Very difficult to complain about toxicity if you play alone.
If anything, all I have been reading is how much of an idiot Brann is. Which is supposed to be a replacement for an actual player.
I wonder who the toxic person is then… 
Because if they react like that to other players no wonder Solo is the only thing they can do in WoW.
That’s just not true. Plenty of people do dvelves 5 Man even with how ridoculously the HP scales now.
Its just so much easier as dps then solo .
OK. People 5 man the Delves.
I guess there is no reason to be toxic about anything if there are zero consequences to dying. Or there is no way to mess up because there are no mechanics to deal with at all.
What are you suggesting? To dumb down M+ to retard levels just so a couple of “snowflakes” dont get their feelings hurt by a “mean toxic player” ?
Toxic people are so far and few that they could be considered unicorns. If you played M+ more than you do you would know.
well considering thats exactly what i have been suggesting for over a decade ?
then … duh ?
look at cata classic - much healthier game - then retail - why ? because of how much easier it is.
**wow legend was literaly build on the fact that it was the easiest the least punishing mmorpg on the market when it came out. **
it was about experience back then - not difficutly
but over the years by catering to tryhards - wow lost its souls.
its slowly slowly changing now with casual mode aka dvelves being added - this season with dvelves being made easier and more rewarding
with all the extra events catering solely to casuals .
but its not changing fast enough
time to cut the tumor that is current tuning of m+ and raids
they already started for the raids this season too - with the rep rewards and how much their nerf raids with that
time for something similiar for m+
want my easiest and most obvious solution for now ? make hero track 2 tiers higher - instead 6/6 it should be 8/8 max - because currently maxed out hero gear is way to close to maxed out champions gear .
I refuse to have this Vanilla was awesome discussion once again. Its lame and boring at this time.
I will tell you exactly what I tell everyone else:
You think Vanilla was so much better in every way? GO PLAY SOD AND CLASSIC SERVERS !!!
If it was so “good” as you claim. So much “about experience” as you claim. Then the Vanilla servers would PACKED with people. And the SoD servers would be EXPLODING with people.
But they arent. There is barely anyone still playing that. And classic server populations go up and down based on the release schedule of RETAIL !
So I will remind you once again: Retail is an evolution of Vanilla. And we did not get here “because they catered to the tryhards”. We got here because blizzard has tried different formulas (some good, some bad) to try and convince people not to leave and keep playing.
And is it working as you expected? Are there legions of casuals playing?
Cause at the moment, all I see Delves becoming is the EZ early season farm. So you can get early gear for M+/Raid. Its what everyone is doing at the moment.
Get an alt: Gear him up in Delves in 1 week… go to M+/Raid.
It was also graphically the best made. And you had that “amazing” factor you will never again get.
And WHY did we have like… 2 buttons on our toons?
FIRST: It was 2004. Modems were still 156k and made funny noises. And we all played on the equivalent of a toaster by today’s standards.
You put the old “slow” vanilla style gameplay today, for modern audiences, with modern technology and it looks and feels lame. Like an old 60s movie but with better graphics.
SECOND: It was PLAYERS that demanded more complexity. PLAYERS asked blizzard that they wanted to do more than just press “cobra shot” all day, every day.
You know what… I am sick of this vanilla discussion. It’s retarded Lillith.
Go play Classic servers if you are so convinced of what you say.
you are deliberate missing the point
it wasnt about classes complexity .
it was about how casual friendly wow was.
just things like not loosing significant portion of your exp while dying or people being unabled to loot your corpse if you died making you compelty naked after you respawn and did corpse run ? it was collosal .
do you know how raiding looked in other mmorpgs ? if you died in raid - you had to go and regain the exp you lost - often - again loosing your equipement if peopel looted you
you know what real ninjaing was ? because in wow we never had real ninja - it was guild killing boss in “raid” which wasnt an instance only very often just part of map with swarms of peopel not engaging just waiting for drops to fall on ground and to be faster at licking it.
wow was often back then ridiculed by how it handheld its players - and guess what - exactly this handhelding made it the phenomenon it became.
Vanilla wow compared to the old Everquest? Sure. Il give you that.
But Vanilla WoW compared to Retail?
Casual friendly? Vanilla wow? BRO… You must be hallucinating. Really.
Let me just put it this way:
Once you dinged 60 in Vanilla. What would you do then? What COULD you do?
ONLY 1 thing: Raid. That’s IT. And not just any raid. There was ONLY 1 difficulty.
If such a system existed today, it would be like this:
No dailies. No Delves. No “tiers of difficulty”. No catch-up gear… NOTHING.
Just… hours and hours of farming for raid-buffs, world buffs and consumables. To raid in your 40 man group. For hours at a time.
And that is why Retail is still alive and ALL its competitors (including Classic Servers) are either dead or on life-support.
Think about it for a minute before trashing Retail. Because SOMETHING must work to keep people here.
And that something is adding more and more “player friendly” things over the years. Its literally THAT.
And FYI: That does NOT include easier and easier ways to get gear. That is just: More fun and convenient ways to get gear.
Today to get gear you actually have to play the content. Run some Delves. Do some M+… Raid some easy bosses… SOMETHING…
Back in Vanilla you had to mindlessly grind things as if they were some sort of reputation or something. Take Anquirah… how were the gates opened? YEAH… thats right. By farming MILLIONS of runic cloths. How? Spamming Dire Maul 2000 times. That is how.
