Whistle and HS don’t teleport you to exact point you want to reach while avoiding all the terrain and aggro.
To be honest I don’t even care if it comes back or not at this point, it isn’t going to make the game more enjoyable (for me anyway). I mean the whole reason people want it back is so they can skip more of the game to get to their objectives. Though I suppose in Warmode I would finally be able to make use of the Net-O-Matic 5000 in relevant zones.
lol skip content by flying. there is no content when you are done with the main story XD
and if you ever played horde … to reach some profession trainers is quite a run 
No flying in Suramar was ok, because mobs weren’t aggressive. Flying is mostly needed to avoid unnecessary combat, that “slows” you down, but doesn’t provide any meaningful gameplay or rewards, i.e. just wastes your time. All other arguments are subjective.
- Immersion - is subjective. As for me, extreme respawn rate ruins my immersion much more, than flying.
- Exploration - ends pretty fast, just after 2-3 weeks
- “Master content - get flying” - content is mastered when main story is completed.
- “Flying = cheat, that allows skipping content” - flying mounts still can neither kill mobs, nor collect items, i.e. content is still done on a ground.
- World PVP - I play with War Mode permanently off, I don’t play content, where excessive tricking into PVP (PVP-flagging) is used (at least without flying).
I prefer to avoid unnecessary combat exactly because I’ve got used to old “non-bloated” content design. I’m casual player and in order to enjoy content, it should meet some criteria. It should be casual- and alt-friendly. I don’t need it to be “challenging”. Leave this thing for M+ and M raids. Not faster content, that takes lesser amount of time, but content, that puts lesser pressure and stress on me. “Boring” content, as some hardcore players call it. And I don’t need WPVP, as it’s very unfair and toxic. Exactly because I don’t need pressure and stress.
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With respect, you are still missing the point.
Flying (or not flying) is a choice - if you don’t want to do it then don’t. It is as simple as that!!
Everything you have said is your opinion. Which is fine and I respect that.
But I stand by what I have posted. This whole discussion is about a particular playing preference and people can say flying is all for convenience, skipping content, etc., because they seem to find the need to label people who want to fly and don’t want to see it limited in any way. The plain fact is you don’t know why a player chooses to fly - or not, unless they tell you.
It is the anti-flyers who have the problem, not the pro-flyers. It is they who should deal with it and leave others to enjoy the game as they wish!!
This thread has gone on too long now in my opinion. I will say it again once last time for those who simply don’t seem to get it or who haven’t bothered to read the whole thread:
If you don’t like flying then don’t do it. No-one forces you to, it is your choice. But please, for the love of WoW, stop labelling players who do enjoy it and want to fly as lazy, convenient, casual and all the other multitude of things I’ve seen. Simply accept they play differently to you and move on. And also stop trying to ‘influence’ Blizzard to put restrictions on flying simply because you feel it negatively impacts your game experience. It only will if you let it!!
I’m done with this thread now. Good day to you all and have fun. ![:slight_smile:](https://d1bg94bbsh66ji.cloudfront.net/en/wow/images/emoji/twitter/slight_smile.png?v=6" ":slight_smile:")
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I very much appreciate reading your posts. Personally, I’m sort of a “casual-tryhard”, meaning I am pretty casual in terms of how much time I spend in the game, but it is the challenging content that I enjoy. I would like the world to be challenging as well (or at the very least interesting) and Blizzard has largely failed to make it so in BfA, and I don’t think that flying is the antidote even if I agree with a lot of what you say. Like I said earlier, and maybe you’re the only pro-flyer that can understand me when I say it: flying is a band-aid on a much more deep-rooted problem. It is not a fix. The problem I’m alluding to you’ve already put words to yourself:
And I agree. The problem is in the overall design of the in-game content, especially when it comes to the world quests.
I am a filfthy casual, give us our flying!
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Couldn’t agree more. People wouldn’t crave for flying so badly if the zones were much friendlier. And there are alternative band-aids in my opinion that is not flying:
- Suramar gave us disguises to run around without aggro’ing (or at the very least heavily reduced it). This was a fun experience and it would be great if we can have more (obviously, zones would have to be designed around it).
- Those lucky enough to get Prydaz could also just put it on and get to places without worrying about constantly being dazed. We have this back in some Azerite pieces but it’s a very small percentage since you’d have to have the right Azerite gear and level for it.
- Coarse Leather Barding. Honestly people just don’t know about this. Goes for about 50-100g on the AH, 2hours no daze. Greatest thing ever for outdoors.
This is where I highly disagree with you. I’m also casual, so outdoor content is the most I experience throughout my time. And it’s because of that that I wish it was more challenging.
