was actually a point in time where rogue mage was not viable, but it only lasted for 1 major patch cycle
1 Like
As I said before he was not talking about comps 
āhardest casterā does not mean rmx/caster cleave/wmp whatever, you name it.
Youāre confusing rmx comps with mage as a spec.
Agreed.
Ye I know the truth hurts when proven wrong. Have fun in the rat bracket.
Dear people who think playing Rogue mage X is easy mode, I invite you to lvl a Mage or Rogue and play RMPā¦ you should get Gladiator insta right? if its as easy mode as you say right? thereās alot more to Mage than just pressing Combust and thereās alot more to Rogue than just pressing Dance when its up. Let me know how that struggle goes when you start running into people who know how to play against RMP and donāt just let you do what you want.
Dear people who think playing Warrior, paladin X is easy mode, I invite you to lvl a warrior or paladin and play WPXā¦ you should get Gladiator insta right? if its as easy mode as you say right? thereās alot more to Warrior than just pressing Condemn and thereās alot more to Paladin than just pressing Divine shield when its up. Let me know how that struggle goes when you start running into people who know how to play against WPX and donāt just let you do what you want.
1 Like
So waitā¦ you think Warrior/Ret/Healer is a hard comp to play? I know people who have been hard stuck 2.2k on these classes all of a sudden get 2500+ with it this season. I even know a Disc priest that couldnāt play RMP at 2.1kā¦ he switched to healing Warrior Ret and now heās 2700cr. Its basically the MLX of BFA.
Itās quite funny watching the 2k - 2.1k bots trying to defend these classes 
If you canāt get past 2.2k on an SP, Warrior, Ret, Mage, Hpally, Ele Sham, Boomie or WW this season youāre actually trash at the game, all of these classes are crazy at the moment and you shouldnāt be coming onto the forums crying blaming other classes for why you are stuck. People donāt even respond to your dmg CDs properly at these ratings, No wonder they get 1 shot so often.
God I love hearing lots of people saying how easy rogue mage is while never having experience playing it and often being clueless to what even really makes it work. Itās like a person whoās never driven in his life giving you car advice.
Go play rogue mage then, see how long it takes to learn to set up as a rogue and how much crap you need to be able to just react to. See how bad you are punished for messing up , then tell everyone how you got super high rank playing it.
A 3 min Youtube Video.
As any other class needs to ? Ever played caster into 2 Shamans ?
Played healer ? Would guess never and especially not currently where you can die without messing up.
I also play warlock Iām very aware of it from another pov but lets face facts. Not everyone is good at mage rogue , not every player is comfortable with tracking how many gcds they have in a stun to seamlessly keep a chain on stuns going while cross CCing another target with a sap off a blind nor is everyone that great at knowing what cds they can /cant afford to use when and where in a given go.
If it was THAT easy everyone would pick it up with relative ease, most RM set ups work around a understanding that both players have picked up over some time on knowing how to execute well and deny as much counter play as possible though small details, Iām sorry to burst your bubble on thinking pressure based comps are on the same level but Iāve played both and they both have ādifferent skill setsā of learning but letās be real- turbo cleave/walking dead and comps that just sit on raw damage and try to eat though cooldowns ARE easier to play. If you think melee cleave takes as much time to learned how to be competent at then you are just dumb ngl
There is a reality that some classes do have higher skill ceiling even if they dont have the highest skill floor. Like I cant think of a single class in wow thatās hard to learn damage on really, but knowing how to burst isnāt being good at a class
No, Iām just taking your argument, turning it upside down and watching you mald over it: Because the truth is, the argument that āahhh you should play (insert class here) before you can have any say about how much skill they take to playā is not only stupid but lazy. Thereās not a single class/spec in this game that you can one-trick-pony to gladiator levels, as much as some would like to claim that.
Also your experiences are irrelevant because anybody could pull out of their butt the exact same numbers but from an opposite example, so what?
You and many other mage and rogue players have been dead-set on this notion that somehow these two classes are the creme de la creme of classes in the game when it comes to pvp that take the most skill to play- When in reality, when RMP is actually brough on par with other comps (as it was more or less in MoP and even more so in Wotlk), the forums are malding with ears about how it is not right that Rogue and mage arenāt the S tier class from one patch and expansion to another.
My issue, as the OP requested in this thread, is that R M players have this notion that they somehow deserve better or that because their classes and comps are so skill-intensive, despite the numbers being at complete odds with this argument. If RMP was such a weak comp and only viable in the hands of a solid team, then by normal distribution itād get exponentially less popular as rating increases- Which, it doesnāt.
The ugly truth is that rogue and mage are the classes that have gained the most utility over the years, lost least of it over the years, all the while having kept their strenghts (burst, cc), and whenever anybody points out that these training wheels exist, there is a cry from the said playerbase that they need them (despite the comp existing even in draught expansions, as mentioned).
