Defend Saurfang?

I think she’s a great Warchief and an interesting character.

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People’s opinions vary. I think the playerbase is very split on who they support and most will run through both options if they want the toy.

Saurfang of course!

I’m fine with a ruthless Warchief either way but I’d prefer the one that has a proven track record of serving the Horde.
Sylvanas’ intent with her power seems to be first to herself and then to serving the Horde.

Anyone who’s read Christie Golden’s Before the Storm also knows that she not the kind of leader who believes in individual personal freedoms either and will quite casually delete her own forsaken if they prove to have the “wrong attitudes”.
The Forsaken are also her most cherished people, everything and everyone else is useful to varying degrees but ultimately always expendable.

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what is the phrase for someone who betrays a betrayer?

yes actually they are both betrayers, the only difference is, sylvanas betrayed her people - she have her own people killed (surprise, starting with her own forsaken who were MEMBERS of the horde), and saurfang betrayed her. sylvanas was the first betrayer and saurfang the second, that’s a fact.

but we can go even farther back - she let the wrathgate happen knowing that horde soldiers were about to be killed and did nothing to stop it. that’s one kind of betrayal too, that she already did before she was even a warchief. what can you expect of her then?

(blizzard has a bad habit of retaining important lore moments for books - or like the wrathgate incident not telling at all - and players can’t learn about those happenings in the game itself. this should change because it causes comprehension problems like this case.)

anyone who kills or give an order to kill their own people is anything but a great leader of those people. i don’t want to make real life parallels but if a nation’s leader gives an order to kill their own probably will be seen as a dictator and the people ought to depose him if they can. those who think killing their own is “cool” and an example to follow are probably very young yet and don’t have any bad experiences in their own country.

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And who took hers? Only ya boy Arthas. Standup chap, I hear.

Im sorry Puny i like you and all but i agree with some people.If you think Sylvanas is a good warchief, you’re evil and soulless.

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I dont understand why would you follow a mad woman that does not know what she is doing and she kills of her Horde sacrifices them for her own agenda and give 0% F*s about her Horde how can you like the soulless witch is beyond me but whatever floats your boat i guess.

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She is a strong independent woman who is morally grey! What’s not to like?

I don’t think she is. Her motives are very clear.

The nebulous notion of ‘honour’ is morally grey.
Saurfang is quite happy to kill for the Horde when it suits his ethical code.

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Did I say he was? What does that even have to do with it? Nothing. That’s what.

I agree on the interesting character, but imo the forsaken shouldn’t even be part of the horde. They were shoe-horned in during early WoW development and it shows. They have a totally different outlook on the world and everything in it from the rest of the horde. They should have either been npcs or be their own faction (but then again I think night elves and their nature spirit allies should have been a seperate faction from the alliance as well). This to basically use the factions from WC3.

Anyway… Sylvanas is clearly not long for the role of warchief. What path they’ll put her on remains to be seen, but it probably won’t be one that will simply turn her into a raidboss. That will cause too much backlash and Blizzard is in enough hot water already.

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… Traitor for standing up to a demented, sadistic, psychopatch that kills civillians

And dishonorable for breaking a blood oath i presume? That demands he stand by and watches, participates in the butchery of the innocent?

Boy is your moral code utterly F’ed up…
Edit: I really dont think you know your lore at all. Especially concerning the Horde’s past and Saurfangs trauma.

Wanna side with Sylvanas. Thats fine. But calling Saurfang a dishonorable traitor… god damn is that the most ignorant thing I’ve ever heard.

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Those in Alliance shaped houses made of glass.

I like the strong independant part but everything evil she did makes me hate her to no end its unforgivable and punishable by death also she is not moraly grey you must be clueless its hularious.

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We’re playing for the horde which violently invaded Azeroth killed tens of thousands of humans and destroyed thousands of cities and villages and Saurfang was one of the leaders of the invaders. The truth is that Saurfang became so old and soft now that he refuses himself and betrays horde. Yes he is a traitor.

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So he’s an honorable traitor then?

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Clueless or having a sly dig at blizzard :wink:

Everything is morally grey in this expansion remember :rofl:

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First of all. He’s no traitor. THe horde is a freaking mess. He represents true horde values.

And you’re damn right he’s honorable.

Following orders blindly is the behavior of a robot. Not a free thinking honorable warrior.

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Ah i got ya morally grey haha good joke :rofl:.

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I see it - definitely.

But what type of war with the Alliance would he prefer?
The Garrosh version the Horde lost?
Or would he prefer no war at all?

No war at all this time because there is no need for war. Sylvanas is the aggressor. She attacked for 0 reason other than her being butthurt over losing some stuff to Greymane.

She’s utterly unfit to be leader.

Saurfang is a warrior that partakes in good wars. Honorable wars for survival, defense, or glory if challenged.

But none of this occured. It certainly could’ve occured but Blizzards writers always throw horde leaders under the bus and everything gets more complicated than it needs to be.

Garrosh’s war before he went mad in MOP was as warcraft as it would ever be. We are stronger, we are better, we’re gonna smash you.

Nice and simple. And Garrosh never even killed civillians so its all good.

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