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Yeah, when Blizzard were going to remove flying, they promised some “better” outdoor design. Problem is - current outdoor design isn’t better. As for me, yeah, flying itself isn’t that important. It’s about three things. Blizzard think, they are important and fun, but not for me. It would be better, if this three things would be optional. I.e. players, who like them, would be able to do it, but I would be able to skip them.
- Exceeding combat. Blizzard think, that killing 100500 mobs is very fun thing. That’s why density of mobs and respawn rate are extremely high. That’s why they do everything to prevent us from skipping mobs - too wide aggro, dazes, dismounts, cc, etc. That’s why they always add mob killing to some other activities, such as mining, fishing, etc. But I’m not fan of exceeding combat. I just want to do, what I come for.
- Navigation puzzles. May be some people like them. May be some people like to have some “knowledge” about navigation, i.e. to be proud, that they know some routes and ways to skip things. But I just don’t like them.
- PVP. All of a sudden, Blizzard think, that all players should like PVP. Even if they play on PVE server, they just don’t know about PVP or don’t understand, how fun it actually is. So, they try to trick (force) players into PVP, so they would be able to “try” it. Problem is, PVP is unfair and toxic. That’s why it’s way to stressful for me.
So, real better ground content would be about providing some options, i.e. different ways to complete the same task. Not just forced “jump puzzle” or “stealth action”. If I want to complete it “my way”, I should be able to, not to be forced to do it the way, Blizzard think is best for me (it’s not).
For me most important thing - is replayability. I’m casual player, so I don’t engage into content, that puts to many obligations on me. That’s why there are fewer kinds of content, that suit me, in this game, so I have to replay them, if I want to play this game in a long term. And if content is way too tedious and/or annoying, then I won’t want to replay it. And if I won’t play it, then I don’t want to even start.
It is actually you who don’t get it while you blaming us for the same. Saying things like ‘‘it’s your opinion’’ or ‘‘that’s subejctive’’ is also funny and irrelevant since this whole conversation is about personal opinions.
As i said we get what you are saying, and we read the comments don’t worry, you want to skip every obstacles devs put in your way (aggro, travel time, mazes, getting lost… etc) in order to reach whatever the things you consider as reward (items, reputation, herb, ore… etc). That’s why OP said it is like fast food, insta-gratificaiton. It’s not ‘loving flying’, it is a result of ‘hating the content and game’ and being addicted to new things to handled to you that you probably never even use or get bored quite fast (mount, toys, allied races, 34234 alt chars… etc).
And i already said it shouldn’t be a choice. IWIN button shouldn’t be a choice either. If it was a choice, you would use it, i would use it, so the content would become irrelevant a lot faster. Should IWIN button become a choice too?
You are still portraying it as if we want opression while you are all for free choice, which is laughable. There should be restrictions in order to keep content relevant for longer and calling it ‘‘forcing to do content’’ is absurd. Same is being said about allied races which is also absurd. You are not forced to do anything, you can quit anytime you want. Noone is forcing you into anything at all. Meanwhile we want game to restrict our choices (including not giving an IWIN button) so we can’t consume the content too fast.
I get what you’re trying to say but I disagree with your use of a hyperbole. What exactly is too high of a rate? Because to my recollection not every gathering node has a mob nearby you aggro. And even if they do you have plenty of CC or mobility abilities to get away from mobs.
If we’re talking about aggro’ing mobs along the way, you also have ways to combat dismounts or dazes. You don’t have to fight. The options are all in the game if you want them. You might have to put in some extra effort but it’s not an unreasonable amount in my opinion.
Again, I get not wanting exceeding combat, but if we’re talking about activities such as gathering or even getting from point A to point B, “exceeding” is quite a stretch in my opinion.
Well, why is their opinion ‘funny’ when you seem certain of yours, either both are subjective and irrelevant, or neither are?
I’m not certain you have read the whole topic, there have been a lot of reasons people have given, that are not about skipping obstacles… Like, a Lot of reasons…
I love flying, I also love the game. I love doing the Content, and I don’t expect things handed to me, I expect to earn them. Also, What the heck do Alts have to do with this? or Allied races? (Just a reminder, no one actually asked for those, Blizzard just announced them), they have nothing to do with Flying at all…
Umm, No. I would find that a boring and unfulfilling experience, being able to Fly after having completed content however, is not an I Win button, that is not even a logical comparison…
Actually, it is correct, not laughable, it is factually correct. People who do not want Flying actively wish to constrain how other people play the game, when they themselves can choose to play it their way. PvP bores the heck out of me, should I say that PvP should be removed from the game? No. Because I accept that some people like it, and more power to them, if they want to do it, let them do it, I can just choose -not- do it. Proclaiming that PvP should be removed ‘and here’s why’ would however be an unpleasant move. It doesn’t effect me, I don’t have to engage in it, so why should I care?
