Feedback: Warlocks

This thread is dedicated to leaving feedback on Warlocks in Midnight. Look in this thread and in the Midnight Alpha Development Notes for adjustments and bugfixes made throughout the testing period.

Please note that off-topic or inappropriate posts will be strictly removed.

Apex Talents

Many Apex Talents are available for playtesting and may be selected using specialization tree points in the final specialization tree node. The current User interface (UI) is temporary for playtesting purposes and will be replaced with a final UI later in development. As with any test cycle, we will be adding more Apex Talents to the test over time and not all will be available with the start of the alpha test.

To help us refine Apex Talents, please consider the following questions as you playtest:

  • How gameplay-impacting, exciting, and fantasy forward is your Apex Talent to you?
  • Are your Apex Talents and new Hero Talents meeting the approachability goals laid out in our Combat for Everyone in Midnight article?
  • Are there cases you would consider not selecting your Apex talent?
  • Does the Apex talent disproportionally favor a particular talent build or Hero Talent tree?

For feedback regarding the changes on making the combat system more approachable for players of all skill levels, leave your feedback in the Combat Approachability feedback thread.

Thank You

We greatly appreciate all your feedback and are very excited for you to test out all the changes in Midnight!

2 Likes

Affliction

Unstable Affliction and Seed of Corruption are returning as Affliction’s main Soul Shard spenders. Malefic Rapture solved a lot of issues that plagued Affliction towards the end of Battle for Azeroth, however, placed a lot of emphasis on rotational setup and increased its overall complexity. Malefic Rapture constantly poses the question “when should I spend my Soul Shards?” and it’s difficult to answer given how many factors impacted its throughput. Additionally, each new damage-over-time (DoT) effect added to Affliction’s arsenal subsequently diluted the throughput of Malefic Rapture which makes it feel less impactful in settings with multiple targets. While we could have easily reduced the number of effects impacting Malefic Rapture, we wanted the answer to the question of Soul Shard spending to be “now” most of the time, outside of pooling for Darkglare.

Overall, we want less conditionals to affect Affliction’s throughput to reduce setup time, increase consistency, and add clarity to when a spell should be cast. For example, Shadow Embrace has been removed, and the damage increase Unstable Affliction provided prior to Shadowlands via its Contagion talent has been omitted. Both effects further dilute the throughput of Affliction and intrude on the identity of Haunt which is to signify a priority target.

Now, to address the elephant in the room: Vile Taint. While many specializations have tools to solve DoT application, DoTs do not define their moment-to-moment gameplay and shouldn’t as that is the realm of Affliction. Agony would lose a lot of texture, and throughput, if its application played out in a similar way to Corruption. In addition, there is less emphasis on having every target afflicted with Agony with the removal of Malefic Rapture as your spender’s throughput is no longer dependent on having Agony active. Since Vile Taint cannot maintain Agony on its own, we’ve removed it and replaced it with Shared Agony – an effect similar to Balance Druid’s Twin Moons. This gives us a controlled, tunable method of scaling Agony application in multi-target situations that maintains the core, DoT-centric gameplay of Affliction.

Lastly, we are introducing a new 1 minute cooldown: Dark Harvest. This is an experimental channeled spell that mirrors Malefic Rapture in some ways but instead of scaling per DoT it only needs a single DoT to maximize its throughput. Let us know what you think about this new cooldown and the other changes to Afflictions as we’re excited to hear your thoughts!


Demonology

Our first goal for Demonology as we move into Midnight is to address Demonology’s reliance on addons to monitor Wild Imp energy to make decisions on when to cast spells like Implosion, Power Siphon, and Summon Demonic Tyrant. To accomplish this, we are removing the energy component from Wild Imps which means that Wild Imps will be around much longer (40 seconds) before disappearing. In efforts to prevent many Wild Imps from running around, we are adding a limit to how many Wild Imps you can have summoned at once that can be increased via multiple talents.

