Great read but hasn’t answered a single point I outlined
This has nothing to do with Man’ari Eredar?
Possible , yes. Likely? No
This is nonsense
It’s more a case of why are you so against other player’s wanting something you don’t. You don’t need to play one, or create one, and you can choose not to engage with someone who does.
and who are you exactly? lol
Then I think it is best to understand the difference between the two before commenting. It is most certainly not, a demand.
So you can’t refute it at all so you come out with this ridiculous statement. I see
Were they acting on their own will without any other entity then?
That would be cool as heck, I love the Nathrezim! though, maybe not an Allied race but a customisation option for DH demon form
nice 180
After all the Dark Iron Dwarves have done, they will join the Alliance?
During TBC , Illidan and all his followers were evil and the Horde and Alliance were against them.
One rule for one , different rule for someone else according to you
That is completely fine, but if it is someone else’s cup of tea , then you need to respect that
Or perhaps the Man’ari will be free of the burning legion and seek a new home and existence
Good, glad you said that, now if you could start respecting it rather than incessantly trying to validate your opinion of it not being in the game, that would be grand
Lightforged draenai do have a gift of the naaru, actually you even can select your gift of the naaru when you creat your character and it shows up always at the top of your head while for regular draenai it shows up only on combat. By “gift of naaru” i dont mean the racial itself but the symbol that shows up at the top of their heads.
We saw man’ari with that actually in WoD, it was the Sargerei, they have the gift of the naaru showing up as a green symbol because they were gifted by the naaru and then took the fel gift which made the sign also be corrupted.
I want that the man’ari have such customization for themselves, but it would also make more sense if they would not have it at all since some would not be touched by the Light.
Gift of the Naaru means that at some point you were touched by the Naau which are beings of the Light, i kinda have hard to time imagine the Man’ari accepting the Light, they are being of fel now, and i would find more logicial that they build their strenght around it rather than go to another force.
Even if what you say can also work, but i dont imagine it happenning, i mean, so far i doubt that the gift atop their heads would be green.
Rakeesh is technically not dead, since he died on Azeroth, and i advise you to watch Kil’jaeden death cinematic, and see how Velen react to what Kil’jaeden tells him, you will see he is more on a “i forgive you” part, and that is Kil’jaeden, the one who made him suffer most.
The thing is, you dont listen to what i say, nor did you read any of the arguement i brought up, you have your own echo chamber for yourself, and its why i found it was no longer a good idea to answer you.
The fact you bring up Rakeesh’s death as an arguement is a clear fact that you did not read my OP as my story to how the man’ari would be playable to evolve Rakeesh and Velens wife as key factors to make Velen be more on the forgiving side.
Its really funny how you just play gatekeepers saying “it dont makes sense it dont makes sense” but dont even bother reading the arguements brought up to you.
Nothing to do with gameplay. Honestly I wouldn’t mind if you got red draenei. I think you are wasting a race slot cause I’d ask for something more interesting like an actual succubus, but that’s my opinion. I’m just amused how personal you people take it when someone wants something else. That’s all.
If comments of disagreement were left at this , things would be so much easier
The way people disagree on an idea though, seems like they will stop at nothing, until the person who had the original idea goes, “yeah ok terrible idea thanks”
eh?
Well if you take the time and energy to create your own with passion and excitement, and someone comes along and argues and argues, no doubt you’d end up ground down and irritated
Its not about that, its about making an argument in itself, actually i dont see why we would just refuse something, because to be fair here it dont go much fruther than “i dont want it” “why?” “because it dont make sense” give aruement to explain why it do makes sense and person answer “it dont makes sense because i dont want it”
Thats basically the way it is, and it dont bring anywhere, i never refused to discuss with people who have different opinions, but just to say “my opinion is, that i dont want because i dont want” will never go very far…
Only when their headcanon pleases them that they will go into headcanon, they use facts only when it serves their purpose, otherwise they dont want to let other have their own theories or headcanon…
Because i did not ask them? And also because the man’ari are doable.
