How to FIX Mythic Plus

[Kretias-ravencrest (Kretias)]

There’s no need to do that. BECAUSE ITS RARE AND IT ISN’T BASELINE.
TF is not something you NEED. It’s a bonus. An extra something. You don’t balance around a bonus, that’s stupid.

Im not saying they should balance around. Im saying TF is too much of an upgrade for content that is balanced for baseline gear. Especially on certain pieces.

You just flip things around without any logic or basis…

Its called common sense.

Well duh! People are more quick to post about something they don’t like. If there’s something you DO like, you play and you’re fine… Silly, silly argument.

While youre in theory correct, there would still be threads up commenting on it in a positive manner. Including in the threads that flame TF. Frankly its so minuscul i can safely say its less than the % of rank 1 gladiators.

Yeah… just start the insults now. Sure. Fits the profile.

Wrong. I am comparing your limited knowledge with mine. I know how content gets balanced. I know how content gets affected by TF. You on the other hand know nothing but LFR. The tourist mode that one can complete by afk auto-hitting.

No because that’s not content I enjoy. It’s that simple.

Then no better loot for you. It’s that simple

I don’t enjoy mythic content, raiding and pvp. I pretty much enjoy all other aspects of the game (some more than others of course).

So questing and sitting afk in boralus. Gotcha. Aka no ground to talk on for you.

Get lost.

Did i hit a nerve? Its a fact that LFR is for the newly dinged alts, PvPers that just want to know the story, people that cba with social activity and people that are borderline bad at the game.

I … don’t play… right… sure. What are you on about man?!

What do you do then? Its neither raiding aside from LFR. Its not PvP. Its not Mythic content as you said (that includes M+ based on your response). So the only thing left are questing, sitting afk, roleplay (lol), old expansion content and island expeditions. Yeah, you are not playing the game.

More insults. Sure.

Facts =/= insults. Youre only playing LFR. Which is the equivalent to wellfare.

Did you read my response to him? No. THEN SHUT UP.

I’m done with trying to have a normal discussion with you because it’s impossible.

I did read your response. And you didnt manage to get it comprehended in your head. Hence my post.

Oh and i can return to statement. Its impossible to discuss this matter of stuff with someone that plays the easiest difficulty only, that cant even be bothered to check how things are balanced and how RNG item increase procs affect certain stuff.

c’mon man, i don’t agree with everyone here as well, lets keep it respectful. Trust me I know it can be hard sometimes when things heat up but from experience you’ll regret it later.

I’ve had this tone since i started posting and i will have it when i quit this game. Im not faking politeness

[Tahra-earthen-ring (Tahra)]

Especially on certain pieces.

THEN THE PROBLEM IS THOSE CERTAIN PIECES.

While youre in theory correct, there would still be threads up commenting on it in a positive manner.

Be realistic. Look at exisiting or past systems and how many positive vs negative threads there were. You’re just forcing your agenda or you really are unable to rationally look at this.

Frankly its so minuscul i can safely say its less than the % of rank 1 gladiators.

More nonsense made-up numbers based on your bias.

You on the other hand know nothing but LFR.

Cow’s doodoo.

Then no better loot for you. It’s that simple

That’s where you’re wrong. Because Blizzard disagrees with you. Obviously.

So questing and sitting afk in boralus. Gotcha. Aka no ground to talk on for you.

Get lost.

Did i hit a nerve? Its a fact that LFR is for the newly dinged alts, PvPers that just want to know the story, people that cba with social activity and people that are borderline bad at the game.

Get. Lost.
With your stupid biased, egocentric, arrogant way of looking at others. Get a clue. Become a better person and then come back to me to give some normal replies. Until then… Get lost.

So the only thing left are questing, sitting afk, roleplay (lol), old expansion content and island expeditions. Yeah, you are not playing the game.

See my above reply.

Youre only playing LFR. Which is the equivalent to wellfare.

See my above reply.

ts impossible to discuss this matter of stuff with someone that plays the easiest difficulty only, that cant even be bothered to check how things are balanced and how RNG item increase procs affect certain stuff.

You are clueless.

I’ve had this tone since i started posting and i will have it when i quit this game. Im not faking politeness

That much is clear.
You’re not faking stupidity, arrogance or egocentricity either.

Bye. I’m glad WoW isn’t made by people like you.

[Vitold-twisting-nether]

I assume being patient and waiting for friends and guildies to come online is not an option for you?

So you tell me not to play for a couple of days instead of suggesting people not to leave which is win/win situation?

[Blightsoul-chamber-of-aspects]

M+ is content meant for premade groups, that’s why it’s outside of the regular group finder. The community decided to turn this content into pugs only. Now people come screaming to blizzard to fix it.

That’s because M+ is pretty much the way to gear up.