Secondly, we want to take a hard look at Demonology’s ramp time and make adjustments to the number of casts or cooldowns needed to execute high throughput. It’s also important that each spell can stand on its own and doesn’t feel like it exists purely for Demonic Tyrant. Some examples of changes made in service of this goal are: Vilefiend has been folded into Summon Dreadstalkers in the form of a high-level talent and Grimoire: Felguard has been removed.

Lastly, we want to provide better onboarding for new or returning players wanting to play Demonology. Upon reaching level 10, a slew of new spells would fly to your action bar without much explanation and the spells you had used prior were either changed or are now sub-optimal (looking at you, Corruption). Additionally, it’s never communicated to the player of how powerful Summon Felguard is compared to your other demons. To address these problems, we have moved several baseline abilities to the talent tree to reduce confusion and smooth out early leveling.

These changes make up a huge shift in Demonology’s gameplay, so please let us know your thoughts! We’ll continue to iterate based on our own playtesting and your feedback.


Destruction

Overall, we’re fairly happy with the current state of Destruction. That said, we did want to make some changes going into Midnight to streamline its gameplay and reduce the amount of conditional power Destruction relies on, such as temporary damage windows or maintenance buffs.

As a Destruction Warlock, we want your Chaos Bolt and Rain of Fire spells to feel impactful and to accomplish that we need to cut a lot of the temporary increases so we can move that power into those spells baseline. Now that a lot of those effects have been trimmed, we can make tuning adjustments based on data provided through testing and feedback.

5 Likes

Hey, Motoko from Icy Veins/Council of the Black Harvest with few observations, mostly from a high level perspective without delving too deep into the details:

Affliction

Albeit skeptical at first at the loss of Malefic Rapture, the theme consolidation feels quite strong with a gameplay as close as a DoT purist class with the inherent friction associated with management.

Unstable Affliction being bugged in the current build makes commenting on uncapped stacks gameplay difficult, but the biggest difficulty for any player will be to determine how to best use Dark Harvest extension and Darkglare in a sequence.

Affliction probably plays the best on alpha, across all warlock specs:

  • A bigger emphasis on Nightfall makes the spec dynamic and exciting
  • Agony stacks reduction and the various shard discount/refund in the spec alleviate the ramp up time of the past, and the shard economy is not as heavily reliant on the dot itself
  • Haunt bombing is very fun and effective, especially in situations with dying targets

Demonology

Again, I like the theme consolidation, especially in the talent tree with various areas defined by talents centered around Wild Imps, Felguard, and Dreadstalkers.

I get that simplification had to happen because of combat addon removal and I am not against it per se, but the current gameplay is very dull and unexciting.

  • Modal spender with Hand of Gul’dan turning into Eye of Gul’dan is an interesting proposition in order to make Implosion usage easier to understand, but at the same time it feels too scripted?
  • Demonic Tyrant has lost its identity of commander, since the only affected unit in a meaningful way are Dreadstalkers
  • Are there any reason to not run the max amount of Wild Imps talents?

The removal of various cooldowns and consolidation into other existing abilities, without adding any reactive gameplay element give this spec a very static, predetermined gameplay feel, with little hope in regards to satisfaction or accomplishment that should accompany mastering a spec. :frowning:

Destruction

Perhaps the least finalised of the three specs, having to interact with the tree was a daunting task just to try to make sense of the intentions behind it.

  • simplifying the amount of conditional debuffs/damage amplification was long overdue and a positive step
  • Shadowburn is back as an execute tool should create an easier to understand use case with Fiendish Cruelty working like Warrior Sudden Death
  • current iteration of Roaring Blaze is great and fun, opening up the gameplay for the likes of Internal Combustion for example
  • Lake of Fire is an interesting idea but quite limited in its applicability and the visuals of molten cracks/fissures do not exactly match the name of the talent itself.

Capstones are very puzzling and there is definitely mismatch in their value.