Its why i ask them to be a full allied race called man’ari…really did you read my OP? Because all answers are in the OP! Actually going and argue without even reading the OP is disrespectful…
Azshara and well of eternity thing was the 1st invasion of the Legion, and actually, the Night elves did accept the highborns back into their ranks, even thought they were from the ones who summoned the Legion into Azeroth.
Thats only your speculation, you dont have anything to support that claim, its why it can be anything, but you dont see any of the other possibilites that can happen, for someone who wanted to promote the Void and its possibilites thats ironic
I litereally addressed all of your points.
Velen means A LOT to the Draenai people. Probably thousands of years old from what I remember and has always led them since Argus. There is still kinship with Velen and the Lightforged Draenai that was there even though he left.
Kiljaedden and Archimonde are Manari Eredar. They are also Burning Legion and are demons. It was a Manari plan to exterminate the Draenai since Kiljaedden took it very personally that Velen chose not to take up Sargeras deal.
That is my point. If you replace Manari Eredar with Murlocs. Others can argue with such passion.
World of Warcraft is a Massive Multiplayer Online Role Playing Game.
So some could have fun with a Draenai Warlock and Lightforged Draenai Warlock. But that will not make sense. Since in order to impliment it. You have to retcon - bend - break what was already established.
The same as a Forsake Druid or Forsaken Paladin.
For almost 20 years. Blizzard Entertainment had established that some species can be some classes for X races.
Why turn things on its head now?
Already explained to the OP why Dark Iron Dwarves are not the same thing as Manari. He seems to have fled to the ignore list I think.
Yes. It was ALWAYS a choice. Sargeras did not need slaves. He needed willing participants to impliment into his endless hordes of Demons that became the Burning Legion. Archimonde Kiljaedden Velen were the leaders of the Eredar. 2 out of 3 of their species chose the Burning Legion.
The Manari are just as evil or more evil than the demons of the Burning Legion.
To claim that: The Manari did nothing wrong. Is nonsensical. Also shows an ignorance of the game.
Not sure how that would work.
Scrapped with the Bronzebeard and Wildhammer Dwarves. Some Dark Irons followed Ragnaros. Like I said. Comparing Apples to Nuclear Bombs. One of these things are not like the other.
Illidan and his Illidari has the sole focus of stopping the Burning Legion. At the time the goals of the Alliance the Horde and the Illidari did not align. This is why it is good to show that the Alliance and Horde while being global superpowers are just a part of Azeroth. Including how the players experience the WORLD of Warcraft. The WORLD should be the focus.
They made their choice. The Manari are more similar than different to the demons of the twisting nether.
It is a tough sell to convince the player base or Blizzard to make Manari an Allied race. You have a better chance convincing them to make Murlocs an Allied race.
Trust me if I did that I would be prepared for people who don’t agree with me. If that little would irritate me I would probably have jumped off a bridge back in 2019.
This is actually the main reason your reaction amused me that much. This person you argue has explained to you why they don’t make sense, however you simply refuse to accept any argument they brought forth and decided that the reason this person says it does not make sense is because they are evil and don’t want you to have your joy. That’s what amused me. What the hell happened to agreeing to disagree?
why are you responding?
thought you followed Kentarro’s advice to flee to the ignore list?
Bit of trivia for you then. Was Archimonde / Kiljaedden killed in the twisting nether?
Does listening to your points mean to be in full agreement with what you say? Are people not able to disagree with each other?
There is echo chamber mentality. The persons advice you followed is familiar. Not quite a bad actor but does seem to be leaning that way.
Anyway. You put up a thread, people are discussing the topic you brought up then you run from it. Seems counter productive.
If I put up a thread about Orange Penguins then get mad that people are talking about Orange Penguins it is foolish of me to then run from the topic. No?
My point was that if anything can be an Allied race to the Alliance and the Horde then EVERYTHING can be an Allied race to the Alliance and the Horde. The Manari Eredar are Burning Legion just like the Pit-Lords and the Nathrazeme.