The first part of your statement is incorrect, the second part is correct. Once you have done content, You have done it. There should not be restrictions when you have already -done- the quests available to you, that’s madness. Equally, No one is ‘Forced’ to do Content, That would be as absurd as saying people were ‘Forced’ to use Flying…
By ‘We’ you mean ‘I’ You don’t speak for me, I’ve levelled to 120, I’m enjoying the game, Zuldazar is a pain in the backside to Navigate, and some WQ’s I just give up on because it frankly is the most obnoxiously designed zone I have ever seen in all my years of playing this game.
Flying is not an ‘I Win’ button, never has been, and won’t be when they bring it in.
I agree that people should do the content on the ground first, and -then- get flying, but to say there should not be flying is basically saying that you do not like the Game franchise. Flying has been part of Azeroth’s warfare since the WC games, since before World of Warcraft was even released, it is ignoring the Lore, the Novels, the In game Events, the Questing experience, it is ignoring everything about the setting. Basically, if you don’t like flying in WoW, nobody is forcing you to. That is a stable and sensible argument. Equally, whilst I will try not to judge you, if you don’t like flying in WoW, then you don’t like the WoW game, Maybe take some time away, have a break?
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I didn’t say their opinions are funny, i said trying to disparage other people’s opinion by saying things like ‘‘it your opinion’’, ‘‘it’s subjective’’ is irrelevant and funny because every comment in here are subjective and opinions.
Flying is an almost IWIN button that lets you skip everything. No items or abilities combined can give this convenience. Flying = i avoid everything devs put on my way, so their work was for nothing. Flying is above everything else and it should be an end game item. There is no such thing as ‘‘non-flyers wish to constrain how other people play the game’’; there are also people who want everything to given them right away, would you call yourself an oppressor since you would be against to that? Ofcourse not. So… what is your point? Just because they ‘love it’ and think it is fun when they get all the items, mounts right away, should they have it? Being against that is oppression? Seriously, what is your point exactly?
And i ofcourse don’t speak on behalf of everyone. ‘we’ = people who want flying to be introduced later.
And again, ‘we’ do not hate flying. We certainly love it more than you do since yours isn’t even loving it but it is about hating the content itself.
Simple situation: quest tells you to kill 10 mobs, collect 10 items and kill 1 boss. What amount of extra mobs to kill would you consider exceeding? +100%, +200%, +500%? How about killing the same mob again, again and again due to almost instant respawn? How about not being able to get out of combat at all with all consequences, such as not being able to mount or eat?
some one handing out free money, you come along and forces him to stop, oppression or ?
imo it is just a way of travel, nothing is given to me, but according to you its like giving money away for free, and you want to stop it
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That was my question to you, you were the one using a hyperbole. Personally any quest that has me “collect” something I expect that for each of those things there’s a mob or two I probably have to kill. But a mob or two really doesn’t take that long. Let’s take a simple Azerite WQ where you heal 5 wounds. Nothing about killing, right. There are some wounds that are empty, others have 1 to 3 mobs there. If there are no mobs on any then you are done in less than 30 seconds. If there is mob or three per wound you take like what, 2 maybe 3 minutes to finish. That’s also 400% to 500% more time. You can also just cc or kite the mobs and you’ll also have it done in less. But 2 minutes is reasonable. So, again I am asking YOU: What exactly is too high of a rate? How exactly is what we currently have exceeding?
Again, total exaggeration. If I get dazed by a mob or two and I kill them, there is PLENTY of time before they respawn. Mobs have like what, 30-60 second respawn?
ahahahah…oh yeEEAahh…IF you outnumbered the opposition 10 to 1…come across one solitary person yourself and you both creep past each other pretending they aren’t there…you know?..the way it’s always been…-.-
he is not exaggerating, it does happen, mostly when its crowded with players killing mobs, the reason is this… you cant kill all mobs of same type in an area without a few respawn instantly, and it could be the mob you just killed that respawn instantly, I have that happen to me a few times, not often
Does it matter? Warmode ruined wpvp more than flying ever did
Sadly this isnt the case there in a fair zones in BFA which are questing zones for levelers and for WQ’s which have high about of mobs because they also drop mounts and farmed alot .
Because you dont agree with somebody i must implore you stop saying “hyperbole and exaggeration” does not make you argument valid .
And try to be calm and polite .