The fix would be to put mythic+ into the random group finder, with a rating based matchmaker like other blizzard games.

I think this would be a nice solution, but they’d have to really work on this as they can’t even get this sorted for random bgs.

[Ishayu-frostmane (Ishayu)]

Stop PuG’ging.

Or rather, continue pugging and every time you find someone great, KEEP THEM AROUND, and then play with them instead.

It’s not M+'s fault you can’t build groups

[Khareal-emerald-dream (Khareal)]

Not sure what has been said. I think every time I have given this suggestion there has been both positive and negative opinions of it.

Why not make leaving or failing m+ entirely irrelevant?

Like… you only need to unlock the m+ level by doing key of some level(s) lower than it in time. After that you could always go to that m+ level without needing a keystone and using this you get to have untimed version of it. With this you can only receive some level of loot once+weekly chest or something.
Now… if someone does leave. So what? Get replacement. Ect.

Keystones can be left in for those who want to harder stuff and for unlocking a level. Keystones are always timed.

[Alumage-draenor]

Blizzard could kill RIO off now just by disabling the API parts they use.

i would argue that would make it worse, cause at that point rio or any equivalent would probably resort to a report system with some verification method for your runs or just straight up have log verification, but all this would make it so only those who bother to log or go and do stuff themselves will get their experience shown and people will b*tch and complain that it’s not automated so uninformed players get screwed over.

[Ainee-golemagg]

First of Rio is useless. Rio score can be bought with gold so it has no value to start with.

Instead of Rio show me what I wanna know, show me the average dungeon DPS, interupts and deaths next to someone’s name for that particular dungeon.

Finally we need BIG penalties for M+ leavers without wipes. Forfeit their weekly chest and deprive them from any loot of the week, I’d go as far as removing all earned loot for that week in m+. It will never happen of course cause ESPORTS.

I get your frustration, thats why its better to go M+ runs with guild mates you know.

But if you think about it mate, your solution would make no change at all. It would only make more golds for the boosters, because now people just have to buy it once… but if there were some overall statistics, then they would have to buy it regularly… that means the skill with nice stats could still be low, because the guy just buys boost regularly to hide his bad skills.

There is no optimal solution to this not until Blizzard starts to punish people selling golds for real money. Because without free golds, there wont be that much boosting.

And as for the leavers. Im all for some kind of punishment, but you have to think about it more. You cannot just take loot from everyone who left once a m+, because there can be a lot of things that the person cannot influence. For example emergencies or internet break down.

I believe the best solution to this problem is to make a ration that would show how many dungeons every each completed divided number of runs we left before the timer ran out.

But it still wont work until Blizzard starts to punish people selling golds for real money… because as I said earlier, people will just buy boost to hide their bad skill no matter how many indicators u create.

[Alumage-draenor]

Without a timer I’m sure I can beat a +50 given long enough time.

You must certainly would not.
You ever watch people try to do some of the harder bosses on 23-24? it’s not really the timer, but surviving that is the problem, and people spec full defensive for something like last boss TD, and still struggle.
Those are the best players in the world with some of the best gear, i doubt you would even survive a 20 or 21, let alone a 50.

[Азриил-deathguard (Азриил)]

So you tell me not to play for a couple of days instead of suggesting people not to leave which is win/win situation?

I do not do m+ every day. I do when people are available, or not at all. I do not PUG. And I am quite certain when I’d list my tank i’d be snatched off the list immediately because of her class, gear and score. But still I do not feel that I must do M+ every possible evening. I have other activities too - in and out of game.

[Bukachu-ravencrest]

You must certainly would not.
You ever watch people try to do some of the harder bosses on 23-24? it’s not really the timer, but surviving that is the problem, and people spec full defensive for something like last boss TD, and still struggle.
Those are the best players in the world with some of the best gear, i doubt you would even survive a 20 or 21, let alone a 50.

50 is obviously an exaggeration but everyone’d be doing things WAY higher. people who do 24s on tyrannical could easily do 30+ or whatever.

time is the difficulty.

[Blightsoul-chamber-of-aspects]

I think M+ would be a lot more fun without the timer. Don’t care if it takes me 3 hours, would at least feel like an achievement instead of a failure.

[Aibury-hydraxian-waterlords]

Al BG’s have timers

Go on…

either through “a timer” or some feature that makes it end when a score is reached (and it will be reached in a reasonable amount of time)

Oh, so no timers then. They would be real timers if the objective was “Get the most points within an allotted time”, instead it’s “Get X points before your enemy”. Only battlegrounds that have timers are the Capture the Flag Battlegrounds and Strand of the Ancients.

Now, unless they recently added timers, or have a timer when things have gone uncontested for five minutes a countdown starts, then you can legitimately say “BG’s have timers”.
Next!

Every raid boss ingame has either a hard or soft enrage that places a cap on how long combat can last.

