Dear Fellow Horde

[Coolgroove-defias-brotherhood (Coolgroove)]

@Khyrneken-ragnaros

Diluting the progression chain while also promoting RNG. Can’t really fault the crying on the forums; where else will we vent and/or hope to have our voices heard?

It’s therapeutic and also the only visible route to potential progress.

About this whole World of RNGcraft? Yes, any time, I’m all up for it, it’s severely bad.

But I honestly don’t think that any 1 rng item is worth so much of drama on forums, especially if it’ll even out eventually, and in a month (if Uldir tier was any indication) nobody would care much about heroic lvl item anyway.

But if therapeutic - yeah, I get it, haha

@Khyrneken-ragnaros

You seem to be trying to pursue arguments way off the point. We are not arguing over Warfronts here. The “25 kill” Quest is not a mirror to the upgraded Warfront rewards.
…
Again, this that is for Warfronts. War mode is totally different …

It’s about free items of high lvl and player progress they give - that is the whole reason why that reward get so much crying about. And in this case WF is relevant - because it is the same pool of rewards, and it’ll even out any progress that was given by this one time 400 ilvl reward.

@Khyrneken-ragnaros

There is no need for it at all. It is simple Alliance pandering then.

Alliance pandering, Horde pandering - there is always some pandering if one get rewards and other don’t. First it was Horde, now it’s Alliance, etc - it’ll all even out, just not as fast as we would want it to. But yeah, probably.

I still want that immune toy on Alliance side since I don’t have a horde character, and even with this - I don’t care about pandering, because it always switches sides. But back to the topic…

@Khyrneken-ragnaros

Unless Horde get a “25 kill” Quest next week rewarding ilvl 400 gear while Alliange get their ilvl 400 Warfront quest, and the Horde Quest is given not just because of population gaps, then it is not the same. It is not fair. It is not balanced.

Mate, be reasonable, you can’t have it all your way. You want bigger WM population and rewards all for your side - it’s not going to happen.

When Alliance will outnumber Horde in WM and difference is going to be big - you’ll get the the quest.

It’s fair, and balanced, at least as much as system like that can be.

@Khyrneken-ragnaros

Plus, on top of that, you guys will still be getting some form of reward (potentially 385) next week on top of your Warfront reward.

We could potentially get that quest, but it’s not a guaranteed as per Q&A.

@Khyrneken-ragnaros

Exactly! Everyone has their own incentives. But why give incentives to one side over the other? How is that fiar or healthy?

Because way too many on one side need extra motivation. It wouldn’t be fair if it was hard-coded for one faction, and never turned off. But it isn’t - so it’s as fair as it can be.

Healthy? I think that this whole bonus system is not healthy, and War Mode suppose to have completely different rewards structure. But as far as bonus/quest goes - it’s OK, and I’ll still think the same way when Horde would get this bonus and quest and Alliance wouldn’t.

@Khyrneken-ragnaros

Where is the Horde incentive? Where is the Horde incentive? Where is the Horde incentive? We have PvE Players too.

Why more Horde didn’t turn it off? Why more Horde didn’t turn it off? Why more Horde didn’t turn it off?

@Khyrneken-ragnaros

Why does Alliance get free rewards for crying about not being arsed to play the original War Mode?

Alliance didn’t get it for crying - we get it because data shows that there were much more Horde in WM.

It would be great to have 50/50 balance, and same incentives for both sides, etc, but it is, unfortunately, not possible with current factions player-base state.

You can ignore it for the sake of your argument, or just “can’t care less about it, not my problem” - but it is a problem, and to have a lot of player on both sides - it needed a solution.

Current solution is not great by a mile, but it works.

If you don’t like this system - then propose another, be just as vocal and passionate about it. Because there is no other way to make this bonus-system “better” and still keep it effective, but more about it below.

@Khyrneken-ragnaros

So you are saying that the vast increase in Alliance players in War Mode is not because of the bigger reward but because they get a bigger reward than the Horde?

No, I don’t think it works like that.
More detailed explanation, as needed:

It’s not because it’s “bigger reward than the Horde”. It’s just bigger reward that makes one side to get more players in, while other side, that outnumbers, gets players out.

It’s not the case of one bigger than the other. It is the case of giving a temporary incentive - a juicy enough reward for one side to trigger this effect above.

Since reward this high (even 385) is not intended to stay alway on - if both factions had same incentive, it wouldn’t be higher than 370, which in Season 2 is meaningless. So we would get the same situation as in 8.0, meaningless rewards and more Horde than Alliance.

There is no need to try and twist what I’ve said.

@Khyrneken-ragnaros

With both sides getting the same incentive, then both sides should be eager to use the mode. We can already see that the Alliance have the numbers and eagerness when given a big enough carrot.

Because this quest and this level of reward is not intended to stay on all the time. Only when needed - when one faction severely outnumbered by the other.

It’s not a permanent reward method - it’s a temporary incentive, there is a huge difference.

@Khyrneken-ragnaros

And you are defending this?

this

@Coolgroove-defias-brotherhood

I’m not defending current bonus-system like it’s the best thing ever. Everybody who ever read my posts on the matter knows that from the first time I saw that “Conquest bar to fill” I was in support of a good “PvP vendor + currency system, without RNG”. But it works, and there is no denying that.

and then we have this

@Khyrneken-ragnaros

That is utterly toxic! … Why should the Horde be punished just for playing the game mode?

I think we are done here. I’ve had way to much bickering on forums lately - and this ^ is how it goes that way.

Thank you, it was an interesting discussion up until this point, and with this:

I sincerely wish you good luck in getting something reasonable that you want to.
Have fun venting out!

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On the other had, maybe there is a way to make this system feels more like “fair”, but it could be needlessly complex:

• if current difference in WM population is in range of 10-15% bonus, then no faction has a quest
• if current difference is 20% then outnumbered faction gets a quest with 370 as a reward.
• if current difference is 25+% then outnumbered faction gets 385 quest, and other faction gets 370 quest so not everyone leaves.

And that is about the extent of how far this kind of system could be stretched.

Anyway, I’m out of those “bonus-system fair/not fair I deserve more” discussions. Will be happy to discuss and support another, completely different and reasonable system tho.