Thats sad. I and most if not all guild raid team ware stacked up for 20+ wipes to clear BWL. And we had some problems on first reset. On this week reset we cleared below 2 hours. And we dont run 20 fury warriors setup. Mixed everything besides ‘oomkin’ and ele shaman (i think :P)
AAAA so about same as my guild . We wiped this reset… On trash 
Yeah, suspected as much when it comes to the raw data. Thanks for the input!
And as from today. Two active raiders from our guild announced that they are quitting. One got bored. The other can’t keep to the time due to real life issues.
The guild was once bursting with manpower so much that some people had to be on standby. Now the officers are struggling with recruitment for people to join the guild and fill the raid spots.
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It’s basically due to stuff like that, guilds end up disbanding.
You have to bench/standby a few people in order to raid, but those people end up getting bored > they quit > you get another quitter > you need to recruit again.
I am none of those #nochanges dudes
and my comment that premades were no thing in vanilla was meant like: They were there, they were possible, they didnt fix it.
And yes i blame Blizzard and other bigger computer game publishers like EA to grow such a community and actually reward the toxic behaviour it creates.
So as others already noticed - people are stoping to login because the most interesting content (ZG, AQ, Naxx) is now locked. I cleared BWL last week and week before. I dont want to level an alt and the only reason to login is to join 4 hours BWL raid once a week.
So why not to wait till they release Naxx and go straight there? Mechanics there are pretty simple and with world buffs and consumables with 40 adequate men you will be able to clear it in the first week. There is already a PUG on my server which cleared BWL 2 times already. Not a big deal.
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This is good. Some guilds SHOULD disband with new tier. Much better than one-shot cakewalk MC.
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Burning Legion and Magtheridon were special cases.
They had Nihilum, Destiny, Glodge, Infernal Affairs, Used to Could and many more.
So my guild currently cleared BWL twice with 2 different teams in one week but I can absolutely see how guilds who went into it unprepared tactics wise or even correct comp would make guilds disband.
Guilds have disbanded from the start of WoW upto now so its not like they wont find a home otherwise there would be thousands of guildless players on retail today.
Long message short : It doesnt matter so don’t worry.
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Because if they released Naxx you would be on here complaining that you only log in to do a 4 hour raid and there is nothing to do.
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i’m really confused regarding
IF
-vanilla players was going afk during fights so no heal or dps therefore they wipe
Or
-classic is somehow a nerfed version and only god knows about that since patch notes doesn’t provide much info and no actual data of early wow.
I’m aware that back in old days any guild could faceroll nefarian when we all was geared with time But during nefarian progress wipes happens…it doesn’t matter how many times they wiped to learn? the encounter looked hard due the lack of gear even if it wasn’t! and then in 2020 when i saw progress video & apes video, those shiny rank14weapons and the world Buffs+full consumables i thought that BWL looked so easy because they overwhelmed it by power YET i believed that maybe it’s not that easy for casual players.
till i joined a raid with someplayers in blue gear, some are half blue half epic, people stepping for first time in bwl, and raid went to smooth we even one shotted vael/broodlord/ebonroc/flamegor then at chromaggus leader explained fight and was saying “let’s give it a try to see how it goes no need to use consumables we’re just trying” No one had any worldbuffs, no one used anything & the boss died…we went to nefarian & same happened, no one used anything & the boss was 1shotted on the first try.
i thought vanilla/classic is gear check! but we didn’t have the setup or the gear, we didn’t have the confidence either, no one expected him to simply die like that…so iam clueless…
someone will say
people was noobs back then? even noobs in classic can kill nefarian now
people wasn’t raiding much back then? now in classic casual people cleared mc first week they hit 60 and cleared bwl on first entry to bwl. so they don’t even need to raid much to gear
was nefarian supposed to die in blue gear on 1st try? in vanilla? is really nefarian in classic is the same as nefarian in vanilla
No, you are blaming Blizzard because the community and its mentality have changed during 15 years.
Its impossible to recreate the past.
It is not? If you don’t have high enough dps for Vael, he wont go down before the AOE becomes a serious issue.
You can forgoe some if not most of the mechanics in MC, thats not the case in BWL. If you don’t check the mechanics either by high dps or by actually doing the mechanics, one will struggle. ( see Dragons tank swap )
Pointing fingers and blaming others is the easiest thing to do.
The community was toxic even in Vanilla, but to a lesser degree.
It is normal yes.
BWL have some Guildbreaker items and also some bosses.
Razorgore and firemaw and guildbreakers
Guild breaker items:
drake fang talisman
Styleen´s Impeding Scarab
there are more don´t remember which
so yes It is normal.
Yes and the community and its mentality have changed during the 15 years amongst other things because of big publishers who educated a big part of their costumers to be like this?
pls can i join ⟨Whale Carcass⟩ 
there is a reason why in classic guilds were farming MC/BWL infinetly - because people were always quiting and they had to gear up new memebers.
classic hype died. people left - guilds will crumble left and right.
on a brigthside BWL is so easy that people can pug it so why be in dead guild .
This is a guild breaker, what?
Wouldn’t you just give to your main tank? lol.
But it’s not just the big publishers… the mentality WILL change regardless.
It’s not the “new mmorpg” that everyone was new in.
Mostly everyone knows the game now.
It’s similar in real life, so many people nowadays get so offended over anything…
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