Technically the practice of magic was punisheable by death due to the whole High Borne thing in Night Elf society. But Night Elf mages were a game choice.
Yes I know. Legion expansion was the 2nd invasion.
Not speculation at all. Burning Legion destroyed world after world. The Manari Eredar was there for every world destruction and species extinction since joining the Burning Legion.
The Manari would have destroyed Azeroth and all life on it was it not for them facing defeat. A strong Burning Legion and strong Manari Eredar race is a universal level threat. They will continue Sargeras mission / edict to kill all life everywhere.
Giving even an entry level knowledge of the Burning Legion it is not a speculation. I was simply correcting your misunderstanding of the Void.
Sometimes other people might know something that you do not concerning lore. take it as a learning opportunity.
According to you , Man’ari are Burning Legion, in fact you’ve stated that it’s more Burning Legion are Man’ari , as if no other members exist lol.
I think you’re just trolling at this point
See point regarding D.I.D
People wanted Tauren Rogues for ages, and loads of people said it doesn’t fit with lore
What have we got now?
You seeing it yet?
They’ve changed their mind loads of times , it’s different individuals working on the game, not all are original staff, and opinions / desire change
and your explanation is great to you and terrible to others. He put you on ignore as it’s evident you will stop at nothing until - Okay you’re right it’s a terrible idea, while also trying to claim you accept people have different interests/ desires and opinions
You also claim the OP is demanding, when it’s a sincere exciting request, to manipulate things in the vain attempt to elevate your opinion
" are eredar that have been turned into [demons] by the [Burning Legion])"
Why are you manipulating lore ?? That certainly does NOT sound like complete conscious free will without influence … ???
It seemed to be obvious that the Burning Legion have more races and elements to it than just the Manari. Odd think to have to spell it out for some.
Not trolling just explaining that World of Warcraft is not a solo experience. Yes you might hear news of private servers. But it is not mainstream WoW.
New race class combinations should come with explanations. Tauren Rogues and Draenai Rogues never had any explanaition as is Tauren Mages or Orc Priests.
Different races have different power sources. But that is another discussion for another time.
Your argument is simple. Given enough time Manari Eredar race will become the “new normal” just like Touren Rogues.
But by that logic so to will Murlocs or if we go further down the rabbit hole. Sargeras is the High King of the Alliance and the Warchief of the Horde.
It would be tough trying to sell the idea of the Alliance and the Horde accepting Sargeras as their leader. Outside of being conquered.
This is a symptom of a larger disease. How much staff that made it the WORLD of Warcraft has Blizzard Entertainment lost?
Creative vision is important. If you compare that to the story telling quality of Anime and Manga. Once the writer dies or quits you can see the intellectual property take a different direction.
Look at Star Wars before and after Disney take over? It is not the same franchise.
I think he succumb to peer pressure. It is easy to default to echo chamber. But once you put an idea out there you should be willing and or able to defend it. at the very least see if you stand up to scrutiny.
I made a thread about “Making the case for Kul Tiran Paladin” where I laid out reasons and possibilities.
Demons have a tendency of whenever their physical bodies dies. Their souls go to the Twisting Nether where they are eventually reborn. So should somethings soul be able to get to the Twisting Nether in death. It is a sign of them becoming demonic. regardless of whatever species they once were.
Okay then. Sell the idea of Murlocs as an Allied race?
Defeated or not. The Manari are and always will be Burning Legion.
The racial is more gameplay, but also lore, even if, to be fair, if the man’ari would have a customizable racial that would be fel mend instead of gift of naaru i would not really mind to be honest, but again this was never a thing so far with customization such a dark rangers
Again on the gameplay scale, i prefer to use what we have seen so far than to beg blizzard to make more work on customization…its a bit sad but to me customization have lot less flavor than a separate allied race.
I dont really like the constant view of “wasting slots” to me you cant “waste” race slots, you will always have people who want brand new things, and people who want more classical things, the way people put the arguement of “i prefere to have somehting different and i go agaisnt you because to me you will waste my chances” is a bit weird, i mean nothing ensure you that because i ask somehting i want it means that you will not get your things too. Its a bit why i always found this a bit weird.