Nobodyās saying that Rogue and mage donāt take any skill to play. Obviously they do. But so does any other class in the game. Youāre not special, and you shouldnāt be given special treatment either. The arrogance of the playerbase is what creates the animosity toward the comp.
Mages and Rogues, RMP in general, has been a meta comp for on and-off since Cataclysm. And itās representation hasnāt dwindled anywhere, if anything Iād guess it has increased. And apparently this is how itās supposed to be, when there specs and entire classes at times that can sometimes not be viable for entire patch cycles, let alone expansions (hello, fury warriors, demo locks?).
3 Likes
Dude - mage has lost stuff same as rogue and every other class over the years? Recall deep freeze ? Gouge ? Hemo ? Old premeditation ?
I am ALL FOR specs that arenāt viable revisited - demo lock is currently trash tire and will be until blizzard finally accepts that there ideal changes they made moving into bfa turned the spec so dire for real content that the dude who thought that was great I hope never gets to touch the spec again- its useless by design no numbers can save it . But OPs case was ācan we have an expansion/season where RM isnāt a decent tireā like itās bad that they still function well . I actually enjoy some other comps like shadowplay/RLS/WLS but does that mean I should **** on the fact turbo is strong just because others play it and I dont really enjoy it ?
I dont get the reasoning behind the idea that blizzard have some special treatment when sub got nerfed just like any other class should do when its clearly working different to how they intend it too . Itās like crying on the forums because someone just wants to see something unviable because they dislike it sometimes and argue anything to make it sound bad
Who exactly says their classes deserves better because its a Rogue or a Mage? If I had my way every comp and class would be highly skill based and you are not able to PvE win. Thatās not a Rogue Mage thing thatās a competitive ideal, or my competitive ideal. It donāt think things should be dumbed down for casual players in any shape or form and I play Mage and RMP because I personally enjoy how rewarding playing a setup comp well can be, if you play it poorly you go no where with setup comps, if you play them very well you climb easily. Its rewarding to play these comps well, and punishing when you donāt and thatās where the skill gap comes in between teams. Where as it can be rewarding to play a caster cleave or melee cleave badly because you can win off PvE dmg.
You say RMP has been viable for a long time, yes its true and you mention certain classes and specs are not viable, but its the same story for Rogues and Mages? they also have unviable specs. But since they have 3 DPS specs 1 will always be competitive and so RMP will always be viable. Also the 2 classes have high synergy where put together Rogue enables the Mage vs things that would otherwise shut it down and the Mage enables the Rogue against things that would normally shut it down. If you redesigned both classes away from each other people would take issue with whatever comp is next in line in terns of class synergy.
I and Iād say most of the guys in this thread arenāt trying to nerf rogue or mage as Iād love to have a season where everything is viable, but Atahalni is right about the others: players who play these classes tend to overexaggerate how hard it is to play them.
Just read above the classic mageās responses to me 
he turned into a toxic pile ofā¦ something because I dared to point out you donāt need to work at Nasa to play a mage this expansion.
Or wynterscold calling ret/arms/mage whatever players who are below 2.2k trash.
Every spec can be played up until a decent rating without sweating in the right hands, mages and rogues arenāt exceptions.
This attitude towards the rest of the classes and the evident feeling of superiority in some of the mage/rogue playersā comments on the forums are the thing why threads like this exists.
1 Like
Iām pretty sure reading the name of the topic were in though- this thread was aimed at ācan they please not be viable this patchā I meanā¦ the name of the thread pretty much says it strait out of the box
Maybe Iām missing something when I read it ? But Iām pretty sure Iām not
This wasnāt a ācan we please bring more comps to the tableā this was a pure bash at game design saying it still works
So Iām wrong then? you think its the same skill gap between playing a Warrior to playing a Mage?
Is this also wrong then? those classes are so crazy at the moment that if you have any idea of what you are doing you can climb on them with certain comps. Warrior/Ret/healer, Warrior, SP,healer, Ele/Mage/healer, SP,Mage,healer etc. RMP atleast requires the Mage, the Rogue and the Disc to atleast know what they are doing, from personal experience if one is lacking the comp starts to fall apart vs better skilled players.
It has nothing to do with feeling superior, its more that I see people cry about certain classes in arena and most of them are on very very strong classes but are stuck down at 2100 or lower crying in every thread about other classes and think that anything RMX is ez mode compared to their class, while 90% of them donāt even know how their own comp works properly let alone how other comps like RMP work.
Without having read every post, rogue mage is still the biggest offender for obvious reasons and everyone who denies that plays either of these classes. 
3 Likes