Why not give people an option to start at level 60? That way people can choose if they wanna start at level 1 or at level 60. A bit like how the level 20 for allied races gives a nice headstart or hero classes starting at higher level.
Sure but the better picture would be to ask all subscribed people instead of just a few.
You claimed gear on raid level from professions would ruin raids and I prove you wrong by poiting to m+. Now stop being rude. tia
You are wrong, every new player only has to exactly 10 levels to be on the same level as his friends because of the free boost you get.
And every sane person would realize changing the 120 to ie 60 wouldnt change anything as in ~5 years you had to it again and again just like the stats squish.
Pls thanks to class trials people can try out clases before they level so no 120 isnt scarry for any sane person.
Sadly I think its mostly to do with WoW making the MMO genre mainstream. Most of the people I knew in Vanilla were MMO virgins.
+WoW changed the MMO genre… and I’d argue it wasn’t for the better.
So I guess that’s why quite a few people playing wow aren’t too miffed about less RPG mechanics and think 120 is a big number.
That’s millions of players, not very practical.
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It currently takes 24,378,336,348 XP to level from 67 to 68 ( just one level ) in Tera. That’s 24,378 million XP for one level. And before you say its easy though, it aint. I clear just 3% of one level per day. Meaning it takes me like 33 days to do one level. Sadly dungeons are locked behind limits on coins, though you can buy more to get more access. And trust me you have to kill BAMs to level… lots and lots of them and they are much harder to take down than any of the world mobs in this game.
I have been playing Tera since I gave up here a few months ago and kinda now reflect on just how easy it is to level in this game, WoW. I was doing each of the expansions in just over a day, two days tops here. My goodness if I could see that kinda return in Tera I’d be so happy.
So no idea why they need to squish the cap. Maybe if they had simply given players an option with scaling they may have had more players getting through the levels. Sounds like this current development team are about to muck up the game even further. By the time they launch Classic, then Classic will be the only true version of Warcraft left.
I was looking at my old scrrenshots today and the one that struck me the most was me sitting on my Talbuk in a sea of players for as far as the eye could look, at the harbor in Stormwind waiting for the first boat to go to Northrend. Maybe they should reflect on what it was to be a WoW player then cus in truth there wasn’t anything that could compete.
Maybe they should focus on putting the game back the way it was and building on the earlier successes rather than keep mucking up what they inhereted. or maybe go get back some of those true developers of the game that left and return back to some of the core values… Oh wait. ’ Classic ’ … ironic. Sad but ironic.
In the end it was never about time. It was about progression. A feeling of true progression and that includes zonal progression. Sadly with scaling they chucked the baby out with the bathwater and lost all sense of progression. Erasing all the talent training and skills, including specialist skills just removed any opportunity to create a unique character. And now with transmog and looms all you have is a false truth. The look and gear and titles and achievements in no way reflect the actual worth of the player. And Classic will remove all those. A player will again be able to play as a unique characters and build a truth based on true progression including zonal progression. These core elements have been destroyed by the current team… and sounds like they are not done yet.
Feels to me like Classic will eventually become the only PC based game and the rest will become a four button mash up so you can play on a mobile phone. But then you all have phones so shouldn’t be a problem.
No idea why I can still post here, anyway back to Arborea… I gotta shift that XP bar another millimeter before I go to bed tonight.
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Pollsters will tell you that you don’t need to poll everyone to get answers within a few percentage points, and they have math and a long history of accurate or close prediction on their side.
So there is good reason to say that Blizzard doesn’t need to poll millions of players.
But impractical? Not at all. A few million hits is not a big deal for a commecial site, and a few million table entries is nothing to even a personal database.
They could deliver invites through the BattleNet client, which might get a better response rate, at least from people currently playing the game.
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Yeah and I think there is a reason I never heard about that game until now. Please don’t list your irrelevant underground MMO games and think about the ones that actually are played by millions of people.
You never heard of Runescape? The game that WoW was designed to be a more casual version of? And you have no idea how many people have played it, or are playing it now? Maybe better not generalise about MMORPGs then.
Hm. Just checked OSRS. They publicise their figures openly on https://oldschool.runescape.com/ - 68,417 people online right now as I type this. I wonder what the equivalent number would be for WoW.
Also
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Wasn’t that EverQuest?
Regardless, I don’t think the issue with the level squish pertains to the numbers themselves. Rather, it’s the large gap in levels that all the content spans across. There’s some benefit to squishing it, so a single level covers more content, so you’re not always stretched so thin (pertaining to character progression too, talents and such). I think that’s the angle Blizzard are going for, not simply reducing numbers for the sake of having smaller numbers (that’s more the number squish problematic).