  • Soul Fire is substantially stronger in both its casted value and consistent Avatar of Destruction contribution, whereas
  • Dimensional Rifts only get Avatar from Chaos Tear, and have 30% of the damage/shard bits generation on average
  • Mark of Ruvaraad is interesting as concept but equally underwhelming in its effect
  • Chaos Incarnate and Channel Demonfire choice node are functional like they have been in the past.

There is not much excitement working towards the end of the third gate in terms of talent unlocks as Destruction.

I would lie if I did not mention how the loss of Decimation will be felt, in terms of both reactive gameplay and moment of excitement. Hardcasting a 3.5s Soul Fire that does the damage of Haunt every 45s does not remotely offer the same effect.

Apex Talents

All three are similar in their functionality, being damage procs tied to rotational spells.

  • Shadow of Nathreza is what enables Haunt bombing and in general adds emphasis to the spell itself in a fun way.
  • Dominion of Argus is loosely more pets/stronger pet/random rarely proccing pet? Do we really need a third dog without a third core proc? Again, functionally fine, just less focused of a theme.
  • Embers of Nihilam is perhaps the most controversial one, mainly by its animation being very flat, straight and not very chaotic as the rest of the spells. It will be the most visible to players because of its frequency.
10 Likes

I’ve had a chance to play a bit of demonology, so hoped to offer my feedback from the perspective of a casual player. (Primarily a solo player, approaching this from the perspective of someone who finds the appeal of demonology to be its survivability and flexibility in solo and world content situations, rather than raids or mythics. Just to give a little context to my feedback.)

Demonology

At the moment it feels fairly static, a bit repetitive, and less interesting. In its current state in TWW it’s my favourite spec, in its current form in Midnight I feel less excited about it. Serviceable, but just a bit boring.

Removed spells I’m missing

  • I’m feeling the loss of Bilescourge Bombers a lot, especially while running delves. It feels like it has left a bit of a gap in the spec to me.
  • Grimoire: Felguard being removed doesn’t feel great either. Instead of simplification, it just feels like gameplay options are being taken away.

Feel of the spec

  • Honestly, it just feels a bit boring. It feels much more of a fixed rotation. Fairly prescriptive.
  • It does feel simplified, so with that being one of the aims it has been achieved, but I feel it has also come at the cost of what made demo enjoyable.
  • This one is just a personal preference, but capping imps at 9 takes away from one of the fun elements of the class fantasy.

Smaller notes

  • There feels like a gap for a reliable instant cast opener (especially for open world content). I used to like using soul strike for that (with the added benefit of it generating a soul shard and directing my felguard to where it’s needed) and I know others who used corruption.
  • I’m undecided on the changes to drain life and health funnel. At first I thought rolling it in together was useful, but it’s feeling surprisingly cumbersome while using it.
  • I miss my wild imps
3 Likes

Sorry for Walltext!

Here are my first impressions playing the warlock in Beta: first of all I’m very happy that the class has finally found a greater identity (I’m thinking of the different talents that should, on paper, improve its tankiness) and despite a general pruning it was understood that the class suffered enormously from excessive cuts and it was remedied and I’m referring mainly to the possibility of having mortal coil and howl of terror / shadowfury, while before in pvp you always had a bit of a feeling of “I’m missing some buttons”
The idea is that the developers have finally listened to the community’s feedback, and for that, I thank you

The class tree is definitely much more organized and less illogical. Several completely useless talents have been eliminated, and some new ones are truly interesting. Fortunately, the very misguided idea of ​​"pacts" referring to curses has been put aside. Here are some general considerations:

  • Burning Rush should be moved and inserted into the central tree dedicated to movement utilities (I would see it very well in place of Fel Synergy, always with two talent points). I think the dynamics of Burning Rush itself should be changed. Instead of having a continuous sprint based on the percentage of health sacrificed (just one millisecond more is enough to not have any benefits in motion but lose a substantial portion of health), it would be better if the sprint had a predefined duration and with a defined amount of health sacrificed
  • Infernal Beneficiary should be backed by the Fel Synergy talent (which should be moved to the right side of the tree near the drain life talents) as the latter has always been very weak
  • Curses should be relocated elsewhere, they are too central and important even though paradoxically we can do without them (they are very weak especially in PvP, COEx doesn’t work at all against the classes that should be slowed down, weakness is useless without amplify curse, COT slows down casting very little in PvP and nowadays most casters have few casts and the rest are instant). They should certainly at least be grouped into a single talent and not two
  • Foul Mouth is placed in the talent tree a bit randomly like the other two curses and also with the capstone blights, it would probably be better to group them together and modify Foul Mouth into Amplify Curse so as to make them AOE and with CD (having a constant COEx AOE in a battleground must not be a very nice thing, and it is definitely OP). The curse of Weakness and the curse of Tongue should be merged as they were some time ago, slightly reducing the target’s damage so that it is a penalty for both a caster and a melee player/mob
  • Dark Accord, losing Resolute Barrier, becomes of little use unless the CD is reduced by 1 minute and not 45 seconds. In any case, it would be interesting to replace Dark Accord/Strenght of the Will with Resolute Barrier, so as to have a CD of 3 minutes but with a CD reduction based on the hits received
  • Oppresive Darkness should also make Shadowfury instant, it’s too iconic of a destruction ability and it would be appropriate to be able to prefer it to HOT
  • Frequent Traveler is a dream, but I admit that the Gateway Mastery PvP talent associated with it is becoming excessively overkill. Perhaps a change to the PvP talent would be in order
  • The blights capstones have nothing logical to do with the tree path; they should be placed near the curses themselves. However, there’s a lot of redundancy with Foul Mouth
  • Soulburn should be removed and backed by spells that can benefit from it. If there’s a shard, the spell will be empowered, otherwise it won’t. It doesn’t make logical sense in the central tree path. The real capstone for me is Frequent Traveler

Affliction:
Thanks for finally removing Malefic Rapture from the game, but I hope Unstable Affliction doesn’t replace it. The AOE system is definitely faster and more fun
There are some issues:

  • the Apex Talent makes Haunt too imposing, and it might become difficult to balance in the future. The summoned Nathrezim has nothing to do with the Affliction theme; many will say that the warlock summons demons to control them, but they forget that not all warlocks have the in-depth demonic knowledge to summon certain Greater Demons.
  • Malefic Grasp is a great spell, many wanted it, but I would suggest that the capstone be Malefic Grasp/Death Bolt so that the nightfall actually transforms the base spell (drainsoul or shadowbolt) effectively, so drainsoul>malefic grasp and shadowbolt>deathbolt

Demonology:
Honestly, I’d given up hope before the latest alpha release, where the gameplay and logic improvements were truly devastating. Finally seeing instant dreadstalkers again made me happy, and even happier to see that demonology will finally have spell lock, too. I’ll add that the Grimoire: Fel Ravager mechanic is truly brilliant.
Here are the critical issues I noticed:

  • the Apex Talents that bring back the Nether Portal concept is a great thing, but it has some problems, including: to get the portal from Argus, you need a certain type of ramp-up with the Tyrant (given the change in dynamics and the return to a higher skill requirement to get the “perfect” Tyrant), so we find ourselves in the “Argus” phase where we would have to download resources… and not have them at all because we used all the CDs to get the “perfect” Tyrant. Therefore, being able to summon greater demons from Argus becomes very complicated with the current 3xHOG requirements. Greater demons from Argus could be passively summoned every 5 seconds, for example. Side note: there are dozens of wonderful demon models in the game, I’m thinking of the Dreadlords in Zereth Mortis… it would be better to use models like that and not those from twenty years ago
  • Eye of Gul’dan and the Hero Diabolist talents “Diabolic Oculi” share the same model, it would be appropriate for the Eye of Gul’dan to become a sort of floating Eye of Sauron
  • The Doomguard’s dynamic is certainly better than the previous one (with implosion), but there’s no logical sequence between the Doom itself and the Doomguard’s summoning. Since it’s a demon that recurs with an AOE attack, the best solution might be for the Doomguard to be applied by the “Hand of Doom” talent (instead of the Doom talent): the HOG applies the Doom upon hitting targets, each HOG reduces the Doomguard’s timer by 3 seconds, and each time the Doomguard explodes (if you take the final Doomguard talent), the Doomguard’s summoning chances will increase based on the number of targets hit. Alternatively, you could partially keep the current dynamic, with the Doomguard’s 2-minute CD, but the CD reduction comes from the HOG and not the Demonbolt
  • Remove Shadowbolt from Demonology and replace it with Demonbolt, which becomes the new filler with the same qualities as Shadowbolt. When you gain a demonic core, Demonbolt is empowered and becomes an instant, more powerful, and grants two shards. If you have shard overcap, Felguard passively charges and hits the target with Immutable Hatred (the current Live one)

Destruction:
surely the triple Conflagrate is very useful, I really like the dynamic of Shadowburn which comes back as an actual execute and with the possibility of proc being usable at any health percentage, but the capstones are really really ugly and there re really a lot of problems in my opinion (much more than the other two specs):

  • Summoner Embrace is a talent that has nothing to do with the spec, just like Affliction, and forces you to use it in all game situations. It’s a problem in PvP because the demon dies very easily, plus Grimoire of Sacrifice has absolutely no positive impact compared to Summoner Embrace in terms of damage, resistance, or utility. The solution would be to go back to just Grimore of Sacrifice as a talent, boosting spell power by, for example, 5%. Furthermore, with Soul Link active, the bonus should be higher or have a 5% flat base damage reduction in addition to the 5% increased stamina
  • It would be preferable if backlash had a lower internal CD, that the proc also worked with direct spells, and that incinerate instant was always a critical hit
  • Lake of Fire is a talent that, aside from its meaningless name when talking about warlock, doesn’t help much in the game because it’s static. My idea would be to make Cataclysm instant, but with a detonation time equal to the cast time itself. Perhaps with a PvP talent, it could be similar to the spell’s initial design, which was to stun and/or knock enemies into range after the explosion
  • The loss of ritual of ruin is too big and makes the spec very bare, it would need a return of the same with 10 shards to summon, with the choice between two nodes, either a Blasfemy that swoops down from the Twisting Nether and does AOE damage or casts chaosbolt
  • Dimensional Rift is once again decidedly weak, and the Avatar of Destruction proc itself is too low. Since it’s a choice node with Soulfire, it should theoretically be an AOE hit. Possible solution: with a CD of 1.5 minutes, open three dimensional portals simultaneously, and each critical hit decreases the spell’s CD. Linking it with Overfiend doesn’t make much sense
  • Soulfire as it is makes no sense except as a raid opener. Increasing its power won’t make a 3.5-second spell attractive. Not with the current game timing. The solution might be to lower the spell’s damage and reintroduce Decimation to make it instant, or make it very fast but without the use of backdraft. And, please, is it possible to change the Soulfire’s graphics and animation, especially the green one
3 Likes

Destruction:

Soul fire being a hard cast feels bad, if it’s on a long cooldown make it a short cast. Having ‘Avatar of destruction’ tied to either soul fire or a random rift is not fun at all, separate soul fire and rift, make avatar tied to just soul fire and give it a short cast time, this way you have a set time for when you can get your Overfiend out.

Shadowburn only being usable below 20% health and doing so little damage will make this a dead talent, make it usable on any health but make it do more damage to targets below 20%, this way it helps with movement, helps tag mobs in open world content but still acts as an execute.

Conflagrate spreading immolate is great, please make it smart enough to always refresh on your current target and to then pick two targets that do not have it already applied. In a large pack you wouldn’t want it to keep selecting the same targets, you want it to spread it around.

