Delay flying until 9.0

Community General Discussion
517

Yesterday, thrown into overflow shard full with Horde. Response? Couldn’t finish a single WQ since I was killed on the spot without any chance to fight back every time. So I joined a call to Arms group to escape the overflow shard. Did took my revenge and killed a few more with them than the 10 I needed aswell. Could have invited people myself but raid is no quest credit and group of 5 would just be camped. Turned out the group I joined was on a fairly balanced shard, bit more Horde but managable.

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518

Well you know, if people have flying and such, that 40 man raid is not able to farm that poor one guy cause he would just fly away. That would leave 40 players with nothing to do! If we add flying any sooner than patch 13.0 (and that is way too soon!) we have to at least add some sort of training dummies in most popular camping zones for those poor people to whack. :roll_eyes::grimacing::stuck_out_tongue_closed_eyes:

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519

Sounds like a well designed system to me.

Its pretty damn sad that you actually have a valid point with that…

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520

Just to clarify i am solid pro flyer! And those 40 people can go … well you know … and the horse they rode in on. :stuck_out_tongue_winking_eye:

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521

It’s a solution yeah, untill the factions get balanced (doesn’t have to be 50/50 since that’s impossible) those overflow shards shouldn’t exist anymore. Kinda sucks to be 1 vs everybody else, ouch and very annoying but at the same time boring for the people who wanna do WPvP and only able to find 1 enemy!

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522

I quite liked not having flying as it meant more exploration and figuring routes out but that was a long time ago. I do think it’ll cause issues with world pvp, especially warfronts but more of an issue could be dismounting mid air when you drop into a different shard. I’ve been a taxi to others using the sandstone drake and seen them plummet to their demise from crossing one area to another in Eastern Kingdoms, so hopefully that will be fixed. Not having flying was great for a while but we’ve had the expac so long now flying is definitely overdue. No doubt we’ll all soon be getting dotted by floating Shadowpriests!

523

Do you want the rest of the playerbase to quit? flying should be released earlier not later.

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524

flying was not a sin in TBC. it was cleverly used as a piece of content in and of itself. numerous areas where the new content (dailes), rep grinds and mat farms took place:
Skettis,
North above Shattrath (ogres),
Twilight Ridge,
Plane of the Elements,
Ogri’la,
The Crystal Spine/Bash’ir Landing,
Throne of Kil’jaeden,
Netherwing Ledge.

And of course, even dungeons and a raid… Tempest Keep.

This was sorta repeated, but to a smaller scale in WotLK with the raids Ulduar and Naxx, and significant parts of Storm Peaks and Icecrown needing flying to complete content.

while flying was utilized a little bit in cata (only to 4 of the instances), and MoP (again only a few instances and the daily area in Valley of the Four Wind i think. i didn’t play MoP while it was current), it was used nowhere near how it was in TBC

in WoD, nothing is planned around flying, CAUSE BLIZZ DIDN’T WANT US HAVING FLYING! We didn’t beg i would say. We demanded, and again, the sub drop during WoD shows this.

This continued in legion, but to a lesser degree cause blizz knew they would have to capitulate later in the expansion, but for the most part, legion would not need to have content based around flying, as flying would only be “current” for the latter part of the ToS patch, the broken shore. But even there, nothing on the broken shore needs flying cause you can get there on foot.

Flying is only loathed by some people i think, because it has not been utilized to its full potential since TBC really. personally, i love flying. its fast, the scenery is far more beautiful from the air, and it really does stop me wasting time bumping into pointless trash mobs and mountains/falls. it just makes getting to content so much more peaceful.

so maybe the issue is that what flying is used FOR needs to be revamped beyond just actually flying.

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525

Your whole post is very good but i would like to add here, that Cata was probably most flying friendly expansion, it expanded flying everywhere in Kalimdor and Eastern Kingdoms and it let you fly from the start of the expansion when leveling in new areas (so not having to wait for max level). Especially Deepholm would have been practically impossible to do without flying. Cata was truly built with flying in mind from the start, each new areas having lot of places you needed flying mount to reach . :smiley:

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526

“-appeases casuals” Please give us a link where every single non casual player states that they don’t want flying.

“-ruins w pvp” w pvp is already ruined even without flying mounts, that’s why there are more people with war mode turned off.

“-ruins immersion” Not getting dismounted every minute by unavoidable mobs certainly wouldn’t ruin my immersion.

“-ruins the devs work in creating great world/zones” No it’s not. We already saw the zones from the ground for 9 months, and we still would be able to see it from above while traveling.

“-everyone has so unique weird thing for a mount looks like a clown show” That’s the case with grounds mounts as well, or should they remove everything and give everyone one horse?