WoW today is more casual friendly than it has ever been, especially at endgame level. Nor more forced grinds, no more attunements…
But the cryhards and "you don´t parse orange " wannabes have made any form of group content all teh way down to LFR and even leveling dungeons so hypertoxic that even players like myself that used to be the spearhead of “Just run with pugs, it´s a great way to make friends and grow your guild /community” for well over a decade now categorically refuse to deal with their constant BS, and would rather log out or run a delve than run anything more than timewalking or LFR with pugs.
If you think it sucks now…
You should have raided in previous expansions. Especially Vanilla, TBC and WotlK…
You would not be complaining so much if you did.
I´ve raided in every expansion since TBC, where I was an RWF raider and got world 10th on Kil Jaeden as some may know. In other words, I didn´t get my title by standing around afk in Shattrath 
Fun fact, probably about half of my honorable kills were from standing around bored in front of Sunwell and starting up trouble with the Carnivores, who used to be the premier Horde Guild on Thrall and raided at the same time we did 
It just used to be significantly better IMO, in no small part because anyone that decided to regularly be a douche was soon ostracized by the entire realm, later realmpool /battlegroup and simply didn´t get invites anymore. 
Well then you lack memory.
And the difference might be that you did not PuG Kil Jaeden. You did it with a guild.
Maybe you should start there. Remembering what it took to get into that Kil Jaeden guild to begin with. Because few were even trying to PuG the raids. And those that did try… you had an interview process as if you were looking for a job.
You would get your whole gear inspected from top to bottom. Forgot to enchant 1 thing? NOPE. Cant afford Crusaider? Too bad…
And now. You are comparing THAT with pugging raids and M+. Orders of magnitude easier than what it used to be.
COrrect, nobody pugged Kil Jaeden.
But Karazhan was ultra-puggable, and you could find groups literally 24/7, and the Pug scene really took off starting in Wrath, and from wrath until and Including WoD I happily led pug groups when I wasn´t raiding with my guild.
Did we inspect people? Of course we did, because even post Gs nobody wanted to take someone with PvP equip that wasted 1/4 of its stat budget on Resilience and /or that didn´t care enough to enchant it into a raid. But we also didn´t ahve a problem taking one or 2 people that were slightly undergeared when we knew the rest of the group was easily capable of succeeding.
These day? Need 650+ and AoTC to join a NHC group is the norm. Back then if you were 232+ Nobody had a problam taking you into an ICC 25 NHC run.
Pugging raids today is simply not even close to what it used to be.
But maybe, instead of accusing me of lacking memory, you should instead consider that we play on entirely different realms, becaause back then that made a massive difference. If you were on a realm with an RWF guild and in teh dsame faction, half the population wanted to get into that guild, and would often go above and beyond to become good enough to have a chance to join, resulting in a much more lively (and successful) pug scene
Ahh…
Must have forgoten the “link achevement” part from WotlK PuG scene. And gear score.
Yes, I explicitly mentioned gear score in teh paragraph before the quoted statement because I forgot it
I´m sorry if you had such an oppressive anti-newcomer scene on your realm. We didn`t. And no amount of accusing me of being delusional based on your expereinces on a completely different realm will ever change that
It didn´t really start devolving into the current state for us until x-Realm raiding was introduced and everyone else was now just an NPC that you´d probably never see again. Of course there were tryhards that wanted you to have ICC HC clear to run Nhc (Or rather ToC, because most people never cleared ICC HC while it was still current to begin with, even on 10 man, so no one but the most clueless would dare to ask because they´d be met with endless ridicule in /4)… and I can still name at least a dozen of them that eventually transferred away becasue after a while they coudln’t even get a 10 man group filled, much less a 25.
I dont see it that way. I just see it as your realm was a little bit behind into the reality of the PuG scene.
People used to be more leniant with invites. Untill the wipes came. In particular in the past when raid saves were locked in.
My realm was just faster and quicker to “catch on” to the opressivity. Yours just took a few years more to catch on.
We simply had a different pug scene, because it was a different realm with different players
Reality in an MMORPG is what the community make it. Our community stayed inclusive until it was no longer viable. The difference being we didn´t have the slow decline, but many of the guilds just “flipped a switch” /“locked the doors” when it became clear that inviting pugs from other realms was no longer going to be an enjoyable expereince sometime around Blackrock Foundry. Pugs from Thrall, Ambossar, kargath? sure, any day… but not from Antoindas, or Blackrock, or or or… We may be the only realmpool where /4 is still somewhat regularly used to fill up a raid… Most still use the LFG tool, but every so often someone like Frank or Moritz will post in /4 in teh hopes of getting someone that´s been around since forever in the raid instead.
And I´m quite thankful for that, as are probably most of the people that are still here and stil in the old guilds that have stood the test of time, like Mine, or Canus Ravus Panthera, Gens der Allianz, or Iluminati…
Because at the end of the day, it also means that even if my guild were to suddenly explode tomorrow, a new home that still has the “traditional” more inclusive mindset where I already know half the members is literally just a whisper away… as opposed to having to join some newfangeld tryhard guild that advertises themselves as wanting to raid mythic but doesn´t even have 20 members or HC clear yet
OK. Il take your neat heartwarming story.
But dont extrapolate your experiences in your rare as a diamond realm to everyone else’s experience. Most of us have it easy now. Compared to what it was.
the compeltion numbers show compeltly different story though .
Because you need the trash loot to be able to get ilvl for higher loot.
The faster you are done with the worse loot the better.
I also don’t get how blizzard have not figured out the whole ”Put gear/progression material in the store = more money” yet.
There was a new MMORPG released a few weeks ago and i’ve seen several people already throw 10000 Euro (or more) at this game.