3 Likes

I have a suggestion for making Implosion usable in a linear and immediate way:

unify the old “bilescourges bombers” talent with implosion itself, but not by imploding the imps you already have, but by summoning more from the nether that instantly hurl themselves against the targets, imploding, 30 sec CD.

This could be done with a sort of “imp swarm” and a small group of 5 imps that hurl themselves against the targets, or better a sort of continuous wave of imps that implode and launch themselves at the targets (reproducing exactly the modality of the bilescourges bombers talent).

I would add that it would be very interesting if this new implosion were given a graphic similar to the effect of the Legion Remix artifact talent “Souls of the Caw” in which these spectral birds appear from behind the character’s shoulders to attack the target forward. For me, this would be the classic two birds with a rock (to stay on the bird theme XD)

1 Like

I am loving Aff and Demo. I think Drain Soul is an iconic Aff spell and I would love for Nightfall to allow us to channel it on the move instead of speeding the drain.

Demo, I only played in delves and open world content, but I since playing on the Beta I love what they have done with it. Especially, the imp lord and fel ravager.

Destro needs some help. Everything you mentioned in your post is chef’s kiss. I think DRifts should be our movement spell.

  • We should have the cleave element baked in
  • Immolate should proc a rift
  • Flamerift should be added
  • Capstone: Open 3 rifts that attack your target/s. 1 soul shard cost
2 Likes

Chaotic Inferno is a bit of an odd talent, in that logic dictates that a lower-level hit would produce a proc that could lead to a higher-level hit in terms of damage or utility. When you enter the “chaosbolt phase” and try to cast as many as possible in a row with Infernal, what should you do? Use a global for an incinerate instant? Keep it aside, perhaps with a stack of incinerate instants? (I don’t think there’s a stack.) It would be preferable, I think, for a conflagrate to have a chance of making the next incinerate instant (possibly without consuming backdraft), or vice versa

Mark of Ruvaraad is a particularly useless and uninspired talent, which among other things doesn’t take a look at the possibility of the Grimoire of Sacrifice

The Grimoire of Sacrifice itself would be interesting if it became a talent in the warlock tree with the node Summoner’s Embrace (which strangely does not appear at all for Demonology for which the term “summoner” is definitely more suitable than the other two specs)
To those who say that Demonology MUST always have a primary demon, I remind you that Sacrifice has been a purely Demonology talent since 2004 (which was used to gain soul links, let’s say a logical contradiction XD)

1 Like

In the warlock tree, Nightmare/Horrify is too central (both should also be valid for Howl of Terror, in pve no one want fliyng mobs across the map in terror), and the curse of exhaustion is mandatory to access essential talents on the left side.
Again, please, the two curses should be grouped into a single choice and not scattered throughout the tree

1 Like

Destro is definitely lacking some instant abilities (no, rain of fire does not count). Decimation should’ve been instant instead of 90% reduced cast time.

Bring back Ritual of Ruin and make it so the proc Chaos Bolt is instant.

I don’t know what the solution is for Summoners Embrace and Grimoire of Sacrifice. I would really like to be able to use my Imp to dispel or even my succubus but I am tied to the felpuppy.

We really need to look at Demonic Circle. Abyss Walker could be used to pin point the circle or something like door of shadows. I think we’re nearly there with just a few tweaks.

I’ve accepted we’re not getting KJC back so help a little with our mobility. Also, reduce the damage of Burning Rush or negative the damage completely and making a timed ability.

Lastly, Fel Domination should make our summons instant. We should not be the only “pet” class with outdated 6 second summons and using a talent point that only reduces the cast time instead making it instant is outdated.

1 Like

What exactly is the Fortified Soul talent supposed to do? From the tooltip, I understood that it increased the maximum soul leech by 5%, however, taking the talent does not change the maximum amount of soul leech

Also, Fortified Soul if increase the soul leech percentage need to move in place of “nightmare/horrify”, so in the middle of demon skin and fel armour

1 Like

Channel Demonfire not EXTENDING anymore feels bad in aoe. Especially with the new Conflag spreading Immolate being very random and spreading to targets you dont want it to spread to.