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DOH! Sorry, my bad. I was looking up numbers for three or four at the same time and blooped.
I do agree that the issue is not about how other MMORPGs manage levels, though. My point was to rebut the assertion that 120 was an unprecendented or even unusual number of levels.
I hope you’re right and I’m wrong about what Blizzard are going for. We may see,
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I don’t see the problem with the level squish. It could look like this:
classic 1-30
bc 30-35
wotlk 35-40
cata 40-45
mop 45-50
wod 50-55
legion 55-60
bfa 60-65
+5 increment for every future expansion
And for the talents repectively:
1st row at Lv10
2nd row at Lv15
3rd row at Lv20
4th row at Lv25
5th row at Lv35
6th row at Lv45
7th row at Lv55
maybe 8th row because who doesn’t love having more talents/skills to choose from ![:smiley:](https://d1bg94bbsh66ji.cloudfront.net/en/wow/images/emoji/twitter/smiley.png?v=6" ":smiley:")
And what exactly would that solve? Honestly? ![:face_with_raised_eyebrow:](https://d1bg94bbsh66ji.cloudfront.net/en/wow/images/emoji/twitter/face_with_raised_eyebrow.png?v=6" ":face_with_raised_eyebrow:")
Rewriting numbers so they look more uniform doesn’t improve the leveling experience whatsoever. (And apparently there are already AddOns that allow people to relabel numbers on their screen so what even is the point.)
Also, the 10-level WotLK bracket of 70-80 is now 35-40, but the 80-85 Cata bracket is also 5 levels with 40-45? Blizz have screwed up the current stat scaling system already, this would just result in even worse stat proportions, power jumps, leveling speed quickenings then inexplicable slowdowns. And all for nothing because you’d still need the same time to grind through the same boring ‘kill-10-boars’ quests, you’d just level up half as many times in the process.
Blizzard aren’t going to half the leveling time, they’re just going to re-label the same badly scaled crap quest and dungeon grind that we have now. They wouldn’t half the leveling time because it would reduce their character boost sales - they have even nerfed twink powerleveling now, with every group member getting 95% less xp if they are grouped with a twink. It’s obvious where their true interests lie (as if the heirloom nerf and leveling time extension weren’t enough to clue us in) and the level squish would make it seem like they’re solving a problem while actually not addressing any of the issues and creating new problems of its own.
I am Ardently against a level Squish. The first item squish was soon back to the numbers it was before the squish and the second has done nothing but slow down many fights including farming older content.
What is needed and i feel blizzard really do not get is a better more enjoyable leveling experience. If Blizzard Squish levels but it still takes just as long to level then what is the difference? same length of time, just smaller numbers.
I have spent 15 years getting many characters to max level 120 and Blizzard is going to take that away because they have no clue how to change the leveling experience or how to get more from a talent system, to be honest i feel a little robbed.
If we look back to classic wow’s talent system where there were a lot more choices then surely they could stagger that better, Add to that the artifact traits, why do we get to end content only to grind for artifact traits, cant these be added into the talents as we go along and then boosted at end content?
As for the leveling experience, how about allowing the player to chose between old pre-Cataclysm quest chains so players can get the classic wow leveling experience but allow them to also be scalable, and the current leveling experience, and scale all Zones so we can level anywhere, including up to current content,
How about making a end boss in each zone, a mini boss like the brawlers guild fights, so it enables players to experience a kinda raid boss fight, or make some of the roaming rare mobs to do the same as those brawler guild fights.
When Warlords of Draenor launched the way the treasures where used was magnificent, i loved exploring to find them, how about reintroducing them all around the world, but making them items that will help with that zones mini boss as i commented on earlier. or maybe a xp boost., this would make the zones much more interactive and a have a reason to look for items.
What about having the treasures give mount speed boosts for a limited time?. Or recipes for Professions, Toys, Pets, etc
As for making the zones more harder, why not make them like the dungeon experience currently is, and have difficulty level, so those that want a harder leveling experience can turn the zone to Mythic to level, which would not only give a harder fight, but also a xp increase to counter how the fights would take longer, so you would get a normal, heroic and Mythic leveling experience.
If Blizzard feel the need to make group quests then they should add a way to use NPC’s to help when player base dry up and there are no players to help.
As for Zonal leveling experience make them more dynamic, allow the story of each zone have a ending that would make you feel you had worked toward that end and were a real part of the story.
