The system works fine the way it is. Want to just farm gear ? Do 10s.
Want to push yourself to see how far you can come ? time keys to do so
Why would you do a 15 key if you cant even get to that level and it wont drop any more loot than a +10?
I would like to see side content with just hard dungeons without timers, but in order to make it hard you would have to make trash between bosses as one big encounter: once you pull one pack, you’re in combat till you kill next boss, you can’t release, you only can use combat ress, after wipe you’re back at last checkpoint and all trash you killed is reset. There is no other way.
That’s indeed a potential alternative.
It’s why I like OP:M. No pressure, just fun. Sadly the loot is a bit on the low side though.
Ooh, this’ll be fun.
I will come back to this in a later multiquote segment.
Nope.
I would argue that I am quite good at “Dissecting to show where people are wrong”. I think you’re pretty bad at being a snappy person.
Tol Barad is/was considered as a Battleground instance that you either go there personally or talk to a guy to be teleported. That was the same for Wintergrasp in Wrath of the Lich King, only that one seems to have been put in to the “Group Finder” window.
That is assuming you are trying to complete a raid within it’s patch frame, otherwise they’re relevant to do at any point of the expansion, be it to gear up alts, go through the raids on the harder difficulties, or any other reason.
Here, I’ll give you a name for what you’re doing; Noncery.
I am dealing with it by not considering them proper rewards 
Oh honey…
Boy, I am likely a whole lot better than you. Probably even better than you as a person? Hmm…
And before you decide to make a pathetic comeback attempt, let me go back to the first multiquote segment
To come back to the “Back it up part”, I call you clueless because you seem to think that the only thing that matters in the game are high-end endgame results, and that anyone who isn’t pushing for Mythic raiding or +15 keys are somehow “Idiots who suck at the game who should not be heard out at all”.
Well, to me it sounds a lot like you are just a miserable twenty-something year old who’s only high point is some end-game progression and tries to hang that over people in order to enact some kind of superiority over them. That’s sad if you ask me.
Okay, last one…
You think I have a problem with mobs getting buffs? I welcome that! I’ve done Mythic+ dungeons before that were higher than +5, pretty sure buffed mobs won’t stop me from pushing higher.
Can’t believe it, you actually managed to make a suggestion that actually sounds like a good compromise between the two sides. Good job! Have a cookie.
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Gear is thrown at the casual player base now more than ever. I am not sure I understand the point you are trying to make. In the past this wasn’t the case.
M plus is an alternative to raiding for those that don’t want to raid and a complementary means to gear for raids for those who do. It’s less time consuming than raiding but it’s still meant to be competitive.
Catch up gear is introduced every so now and then and Benthic is very good for those who want to avoid anything competitive, along with doing the WF quest, emissaries etc.
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Something can be hard without a timer
The entire point is that you are up against the clock. That is what makes it difficult.
“but but but muh difficulty in timers!!!1”
Nope. Youre terrible at nitpicking.
As i said. Youre bad at nitpicking. And not even during cata was TB considered a battleground. More like an realm wide pvp event. Same for wintergrasp. WIth the latter having been turned into an BG.
My point stands. The competetive part of it is Curve/CE/Hall of Fame.
And relevancy is up for debate. Right now neither Uldir or BoDA (including mythic) are good for gearing up. Nor effective. Unless you magically get a group with overgeared peeps that all share your loot to trade it to you the moment you ding 120.
They dont have to be proper rewards for you. They are the rewards regardless.
Deal with it. Get good.
And here we see that you are incapable of reading. I have flamed him and took his experience as a reason because hes basing his “facts” on no ground whatsoever. He has no experience in the game other than world questing and expeditions. Yet he wants to argue about the systems affect on the areas he never touched. Not even bothering with theorycrafting to deepen his knowledge on the matter. If he would have done the latter in the very least this discussion would have continued way differently.
Maybe. Maybe not. But at least i acquired the skill of reading comprehension.
And the question whether youre better than me or not is quite obsolete as long as you hide behind a classic character.
You will be stuck way below the key level youre on now. To compensate you wouldnt just get a lousy like “2 levels higher than now” buff.
Scared of dungeon community 
yesterday I finally made the achievement S3 all +10s and I’ve pug I think couple of times in total…
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Timer forces you to make quick decisions and success lies within player’s reflexes. That is hard.
Dungeon without timer can be difficult too, but it would have to be completely different. Trash mobs should be like encounters, bosses with multiple phases etc. And even so, players would memorize timers after few months and fights would be trivial. That means both bosses and trash should randomize timers and their skill sets to prevent that and keep those dungeons fun.
And take in account Blizzard’s gameplay designer’s imagination. Nope, impossible. I really don’t think it’s gonna happen. If it does, I’m gonna write song about Ion…
That doesn’t mean it’s good a good challenge.
Oh look, more noncery. Well I don’t have anything better to do at the moment, let’s get this over with.
And you’re bad at being a snappy person, and possibly as a human being.
As I said, you’re bad at being snappy/bad being a human.
Still a queued-into activity, just like Battlegrounds are queued-into.
Stop being a Nonce.
At least you’re self aware enough. I think this is the part where you are really just pointless to talk to.
You have no idea if that is true or not.
Man, I should really take that advice to heart… What was it again? “Don’t try to stoop to the same level as stupid people, they will beat you down with experience at being stupid”.
That is subjective, that doesn’t mean it’s bad. It means you don’t like it. Lots of people do.
Someone may not like mythic raiding, that doesn’t make it bad, it means it doesn’t appeal to that player.
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No game mode, setting, challenge will ever please EVERYONE.
I like M+ for the timer and thus having a different challenge. If I want to “take it slow, get it right” then I have raids for that( in which my mage partakes btw.) I also dont support making m+ into “mini raids” cause somebody doesnt like it.
Well…a shame but many people do them.
I dont like arenas, yet I am not advocating to remove them either. I just dont do them then.
Either find like minded people to do m+ on your “terms” or…just dont do them?
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Oh i can life with the fact that im not a “magnificent human being”. I give not a single rats what other people other than my SO thinks about me. I even rejected my own Mother for years and already told my father i would spit on this grave should he ever consider suicide for whatever reason during a random discussion among the family.
Different que system my friend.
No i dont. But im very safe with the assumption.
Bring in proper arguments. Right now i see none but your failed attempt to nitpick at Deja. Only to be corrected yourself.
Which is exactly why I’m advocating to have a non-timed alternative to M+ 
I’m not advocating to remove M+… Jeez reading is hard these days 
You aren’t though. You are suggesting Mythic plus is destroyed.
You want people to get upgrades for keys they can’t time. That breaks the point of Mythic plus and the whole system it’s based on.
And it’s not that you want to see the content in some practice mode with no loot or score, you want all the benefits of actually being good at Mythic plus without being capable of doing it.
I’d like to be a Gladiator but I can’t PvP. I should clearly be asking for it to be handed to me on a platter despite only being able to scrape a 1400 rating with a friend in 2s.
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The timer challenge is pretty much what makes m+. Without it…its just some normal dungeon or mini raid.
Returning to arenas. It would be the same as removing arena maps and saying to go out at the gates, /duel, and pretend you are in an arena.
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I specified what I don’t like, I mentioned possible changes to the current system. As I said before and will say again, I primarily want an alternative, and if they can’t provide this, I would like to have M+ be less excruciating.
I honestly don’t care about arenas, I generally speaking don’t mind PvP, but arenas are just bleh when it comes to balance and how you play them. I honestly don’t like that certain mogs and mounts are locked behind PvP, but so be it. It’s not like I need to do arenas to gear, it’s optional content.