1 Like

After viewing the new beta release:

Affliction:
What’s the point of making a class that’s already very static by default increasingly static? I’m thinking of the Malefic Grasp, whose return we were all very happy to see, but which will essentially render us completely immobile during the burst phase. So, 20+5 sec every 2 min. Madness.
I’d also like to add that I don’t understand the obsession with having to make the burst tied to a demon (which, in my opinion, is very ugly and pointless, given that it’s unclear why a floating octopus could increase the duration of dots). I’m very annoyed about the Apex talents, as it truly seems like the game developers don’t understand the basics of the class. I’d like to understand the point of unleashing meteors from the sky after Haunt.
It would clearly be a perfect Apex for destruction, so to speak

Demonology:
The apex talent in Dominion of Argus had several opportunities for improvement, given that the process of obtaining the “maximum” Tyrant is lengthy and obtaining demons from the portal requires crafting resources again. Reducing the HOGs needed to obtain a demon from Argus from 3 to 2 is obviously the worst possible solution.
I’ll also add that I’m completely incomprehensible as to why the game has featured truly beautiful and well-crafted demon models for years (think of the dreadlords from Zereth Morthis), yet they continue to use some of the worst-looking demon models in the game.

Destruction:
I’m definitely perplexed that a spec with obvious capstone issues and omissions slipped away without any changes from the penultimate alpha release. Keeping Soulfire with its biblical cast and removing one of the few fun destruction procs, Decimation…

P.S. Is it possible to finally have a graphical restyling of at least a couple of spells, given that from this point of view, the warlock hasn’t been modified in at least 15 years (except for banal icons)? By the way, I’m not even suggesting giving the spells new graphics, but at least using the ones that the mobs themselves present in the game have.

3 Likes

Finally can post here

UA nerf. First, it was needed. It did too much damage.

However… Right now, one to one, it does less damage than Agony at 8 stacks. It does 1/3rd the dmg that Shadow Word Madness does and that’s not counting the direct damage SWM does.

Quite honestly, it feels bad to spend shards on casting a weaker agony that lasts 8 seconds. Yes, it can be stacked, doesn’t change the fact you’re basically casting weaker, and shorter Agonies. It doesn’t have that oomph it had before. Previously it actually felt like aff had some burst damage. Right now that feeling is absolutely and entirely gone, and spell has nothing aside from damage really.

Also, with reduction to 8s (I like the change) the dot protection from dispelling is now worse.

Too bad. It felt nice to have Chaos Bolt Of Dots for a short while.

Malefic grasp is pretty bad. Totally dislike it now and in the past. It makes you absolutely immobile during darkglare and is a dps loss vs not having a talent and using instant proc shadowbolt. Make it instant cast better shadowbolt that explodes additionally depending in the dots on the target. That or make it castable while moving and uninterruptable.

Also, it would be better to have “Oblivion” instead of Malefic Grasp

1 Like

I also think that Warlock suffers from a lack of identity as Aff, unlike shadow priests.

Destro is clear with infernal vibes and fire.

Demonology is lots of demons but has some issues too, Felguard is also weak.

Affliction… lacks identity. Why cant it move more towards the Nathrezim vibe?

It’s unthinkable how one class like Shadowpriest can have such a strong identity and Afflock not. If at least it could go far more into the souls area, like Gorefiend, Nathrezim.