We’re talking about the duration of how long you are within a dungeon/raid, not about the duration of a fight. Sure the bosses might have an enrage on them if they’re fought for too long, but there is no upper limit to how long you can be within a raid before you get booted out, or have a timer stuck to the raid instance that tells you how long you have before the ending of the raid becomes worthless.
Next!

You come across as not very clued in.

On the contrary, it seems to be moreso that I am destroying all of your arguments as they really do not do a good job at defending the Mythic+ timers.

The timer is part of the challenge.

Uhm… Nope, I don’t think so.

What is so hard to understand ?

Why do people get so worked up when someone suggests “Hey, you know, maybe the timer shouldn’t be there and Blizzard should consider removing it”?

I do not want to get rude

Riiiiight…

but timer is part of the bundle that ‘makes a m+’

I would argue that it really really doesn’t. If anything, I’d call it a detriment to people wanting to run Mythic dungeons.
Why a detriment? Well pugging can tell you all about that.

Can you make it into time X, which requires you to have x amount of performance and it allows you to compete also with yourself.

“Can you make it into time X” - You can always do that with an invisible timer that doesn’t dictate on how you get rewarded at the end depending on how fast you do it.
“Which requires X amount of performance” - That is for basically everything in the game ever. Your point?
“Allows you to compete with yourself” Now how the Hell does it do that? I never felt like I should compete with myself in the brief period where I was actually running Mythic+ dungeons. If anything I always felt annoyed when I saw the clock constantly ticking down, even more so if it was my own key.

RIO website

Aaaaand you lost me.

it shows even how my tanking speed has changed

Good for you.

does it mean have I become better as player

Maybe.

or just better geared

More probable.

but its fun thing

For you, maybe. For people not a big fan of the timers in Mythic+ dictating the experience? Probably not.

But since you do not like timers, current system allows you to ignore them

Oh, are you saying that even if I run out of time, I will still level up my key and still get some potentially decent loot at the end?
No? Then don’t lie to me and try to sell me that I can ignore it.

Modern system has best for both sides.

It rarely does.

[Tsjod-argent-dawn]

Oh, are you saying that even if I run out of time, I will still level up my key and still get some potentially decent loot at the end?
No? Then don’t lie to me and try to sell me that I can ignore it.

You do get potential loot at the end of an M+ run. The timer is irrelevant for it. The group only gets 1 item less with a minimum of 2 pieces.

[Aibury-hydraxian-waterlords]

Based on the tone of your response, all I get is “If you do not do hard endgame PvE or PvP, you are not a real gamer and are not playing the game the right way!”

Sod off with that.

[Aibury-hydraxian-waterlords]

You do get potential loot at the end of an M+ run. The timer is irrelevant for it. The group only gets 1 item less with a minimum of 2 pieces.

I remember that being the case. My point to it was more akin to “So you are saying that I still get a key level up even if I don’t make the timer?”, with the out-of-time just being a baseline chance of getting items with a key level up, with the faster times increasing the chance of getting items and better key levels.

[Lilîith-silvermoon]

I think M+ would be a lot more fun without the timer. Don’t care if it takes me 3 hours, would at least feel like an achievement instead of a failure.

when they initialy announced them i thought its gonna work like this.

that we gonna haave much less of them but they will be much harder .

lets say that you would get only incremeents of 30-40% between each difficulty and additional affix in each .

but without timer it would be a test of endurance and skills.

now its just “bring as much aoe dps and stuns as possible and kite and you have to do it in stupid amount of tiem that ensure dangerous pulls”

not my kind of things in mmorpgs.

[Punyelf-draenor (Punyelf)]

If you don’t like the timer, you are free to ignore it. But it is designed to be a race against the clock.

[Aibury-hydraxian-waterlords]

Lilith gets it!

Personally it’d be nice to have a mode where it gets incrementally harder with each level in a five-man scenario. As Mythic+ dungeons are now, they are just… Worthless, really.

If you don’t like the timer, you are free to ignore it.

Except not really, because as far as I remember if you get a +2 key, and you ignore the timer and it happens to time out it will always remain a +2 key. Can’t ignore the timer in that scenario.

But it is designed to be a race against the clock.

There can always be a timer that doesn’t dictate whether or not you actually get a level up or not depending how long it took you to do the dungeon, or an end-screen timer that says how long it took you to finish it.

[Tsjod-argent-dawn]

I remember that being the case. My point to it was more akin to “So you are saying that I still get a key level up even if I don’t make the timer?”, with the out-of-time just being a baseline chance of getting items with a key level up, with the faster times increasing the chance of getting items and better key levels.

I do dislike the key-system itself too, but not the timer. I am promoting letting the group decide the challenge level, and give achievements/toys/mounts/whatever based on timed runs.