I don’t need anything taken to me, I’m fine, thank you. You don’t need to explain to me that you can have a good player in an unpopular spec outperforming a bad player in a FOTM spec. Like I mentioned, I played enough Ret myself to know that very well. The bottom line is this though: there is no magic tooltip in LFG that shows you if a player is good or bad. Every time you are inviting someone, you are taking a gamble. You can’t blame people for trying to maximize their chances at hitting the jackpot by using any and all information available to them.
These ‘I don’t get invited to M+/raid’ threads that pop up every other day invariably fail to take into account one very simple truth. Pugs are inherently the most selfish environment imaginable. The person setting up the group does not give a flying eff who you are. They want their reward, in this case a completed key, preferably in time. They don’t care one bit what you want. Every character that shows up in LFG is a tool to that end. You are just a number for the group leader. That number is usually ilvl, but it could also Rio score, an achievement, a particular spec etc. They don’t care about anything but getting the highest possible number because in the absence of any other information, that gives the best chance at getting them their reward.
You don’t like that? You don’t want to just be a number on someone else’s screen? No problem, there’s a very simple solution: stop pugging. If you willingly play in the pug environment, you need to be ready to play by the rules of the pug environment. And the golden rule is: you are not a person, you are a number in someone else’s loot gambling lottery.
And please stop pretending this is a pve thing and pvp pugs are somehow different. The only thing that’s different is you use rating in place of a Rio score and you can occasionally get lucky and slip in with a lower number because the playerbase is much smaller and the party leader can get fed up with waiting.
+10 and +11 is 203 for reference, sure it’s not much higher than what you have, but getting into +10 and +11 without even doing +6 in time yet… it’s not a reasonable thing to expect.
So while +6 and +7 can’t give you any upgrades, or only minor ones, they still require you to know dungeons and affixes, and people won’t invite someone to their key who doesn’t know either of those.
Hence why you should do more low keys to progress, get all dungs timed on 5 and move up from that. You won’t get ilvl, but you’ll get rio score, which matters in mythic+.
You can’t just jump from doing bgs for 197 gear to suddenly doing +7 runs just because it gives 200 ilvl reward. You can if you make your own key and push it.
It wont (maybe from weekly vault?), but it will give you experience and rio that will help u get into the higher keys.
U have gotten alot of advice in this topic, now u gotta either build that rio, make some friends or keep applying to keys in the hopes someone will take you or run your own key.
I’d also add it is slightly different for PvP because utility matters a heck of a lot more. Picking a meta spec in PvE usually translates to picking a guy who has a combat ress and deals 20% more DPS than the other guy or similar.
Picking a meta spec in PvP translates to picking a guy who can nail an enemy in their burst CD, has the ability to make an ally immune to physical damage/snares, can go immune themselves, has a heck long stun, etc. All of this are far bigger game changers in PvP than the meta lead in PvP because the nature of the game is quicker and players don’t behave like mobs.
Ret is fine in PvE but they are much better in PvP. In PvE overall performance is key. In PvP ATM it is largely burst, and Ret is an all in spec. This works wonders in PvP and their all in is potentially very safe and strong. Mobs have too much HP for the burst to be so significant as it is in PvP.
I mean people should know this, Sub is a great PvP spec but in PvE is mediocre. Outlaw is crap in PvP but best rogue spec in PvE. Being a good PvP spec doesn’t always translate to being wanted in PvE unless you’re lucky and both burst and your sustained is also okay (or your burst comes back quickly enough) like Spriests, fire mages, MM, Boomie. Ret sadly despite sharing good PvP spots with this guys does not translate into PvE as well as they do ATM.
Your Raider IO is low, typical-pro-M+ player thinks that you cant do a 5 if you dont have a 4 already competed.
The problem with pugs is that you have to play the game their own way to “convince them”, you want to get invited in 10’s? You have to have all 9’s completed to get as much rio and then wait for one day that the sky will be bright and sun will be shining and then you will get an invite.
Otherwise you can reroll to hunter/ww/boomie or Rshaman/Hpala or Dhtank and get invited even with minimal to zero XP.
And oh well, check this out, a Ret Pala having 24.60% on item level 219, omg he’s such a noob, oh no, wait, he has more CR than you, making him a good player with low Versa and you’re a bad player with 50% more Versa, I rest my case k10xbye
I can’t wait to boost my item level and get 2.34% more Versatility! Gonna make the whole difference in the world, like not getting Starsurge’d for 12,986 damage, but getting 12,498 damage instead, yeah!
So let me get this straight, I link death recount showing I got hit for 30k by ret pala while at 22% vers, you said I need more vers, now you’re saying more vers wouldn’t make a difference?
2Head
Ret pala is op, sure it can be countered at higher rating, but at bgs/ebgs you’re using as example, you should have no issues topping scoreboard as ret.
He doesn’t want advice and help, he wants a place to vent and people to agree with him, even if he’s wrong.