1 Like

Why Destruction and Affliction have a talent node called “Summoner’s Embrace” (like in TWW) and not in Demonology, which is the quintessential summoner spec? Wouldn’t it be better if Grimoire of Sacrifice/Summoner’s Embrace became a talent in the Warlock tree? I always remember that Sacrifice was an original talent in the Demonology tree back in 2004, and you can be a “summoner” even without a perpetual demon. And please, buff grimoire of sacrifice

Why has the “Teaching of the Black Harvesters” talent been practically useless since the first iteration in DF and was only taken because it was a mandatory prerequisite for Demonic Resilience… and now is the same? The talent’s name is based on that of the most powerful warlock covenant; it deserves better luck, not just a reduction in demon skill CD

2 Likes

Unfortunately, Affliction is a spec that has completely derailed from the original concept for several years. Despite the very term Blizzard uses to describe it as a master of shadow magic, drain, and dots.

In Midnight, they’re returning somewhat to what Affliction should be, but since I don’t have a clear plan, they’re remodeling the current Affliction based on some of the “working” Affliction mechanics of the past. The current version will certainly be significantly better for Mythic+, but there are still some problems, such as:

Darkglare is the most controversial burst in the game due to its aesthetics, theme, and logic (why would a demonic octopus be summoned to increase the duration of our dots and hit targets with lax beams, with questionable graphics?). Wouldn’t it be better to simply give back darksoul: misery to extend the duration of the dots and haste or whatever they want?

Unstable Affliction is a great spender, but it’s practically Malefic Rapture 2.0… wouldn’t it have been better to make Unstable a very powerful spender that uses three shards, similar to the Hand of Gul’dan? Obviously, with improvements to make shard generation less random and predictive. The introduction of a talent that replenishes 3 shards over time with a 30 second CD for example would be very interesting instead of relinquished, it could be called “soul tap” and take up the concept of the old life tap

Malefic Grasp during Darkglare is utter madness, because you’d have to stand still to chain-cast Unstable Affliction, then Dark Harvester, wait for Dark Harvester to channel, then Darkglare, and then stand still again to chain-spam Malefic Grasp for another 20-25 seconds. Did I mention it’s a madness?

I would like to overlook the proc meteors if you use haunt, but… as if a hunter mm after an aimed shot saw 3 rhinos appear and charge the target

1 Like

I’ve thought about UA as 2-3 shards spender but… we then lack dot protection i e.g. pvp.

Maybe have UA also be 1-5 shards? You can cast it at 1, can cast it at 5 and it does X dmg more. Obviously, there would be some pooling issues but damn it does not feel good right now.

Or maybe… dunno make a separate ability for shards and make it a nuke? Oblivion was so underutilized. Why not make it a powerful single target spender? But make it possible on the move

That way

  1. we keep our dot protection from ua

  2. we aboid ridiculous dmg by stacking 5+ ua on the target

  3. we have full control over the burst because of the channel, like 1,5s, one target, heavy damage

  4. we have actually good looking spell visually

  5. easy to tune because you tune for 1 channel or repeated channels not for 5 sta ms at the same time

We also have way too much talent bloat/creep and some useless stuff. Why is new shadowbolt talent 2 pts for 10/30 if previous was 8/24 for 1???

Why do we have summoners embrace? Useless. Give us more baseline dmg and free the slot or do something fun in its place.

Darkglare, I’ve always disliked this soo much. Too much dmg is tied to it, it promotes pooling. Why not go more towards some souls vibe, where we use souls to strike or to rip them from enemies?

Why can’t we have like shadowbolt/doombolt barrage? It looks super, think shadowbolt volley back to back proc but vs single target. Majestic

Drain soul needs to channel quicker/have better animation

Succulent souls shards are random and so is the demon from hero talents that randomly spawns on use. This is so unpredictable, and two sources of randomness for one spawn P.s. I’d much rather see this demon as our dps cd than darkglare

Agony, corruption, ua, all have terrible animations, all are lacking g in visual identity unlike lava burst, void ray, mindflay etc. You cast it and there’s a tiny shadow on enemies that’s completely unreadable. Why not introduce more fun animations? Like Healing Wave style but darker qhere you affect enemies. Healing Wave makes a watery animation that during the cast travels to the target.

Blizz, make us masters of souls and afflictions.

2 Likes