I understand that you don’t want flying, but the best thing about flying is that you don’t have to. You can still use your ground mount to travel if you want to, but i don’t see why others shouldn’t be able to fly just because you don’t want to.

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527

I think instant teleportation to everyhwere I want would be even better, I mean the good thing with instant teleportation would be that you can still use your mounts to travel if you want to, but i dont see why others shouldn’t be able to instant teleport everywhere just because you don’t want to.

528

Didnt any post here but my 3 cents:

  1. Enabling flying will motivate me to do WQ. Probability that I will do WQ will rise from 0.1% to 5%.
  2. Maybe mats for pots/flasks will get to affordable level
  3. We should have more teleport hubs. Even using flymaster is making me wanna do something else. Because why the hell should I wait 5 minutes to get from one zone to another. There should be at least 6 teleport hubs in all main zones (after completing quests).
529

Bury this thread where noone can find it - don’t talk about it ever. Do not reply about what happened into this thread. Now go and never return.

“There will be always Juicyx”

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530

They can’t, because they never did. Blaming ‘Casuals’ is the current “I’m right because if you don’t agree I will give you a funny name” argument. Fun fact, what most of these people call ‘Non Casuals’ I would actually call Casual. You sit around in cities waiting for dungeons, raids or PvP to pop? Yeah. That is Casual. I don’t care what your raid progress is, you are playing it without any effort apart from the one bit you like. Heavens forfend anyone else does that…

Again, these are the pretty lies the PvP crowd like to tell themselves. Flying ruined WpvP! Garrisons ruined Wpvp! Class Order Halls ruined Wpvp, Tuesdays ruined WPvP! Very rare you will get an honest PvPer who goes “Actually, we ruined Wpvp ourselves, by forming gank squads, Blizzard literally just gave us a new toy to replace the one we broke, first thing we did? We broke it” Riddle me this, if Flying ruined Wpvp, how come people were still complaining about it at the start of WoD where there was -no- flying. With Indecent haste they changed the mantra to “Uh, n-no, Garrisons ruin Wpvp”
Why can’t they be honest, and just admit they want a straightforwards scrap. In fact don’t even bother with terrain, that just gets in the way,

Let me just get this right. Let me just get this absolutely right. We’re talking about a franchise set in a game world where the various races have aerial cavalry and foes since the very start. An integral part of the game world, before the MMORPG was even released, and now suddenly flying ruins immersion?

Get out.

Not Having Flying would break Immersion more, “So these uh, Druid of the Talon folks” “Shhh, we don’t talk about them, it upsets the PvP’ers” “Oh, right, well, the Wildhammer Dwarves then, they-” “Shhh, we don’t talk about them, it upsets the PvP’ers” “Wait, are you just saying Flying things don’t exist?” “Shhhh, yes, bad for immersion!”

“Umm, I’m not sure Immersion means what you think it does, it means immersing yourself in a game setting, in this case Azeroth. Azeroth has Aerial units, always has had, if you don’t like that, maybe this isn’t the game for you?”

Exactly!

That sounds like a 'Not playing it as an MMORPG but as an MMO ’ problem. You don’t get that on RP Realms, not from the RP’ers anyway. Maybe if more people played the game properly, exploring all three play styles, this would happen less.

Just to clarify there, I actually agree with every point you were making Deinn, I just quoted you for ease of refuting the tired old arguments against flying.

Hmm, Not sure what that would add to the game, apart from sheer convenience. I mean its not like Flying where you are actually controlling your character and exploring.

That is true, and on RP Realms I imagine people would still use mounts to travel. I mean Brigante Summerisle does not have a Hearthstone, not for Dazar’alor, Dalaran, Trueshot Lodge or any of those places. He wants to go there, he has to travel there.

As for instantly teleporting places, that’s what those Casuals do who sit in cities and just raid and do dungeons. That’s not playing the game. That is just lazy. But hey, if they want to waste their Sub that way, then that is their problem, not mine.

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531

Same as leveling,if u dont wanna fly then DONT,but gtfo from others no one is forcing u to fly

532

I think Blizzard could add flying without any gating to the game if they also added some downside to it. Then it would be an actual decision between flying or staying on the ground. One could be an generell for all PvP talent, similiar to the first row of pvp talents. Giving players an anti air cannon:

All numbers need testing to find appropriate ones
Talent 1: Big Fat Anti Air Rocket
Target: Flying players only
Range: 100 - 1000 yards
Fires a B.F.A.A.R towards a player, dismounts and stuns them for 10 seconds (no cleanse with insignia)

Talent 2: Dirty hook
Range 100 - 1000 yards
Targets flying players only
Fires a long D.H towards a flying player dismounting and stunning them for 4 seconds pulling them towards you.