How about mounts in zones you catch, rather than just get them from rep, When i say a mount you catch, I’m think along the lines if the nether rays in TBC, so you personally have to go out find a mount and then catch and tame before you can add it to your stable of mounts, this would also add to a more dynamic zone.
How about adding mobs you have to avoid when flying? so it would make flying through zones a bit more interactive rather than just a quick way to get from A to B, mobs you can fight while mounted would be better, how feasible that would be i don’t know.
Make Professions more useful again, but add more into the zone experience, so rather than just go to a trainer or vendor to buy recipes/patterns add more quests, and not throw them into mythics in an attempt to force player to go into mythic Dungeons.
Allow all dungeons to be accessed at anytime so there would be more choice, but scale them, and not just during Timewalker weeks,
What i think is missed is choice, yes you can have to much choice, but atm, all the choice we have is grind. Blizzard must try and make the whole wow experience action packed and enjoyable.
When i look at the current incursions, why during an expansion called Battle for Azeroth is most of it on the new content, why are there hardly any, other than Darkshore and Arathi, on the main continents?
As for the Incursions themselves why not make them a whole day thing, and once a character has done the quests they vanish as they do now, the incursion would continue, and this would allow many more players to be involved.
This for me would help make a more dynamic experience and are just a few ideas i would like to see.
I am sure not everyone will agree, but surely these would be a better solution than constant squish, that basically hardly changes the game other than the numbers we see. I’m sure the players who have quit have not quit because the level is 120, I am sure it is because Wow has become Stale and Boring and to much grinding and time gating, people will play wow or not but slowing everything down in a hope it keeps people playing in my opinion does the opposite.
Why Spend all that time squishing items and levels when that time should be better spent making the game more exciting, and Dynamic.
I have started to find i play less and where as before i would keep my subscription rolling, i now cancel when i break from wow.
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That’s easy. You keep the exp rate for the cata expansion and half the required exp for all expansions with 10 levels. But again, it’s just me theorycrafting. Who knows what Blizz is going to do. 
But no, that’s the point, it’s not easy and they will screw up scaling even more. They already proved that they can’t handle squishes when they messed up the power curve when they squished the stats, they will screw it up even more if they squish levels.
There is a 20 ilvl difference between a lvl 70 and a lvl 80 item (ilvl 83 with +19 Agility and ilvl 103 with +24 Agility) and a 8 ilvl difference between a lvl 80 and a lvl 85 item (ilvl 111 with +26 Agility). Between lvl 60 and a lvl 70 that difference is 19 ilvls (ilvl 63 with +16 Agility, ilvl 83 with +19 Agility) and for lvl 90 that item is ilvl 121 with +28 Agility. In the squished example, the Vanilla to Wotlk item would scale 39 ilvls over 10 levels (from 30 to 40) but 18 ilvls over the next 10 levels (from 40 to 50).
And if people really think Blizz will just half the required xp for all 10-level expansions, that’s ridiculously optimistic (some might say delusional). After all, they could reduce the required xp right now without any level squish at all - they have adjusted xp requirements several times - and they noticably made them longer than before 7.3.5 (even with the re-adjustment), and they continue to make leveling methods harder (e.g. the BfA xp potion giving only 10% compared to earlier xp potions that gave 100% or 300%, them reducing group xp by 95% if you have a twink in the group). And I realize that this was mostly hypothetical since Blizzard haven’t published any concrete plans, but what they specifically mentioned (reducing the maximum number of levels nothing more) is useless, and what other things people think might accompany the move have really dodgy implications with the poor track record of Blizzard’s past squishes.
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@Morrhage
Everything sub max level is imbalanced since years. There’s not much to screw up anymore haha
I recall that time, people came to the forum and complained about how easy it was to level up. It’s slightly harder now and it’s wrong again lol. I’m not a fanboy, but whatever they do is wrong, somehow.
Concerning the 95% exp thing. It only affects groups, having a guy playing with “exp stop”. So to me, there is only a chance at some specific levels like the famous lv19 super twink, and the lvl cap for pretty much every addon. like 60, 70, 80, and so on. Shouldn’t bother much that way. I know, no more freehold boosts.
And my thoughts about the “half the exp” thing was just on the surface. I’m pretty sure they’re going to change way more than that.
thanks for showing that you havent leveled a toon lately:
after vanilla you go tbc OR wotlk these days why do you wanna PUNISH players by having to do both again?
The problem that leveling these days has no use at all is not changed by editing the level number of your toons.
I know about it very well. I’m leveling a warrior which is lv72 or something. I had to choose too. Stop making assumptions.
I wouldn’t mind if they found a way to make the leveling path interesting.
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the problem with leveling now is leveling…
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