Most of the time its the whole groups fault someone leaves.
Either tank is pulling all without waiting or healer is edited by moderator or dps is afk. ITS never just 1 guy.
Just mentioning that we need penalty for leaving m+ shows how edited by moderator this playerbase has become…
Again, why do you think Blizzard has a check-box marked as “completion” in the group finder? Because they know, that not every group wants to do a 90min +10, but some maybe do want that for the vault.
Yeah 100%, if we wipe on a bad trash pull fine, if we wipe on a boss due to a mistake that could have been avoided, I have no problem with just finishing the run.
But like you said if those individuals are wiping nonstop because they shouldn’t be there in the first place, then I just leave as it’s a waste of my time and a waste of their time.
so its not reasonable to leave if the key is obviously not getting timed ?
you cant create a game mode where the sole purpose of playing it is to TIME the dungeon, and then ban players for leaving a run that is doomed and wont be timed. its not completion content.
I disagree with punishing the leaver since I don’t know of a good way to punish such a person.
The reason why having a leaver is so detrimental is the design of the Mythic Plus system in general - the system punishes the Key Holder for another player leaving by depleting the Key and having its level lowered - it is the source of huge friction.
Imagine a change in design where key depletion means that you can try that same key level again - the thing you lose is time (which itself is incredibly precious), but not the key level.
Sure, having a leaver would still waste time, but your key would be safe, which would create less friction in the community.
The current Mythic Plus design penalizes key holders for trusting unknown players and engaging in group content with them.
I myself as a key holder am unwilling to take in any person I do not know myself, or who is not recommended by someone I know due to the double time penalty from failing a key and due to emotional annoyance sue to having to refarm lower level key.
I am aware that since I am unwilling to extend a credit of trust towards strangers when doing my key, I am much, much less likely to actually make new acquaintances through in-game interactions, but currently the cost of failure is prohibitovely high.
By making it so that a failed key doesn’t drop in level, Blizzard will reduce friction, reduce cost of failure, make it less risky to play with strangers and maintain high stakes of success.
If a key is going to easily become a +3, is it reasonable to leave because the party is zerging through it? Why should I be punished if I do so? Noone writes in the comment box that it is going to be a full-zerg no-stops run, and I shouldn’t be expected to consider it the default behaviour.
this would have been a false paralel had it not completely missed the mark by comparing two fundamentally different circumstances.
Clearing a key at +3 means that if you leave the key still can be finished in vast majority of cases.
The argument made by the initial party was that they shouldn’t be forced into investing time into an endeavour they believe is doomed to fail.
The ‘doomed’ part is the crucial difference that makes it impossible foe your paralel to become aa false paralel.
A +3 times key cannot be doomed to fail because not only it is going to be completed on time, it is going to be +3 completed.
BTW I don’t think a leaver should be punished. They just should be marked that they leave keys before time runs out - it’s a statement of the fact, nothing more. And other players in LFM queue should be able to see such a mark.
I’ve been playing wow since vanilla so some of my achieves only go back to 08 when the achievement system was first implemented.
Back then it didn’t matter how many wipes you had, the ultimate goal was to clear, if you was bad most players would tell you but typically constructive feedback ie: “Bro how are you this bad, your rotation is **** you need to work on it.” So you’d take that away and hit training dummy’s.
Now a day’s, all you get is “You’re bad, your whole family needs to die” or in the instance of some Keys I’ve done being called a p******le for a wipe that I wasn’t responsible for and fault lay with dps for not target swapping and hitting the correct add like in Mists. Then rage quitting and leaving the instance upon a single wipe.
Back then you’d address the issue constructively try again with advice given and keep pushing it was that mentality that forged a lot of the top m+ teams and guilds today.
The idea behind the penalty system is to push that agenda and bottle neck the player base into teaching new players as opposed to launching a verbal onslaught, then crying and leaving, with that in mind again in relation to teaching that’s what a lot of friendships and teams where built on, current community mentality and attitude towards M+ Is garbage,
Players need to be held accountable for the impact that their actions can cause and the mentality in regards to M+ needs to change.
I never said that was unreasonable but if someone’s doing like 10% less or something and your throwing a hissy fit over that that’s pretty childish. If their doing 200k and your doing 220k that not an issue
Theyve said ‘as a healer’ about 3 times in tjis thread.
Dont insert yourself intp the last line of a conversation and then complain you arent up to date - you can catch up and then chip im - this time from an informed position.
Hey look its this thread again, with another non-solution to a non-problem.
Dont like the occassional leaver or leaving yourself because the group sucks and takes too long? Dont Pug.
The ONLY thing that needs to happen with the system is that non-timed runs needs to award the full amount of crests as timed runs. This alone would make people think twice before leaving.
As it is currently, if your group is dog and you are only grinding crests, its simply better to find a new group rather than spend 1,5-2x the time completing the current one since you get less crests for non-timed.
People really do be afraid of accountability “Perfectly balanced as all things should be.”
It is a growing issue, reread my previous/latest comment, the whole mentality in regard to M+ currently needs to change including the toxicity behind the mentality, most are going into M+ with a solo mentality and thinking “Clearly I’m not the issue, the rest of the party is.” then abruptly leaving the instance without elaborating on what they think went wrong other than exchanging a few harsh insults.
For most who are new to content perticularly M+ this will be there first hand experience of entering M+ likely to never re-enter again, it’s a mentality that needs to change, a lot of OG’s will get where I’m getting at with this in regard to team forging and inclusivity/critical and constructive feedback which will better a player.
“Back then you’d address the issue constructively try again with advice given and keep pushing it was that mentality that forged a lot of the top m+ teams and guilds today.”
I don’t do 220k dps as a retri. I do 100-300k as the healer, depending on how the tank pulls and how much healing I have to do.
I’m doing 1m+ on retri, only dip below 1m if the tank is pulling badly, and I’m not even 615.
You really shouldn’t be doing 200k dps at ilvl 615 or around there as a dps yet I’ve seen similar numbers 3 times on DPS and people have left their keys and they’ve thrown a fit over them leaving.