I take it personal kind of because the way people dismiss the idease are kind of childish, as if you say “no i dont want you get that candy because it means i wont get that same candy”
What i meant here is that, i think the blood elves are more knowlodgalble regarding the fel magic and how to sate the thurst related to it than any of the alliance races, but of course you can also use Demon Hunters for that its not out of the question.
It is not at all a tought sell, you really think players base is 99% of gatekeepers like you are? Not at all…most players want tuskars and murlocs is also asked a lot, i think you should get infos of how the community actually is, when we got the dracthyr people were more annoyed to not get the drakonids because they were more beafy than to even question the lore about both of these races being playable ><
yes…you did not play wod/legion or what?
See, its why i dont like to argue with you, because you are very disrespectul in the way you answer…
The problem is more the way of arguements are made, they are most of the time an endless circle of people saying “i dont want because i dont like it” and dont bring any factual things…
You are allowed to desagree but to prouve me wrong you must bring up facts, not headcanon…and its what you are doing since the start its why its a bit of a wase of time.
I dont run from it, i am just tired to talk to a wall.
Yes, and i advise you to stop being narrowed about it. You love to theorize dont you? So why my theory have less values than yours? Why do you bring up headcanon only when it suits you?
Not it was explained in the Lore back in Cataclysm, the Night Elves accepted the Shen’dralar a cast of hightborn back into their ranks, its how Night elf Mage was explained, you even have a novel called Wolfhert to talk about this.
Legion was the 3rd invasion, 1st being war of the ancient which ended when the well of eternity exploded, and the 2nd was during the 3rd war which ended when Archimonde was blown up by the wisps at the battle of mount hyjal. (Having to explain this really shows how much you know about the lore…)
The Burning Legion existed BEFORE the man’ari joined it, so what you say is wrong since it did conquer worlds before the man’ari joined it.
Not all were happy with Sargeras and that is factual, Kil’jaeden himself was not happy with Sargeras, there is plenty of demons who wanted Sargeras dead, you have Ultalesh for example, Sataiel, and some others who got punished by Sargeras because they defied him. The demons are not happy having a boss, they are chaotic beings, they dont care about conquering the cosmos or uniting, only Sargeras was able to unite them into the Legion because they were afraid of him.
Why are you so like “rigid” you refuse to accept that all demons were not with the leigon or Sargeras? Sataiel is a good example of a demon who left the Burning Legion to do her own things : https://wowpedia.fandom.com/wiki/Sataiel
What you are doing since the start is confuse 2 things, demons and burning legion, both are 2 different things and you fail to separate both of them…
Its like if i said all undeads are scourge.
Thats why all of them are in the Legion right? HO NO not all of them are in it; checkmate!
I’m going off what you have said btw and there is no need to be rude. I could comment a lot about spelling but won’t stoop down to your level
Redundant comment proving absolutely nothing
and also like the very race you are posting from
but you keep going off on a waffle trying to deflect away from the truth
claiming it’s like comparing grapes to nuclear weapons or some rubbish
More waffle
Plenty of incredibly talented members of staff currently at blizzard
If you don’t think so… why you playing ?
No not at all , they just saw sense and the bigger picture
They have and did. Like I said, you will stop at nothing short of them basically deleting the OP
Good for you bud, not something I naturally desire, but hey sure why not. I enjoy more flavours
If you aren’t able to keep up with our post series, can you please go back and revist what my comments are in reference to please. As this reply is completely irrelevant
No you see…I don’t have to. It isn’t MY IDEA! It was YOUR ridiculous comparison that is nothing to do with me that I made very , very clear I felt it was ridiculous
You aren’t a story writer nor are you employed by Activision Blizzard
Making such statements like this is quite embarrassing
It happened with Dark Iron Dwarves, it could happen for the Man’ari Eredar
and I would LOVE TO SEE IT
Red Eredar Chads for the horde !
oh forgot to mention
I’ll let you in on a little secret…
Blizzard would implement playable dalaran sewer rats if there was a way to make a profit and no amount of lore that opposes it would stop them
Tauren rogue is a thing, like it or not, but it is in the lore since vanilla with the grimtotems and they are also mentioned in the novel the sunderring (releassed for the lauunch of Cataclysm) you know what i think, i think you are ignorant of many htings according to the lore, and when you have a lack of knowing things, you just go and say “it dont make sense” but dont worry i am here to prouve you wrong!