I do low keys like that. Here is my logic list, based on experience and trying to respect my party’s time (and my time). None of this is meant as against any specific player, in pugs it’s just safer to guess that the player will be like the majority of their class has been so far.
I try not to stack classes, if it’s things like paladin or warlock for example. All my full pala parties have ended in fails due to low damage on bosses. All my full warlock parties have failed due to lack of interrupts and low damage overall.
I take people who are similarly progressed or slightly less than I am. I don’t want someone who’s going to be a jerk to my party because they think having completed a +5 means they can boss my +2 around.
The person’s dungeon experience is skewed. I don’t care if the pug timed a +8 Mists, when I’m trying to do a +7 Plaguefall and their best for Plaguefall is a failed +2. My whole party has timed at least a +5.
Their actions prove they didn’t look at the party info at all. Includes whispering me if I said “don’t whisper me” in the info/title, or applying as a melee dps when my title says “need ranged”.
If they’re applying for my +5 Spires but have done a +10 before. Why is this person here? They’ll likely be impatient and are just looking to feel like a good person, like they’re “boosting” us. I am not someone’s good deed for the day, I only do chill keys.
Community perception. But I go against it because it’s funny to me. I prefer to take a feral druid over a mm hunter for example. Because most mm hunters I see now, are terrible - they think their spec being fotm means they’re automatically good, without putting any work into learning their specs.
I’m sorry you’ve had bad luck joining pugs. But pugs are kinda always like that. Try to join guilds, or M+ communities. They tend to run with anyone, community perception be damned. Most of the fotm spec pugs are outdamaged by my favourite prot warrior tank… :'D
As others have said I would highly recommend pushing your own key and building up your score. You have two dungeons with no score at all as well. Even you don’t use the addon raider io, others in game do. Dps are also the most common factor when it comes to dungeons. Leaders get to pick and choose and many will only take one melee, others don’t care.
You might also want to consider joining a key community where it’s easier to find others to play with. I hear lots of good things about Scared of Dungeons for Alliance.
the lfg is system is one of the weakest points of wow, if not the weakest right now. some days ill get lucky and start doing stuff nonstop, and some day im watching youtube jumpingaround in oribos signing up to ANY rbg team, m+ and arena without suxcess, everyone wants you to have exactly the talents conduits they think are optimals, the achivements proving that you should be a blizzcon winner if you felt like it, the gear and stats to absolutely obliterate the current objectives, like you drop 200? well, you can join only if you are 210. and even with allt hese things, sometimes they don’t take you. like im a 218 fire mage, well Rated bg is out of the question, and if i don’t hjave curve, god forbid i apply to a Denatrius kill just for the chance to get that godamn ring.
im not saying its wrong… group making should be like this, improving the meta, optimal gameplay, playing like elitists, everything is perfect.
BUT we should also have the option to just play the game and relax, thats why me and another million players are begging for a new lfg system where if you want to make your optimal party, thats fine, but if youi just wanna play you can just sign up and play, this would be REALLY BIG for rated bg and stuff like that.
It’s not, really. Numbers aren’t that good neither better than other class, and aside few very limited scenarios, we bring nothing really helpful to the table. No big group buffs, no hero, no brez, no shroud etc etc etc.
That’s quite ironical, because Retribution is primarily a support spec and role, including and especially in PvP. Same thing goes for Enhancement, it’s also called “a utility spec”.
And this seems to be valid for PvP, yet somehow nobody notices when you’re the only reason holding a group in a critical moment with Blessing of Sacrifice on the healer, Blessing of Protection on a DPS and crit healing the 3% Mage in the group for 22k.
Yet at the end of the Dungeon somebody just posts Recount healing done and the Warrior and Hunter have more than you
Ret used to be a support role, except the game evolved in gutting everything that defined that role, but we’re stuck with this design. It’s not ironical, it’s moronic. And every time i have to play as a ret i pray santa claus to let me slap very very hard in the face the devs responsable for this for christmas.
We lost the ap buff a long ago. Poison and disease cleanse is mostly a solo self thing because in the current dungeon meta, if there is a poison 95% of the time is on everyone and not just a single target, so it’s “heal a lot” rather than dispel.
BoF is helpful on maybe 2 boss across the whole list of dungeon.
Half of the classes now have an immunity now to soak stuff. And so on.
But hey, we are a support role, so it’s correct that our dmg is meh and we have the mobility of an oil tanker.
It was a good idea to turn ret into true dps spec. They just didn’t went far enough in that direction. I mean, support are useless in current wow : If you need more healing, then you trade 1 dps player for a healer, and if you need to pump out more dps, then you remove a healer for a dps.
As I said, ret is the only hybrid spec to pay a hybrid tax and it feels bad.
On the topic : Sadly, you’re playing retribution paladin, which :
-Provide no relevant utility to both raids and M+
-Has mediocre damages
-Is damn slow
-Is a melee dps spec
The addon is just a convenience. The same info is on the armory page, and there’s nothing toxic about wanting to maximize likelihood of timing the key with the current shortage of loot.