Talent 3: Sticky Anti Air Bomb
Range 500 - 100 yards
Target flying players only
Fires a S.A.A.B towards a flying player. When hit the player will be dismounted and the S.A.A.B will blow up after 5 seconds dealing moderate to high damage and stunning the target for 6 seconds.

Would be fun. I would turn on WM just to ground some flying alliances. :slight_smile:

No one is forcing you to use a ground mount either, so why are you complaining? If you don’t like that there is no flying no one forces you to stick around :slight_smile:

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533

Not at all. We don’t want it because it disengages you from the world. There is no such thing as ‘‘flying utilized to it’s potential’’, since it is a tool that give you the ability to avoid the world.

Adding some floating isles on top of BFA zones will not justify people’s want to avoid the world, will not justify ‘picking that herb without aggro’. In older expansions those zones required flying could have included some portals, a NPC that lends you a bird to fly there, grappling hooks, lightways… etc. But since they gave flying to everyone, they just put some unreachable areas. Just because there were some unreachable areas, that doesn’t mean now you can avoid the entire world. You want to avoid that mob, and travel time, you want to pick that herb without engaging the world and this has nothing to with ‘‘unreachable zones’’.

So, just like reputation… flying isles, unreachable areas are also irrelevant. All these things boils down to ‘‘i want to avoid the world, avoid the mazes, aggro, roads, rivers… etc’’. The whole point of pro-flyers is

You just want to avoid the game and reach whatever you consider as a price.

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534

That would be awesome. As long as Flying Mounts could attack ground folks as well, that would make perfect sense, Love it. Fantastic idea.

535

glad you enjoyed xD DEEPHOLM!!! i knew i forgot one area! yes, deepholm would have been impossible without flying. tbh, i dont remember too much of cata. i took my first break in cata since the start of TBC and skipped the whole of the FL patch, and the first half of DS. while you are right, it gave flying to everyone in the old world, a lot of peoples argument against flying seems to be about flying as a mode of transport. so i was trying to think of what flying unlocks, like all the zones in tbc. but you are right, with all aspects of flying incorporated, cata giving flying in the old world was a massive boost.

people are already disengaged. like in legion, i am currently doing almost no content in the 6 BfA zones. i am now going back to legion and older content where flying can be used. taking archaeology for example, i know people have said, and i do it too, that they are actively NOT doing archaeology in BfA until flying comes in. instead, they are now doing it in legion. people are sick of taking 10 minutes to get to 2 wq’s beside each other, but because of the landscape, you cant get from one to the other instantly. (mild exaggeration)

if mobs were not getting scaled up every hotfix, if we weren’t getting dazed every second, and if the whole place wasn’t like a maze, and if flight points were more direct, flying might not be such an issue.

i would suggest, people would rather cross a whole flat zone, like say, the barrens on a ground mount, than go between just 2 wq’s in BFA. in the barrens, you can travel in a straight line almost, and the mobs dont interfere with you. in bfa, you cant travel in a straight line for more than a few seconds before something gets in your way. and as blizz are constantly increasing the world mobs stats, it means they are always at least a minor inconvenience for you. and i wont even start on daze. i dont remember daze being such an issue since TBC!

flying could be used to its potential unlike what you think.

people spent a massive amount of time in these zones once they’d cleared the old world. massive. but you could only do them if you had flying.

in the end, flying can only be mostly a faster and more direct means of transport, but it could be used to unlock certain things like in tbc. as capability improves, the ground zones will just more and more complicated, which i dont mind in and of itself cause they do look lovely. but being FORCED to run through them for 50-75% of an expansion will take any appreciation of the beauty away from them.

whatever the reason, i think we all need to just unite:

flying should be available in the game in some (REASONABLE) form the moment you hit lvl cap. either buy it at cap, or a quest chain opens at cap, or an achievement (NON TIME GATED!) can be worked on at cap.

there is only ONE reason not to have flying: WPVP. this is simple fix. you cant fly while WM on.

any other reason i have heard is not really valid, and again, i make the personal statement that not implementing flying at the start of an expansion, ie level cap, is SPITEFUL on behalf of blizzard.

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536

This was never a subject of common agreement, quite the opposite.
Actually, it seems this system and compromise is the best option regarding that constant bipolarization, giving an half/half.

Flying brings a wave of fresh air to the game indeed, but unfortunately it will have a negative impact in wpvp, specially in the invasion zones, where i have pass some hours well entertained, in fact that is one of the most enjoyable things to do in this xpac.

I read somewhere up in this topic that WOTLK had active and good wpvp and i have to say that i dont remember it that way, besides an occasional encounter, or wintergrasp, it was one the worst expacs regarding wpvp.

Actually, im enjoying walking around the zones of this expansion and besides while questing in the beginning, i dont recall the need for flying. The art department made a job well done, not only, but mainly with the scenarios, orthography and connection with each zone theme.

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