What i love is that, you say tauren rogue makes no sense, but an undead who smell as bad as a rotting corps being rogue for you is logicial…
I disagree, I think some races have been a waste of a slot, like the vulpera and the robo gnomes, but ok, then let’s call it a line. Nobody wants to be at the back of it and everyone wants to be at the front. Even you can understand that I think. Plenty of people have their opinion to what’s interesting or what isn’t.
But that’s what happens in the end. When they do add a race to the game it’s something some people have been asking for while others have been asking for something different. Those who got what they wanted get to enjoy themselves, those who didn’t, back in line. Does not meat you shouldn’t post about what you want, but be prepared to have your requests challenged.
I don’t see it that way personally
I didn’t want Robo gnomes at all but I see it more as , if they can do Robo-gnomes then what else could we get that I would really like
I also don’t hold any negative feelings towards players that enjoy Robo Gnomes, so I don’t entirely agree with what you’re trying to say there
I have no issues with that, but its more the way the idea are challenged that i find not great, the “i dont like it so i will cherry pick lore arguements to enforce my view” that the other person do is more the problem here.
What i find often an issue is the way people confuse their opinions with facts, if you bring me facts i can more rely, but if you tell me just your opinion, i mean, i cant really go agaisnt your opinion because its a bit bad, you are allowed to have your opinion, but the problem is when ppl try to legitimize it with bias to enforce their opinions and turn them into “i am right you wrong”
And i have no issue with that. But at the end of the day, its best if everyone get something they like! And so in that goal i think everyone should be supporting everyone so everyone gets stuff!
It is actually. You keep saying “gatekeepers” as if it is a dirty word.
Do you need a “gatekeeper” to tell you say for example why Sargeras as High King of the Alliance and Warchief of the Horde will not work?
Sometimes some things are just foolish ideas.
It is not what he says it is how he says it. Right?
I understand that you are passionate for Manari Eredar to be part of the Alliance or Horde as an allied race. Some people have the same or more passion for Murlocs to be an allied race. But passion can be misplaced.
You talk about headcannon but it is actually the lore. The Eredar was recruited because Sargeras saw their potential. How he recruited them was to bring them over willingly. But Velen with the help of the Naaru saw through Sargeras deception.
Sargeras got two thirds of the Eredar race.
The allied race issue can be a double edge sword in the fact that it could erode at the Soul of the Alliance and Horde. Should it be mishandled.
That is a real chin scratcher.
Battle of mount hyjal can’t really be described as an invasion. Nice try though.
Of course there were demons that want Sargeras dead. He was the very one that slaughtered a lot of them and or imprisoned them in the first place.
But Sargereas is what you would call an overpowering existence that keeps things like endless numbers of demons in check. Loyalty is not really a trait of demons anyway.
Sargeras was cunning and manipulative and became the asset that Sargeras molded him into. However just like the other demons Sargeras had was of keeping the Manari in check as well.
It is this overpowering existence that once forced their capitulation to him. Should he ever be released from his prison then he can do so again. So defeated or not it would make sense that they remain part of the Burning Legion. The wrath of Sargeras is probably something they know well.
While some demons make contracts and such with Warlocks they are still more or less connected to the overall Burning Legion.
The curse of undeath is connected to the Scourge. So most Undead are indeed Scourge.
The Manari are what they are because of the Burning Legion. There is no separating them and the legacy of the Burning Legion.
checkmates and gotchas are funny in an ongoing discussion.
YOUR 
