Currently we are just farming MC, meaning we just manage to get Ragnaros down before submerge, so basically the challenge of "doing MC is gone and now went into smoothing it up more, but basically farming it and hoping to gear us all up for BWL. But that’s just recent. Gear wise we are mostly blue pre raid BIS items, slowly filling up with MC/Ony epics.
We have a fun guild, nice people and enjoying working together. But being a bit indecisive on loot rules and raid roles and setup. Basically we choose not to use Loot Council because the danger of favoritism and drama, thinking we have enough common sense to do full DKP and not screw each other over for loot. Then at some point there were some loot priorities because of questions and arguments made, but they changed again when people disagree to much.
Now we get elemental shaman winning top DPS gear and rogues competing with warriors (tank and DPS) over daggers, and other examples, while the more obvious classes/specs are still much in need of those items. Technically, in DKP it is all fine according to rules, but it generates friction and that is something we don’t want/need in the guild.
What do other raiding guild use? When using DKP should we just accept that all is allowed as long as you have the DKP to pay for it. Or should there be priorities, set in stone, to maximize guild efficiency? Would even classes be limited to certain roles and gear up to that role (thinking shadow priest, elemental shaman, moonkin druid, they are not the most efficient in their role, but is that even a problem these days with nerfed content? They will take loot from classes though that are better designed for that role.
How do you handle his as a raid guild?
Loot prioritizing or not? DKP or Loot Council or a variation?
Class roles, do certain specs just are “no go” for raiding, or is that an outdated view and no longer relevant?
Raid player setups, only a certain amount of specific class/role per raid, or comes first serve first till?
And at what point in raiding will this all really become an issue if not settled? MC is “easy mode” but will BWL raids fail if not set up and geared properly, or will that only matter later on even?
Roll +1 with a few exceptions to the rules (bindings/sulferon eye & Ony head for tanks to get their neck piece first). The leaf/eye of divinity/sinew is also not included in the +1 system either.
Also BoE epics in MC are not included in the system either and are a free roll. What the system means is that if you get 1 piece of loot, you will only get another if either noone else wants, or when everyone that does want it also has a +1 for winning a piece.
Downsides? It means every raid is a loot reset - and first timers can potentially win a desirable item that someone has been raiding every raid to get (e.g raggy weapons). But that’s life and just accept it as /roll is random. Also someone might not take an upgrade as saving their main roll for an item they really want. But as MC is so bad for dropping what you actually want no one does this often … but thats the same issue DKP and not spending it has.
It ensures there is a good loot distribution - but doesnt stop people getting several items if for example they are the only hunter and all the set pieces drop
I prefer it over the alternatives. Also it is MS>OS regardless. But if an item is rolled on for OS (as no MS wants) then that item is also not on the +1 system.
In my actual guild we are using class leaders, and it works very well. It’s a kind of loot council but with way less risk of favoritism and also the advantage of having someone competent in the class to decide and also to talk to. For instance the hunter class leader is the one with the LESS loot of all hunters, so he is definitely not self serving.
In the first guild, they had loot council, and in their council there was no hunter for instance, so they sucked at distributing loot for hunters. There was also favoritism, the hunter who had a female player behind the keyboard and whose boyfriend was officer arrived the last and got covered in epics in no time, while the oldest hunter of the guild, who arrived first and attended all raids, was staying way behind (it wasn’t me, I was intermediary, but I spoke up for him).
I ended leaving that guild when I started questioning them about which factors they were using to distribute the loot and beside the usual (attendance, dedication, etc…) they said “and we have secret factors we can’t reveal to you”.
Generally, all systems depend on the honesty of the users, and also their knowledge of the game.
I was in a server first guild up to the beginning of Cataclysm (that expansions disgusted me so much I stopped raiding), and we never had a problem with our DKP system. To me, that’s the best, you get what you work for.
Doesn’t mean anything. Server first on some realms means world rank 1000, while on some realms, world rank 50 won’t put you in the top 5 on your realm.
Every good guild uses loot council, simple as that.
We use loot council with class leaders.
So far it seems to be going quite ok.
Mby 1 or 2 mistakes but it has been discussed about and it seems most fair to me
as i said, good guilds dont use dkp system. all vanilla guilds back then were garbage. All the current top PVE guilds (fastest mc clears) are loot council guilds
i’m not saying that nobody is using it, that would be stupid. No, i’m saying that those that are using it are stupid. Progress, Return, Onslaught, Saladbakers, Apes, gusy,unlucky, Tribe are all in top 10 and guilds ik for a fact to use lootcouncil, as i have played with their members in the past
DKP for everything except tanking gear and legendaries. People will get what they REALLY want. Most people play the game because of loot and if they cannot get what they want there is no reason for them to stay in the guild. With DKP people will show up even if they dont need anything anymore. People are more motivated to farm consumables etc because even if they dont get any items they atleast get DKP. For loot council to work you need all people of equal skill/mindset/commitment otherwise its not gonna work.
Loot council and class prio, we also don’t use meme specs. We have an excel sheet with all possible loot and who will get it next week etc etc. Lots of work for the officers but it works really well in the end.
