So you are playing at low lvl that usualy is even more unbalanced as attacks dont scale propperly, and half the toolset for most classes missing. Playing a niche build that ppl arent used to and catch them ofguard… would that be the case if it was a standard ret toolset?
Also congrats on feeling good when most of the classes dont have half their toolset so even handle most sittuations they normally can at max lvl. I myself dont care about twinks, can be fun at times but no, dont care in the slightest.
And as for your second post about the animation… care just as much as the twink part. Its minor compared to what little synergy our attacks have with eatchother and how they function. Eatch to their own but im tired of being a lighthouse discoball of animation to warn ppl that dmg is comming. Is that why you liked Empowered seals, the massive annimation it had? For me that was a massive X that meant “target me please, have trouble finding me… guess more lights are needed!!”. Or was it the twirl one did when using templars? Just looked silly to me but sure, twirl around!
Friendly reminder here that (talking mostly from Rated PvP pov) it is a VERY obnoxious speed increasing ability, because:
It does not stack with any other movement speed increasing effects/enchants/gems (aside from Crusader Aura, and even that is disabled in RBGs for example).
It still bugs sometimes when you are casting it close to edges and/or corners, thus making it completely despawn, and you having wasted a 45 seconds cd for nothing.
It’s a pseudo-cooldown that is never truly self-reliant on its own, and 99,99% of the time it requires Freedom to be used in advance so that it can be of any worth.
It’s an extra inefficient small-scale cd that you have to manage carefully, and even then the results are often really poor regardless.
Our old movement speed options (Long Arm of the Law, Pursuit of Justice, Speed of Light) were a lot more interactive, a lot more engaging, a lot more fun to use (at least for the majority of the Ret community) and a lot more reasonable.
Well, agreed, yes, but most certainly not to the degree we were in Legion. Having double Freedom + Emancipate/root cleanse used to make quite a difference.
Back in Legion, you had one Freedom. Unbound Freedom didn’t exist yet, and the 2 afore-mentioned things were removed from the game. Then, you had nothing.
To me personally, it never really stopped looking silly since the first day I saw it.
Maaan…
I miss Empowered Seals so, so, so, so, so, so much.
Ehm yhea, dont care. Nor do i care for this class anymore with a dev team that clearly doesnt either and a player base thats stuck in the glory of its past that never truly was.
The placement that Ret currently has is the same in nearly every expansion… even your golden era WoD. Wasent there a meme of “lolret” from over a decade ago? When was WoD again?
When classic was gonna go live there were ppl arguing about Ret being viable in raids, showing clip etc just like above, you are not gonna gaslight me on the “extreamly fun” gameplay WoD was.
Mobility of others have by far gone beyond what WoD ret can kite or catch up to… but “its fun”?.. sure tell yourself that, im done.
I mean, not gonna lie, it does seem kind of silly and pointless to join any forum or conversation if you’re going to hold that stance as soon as people don’t fall like leaves in agreeing to whatever you say, but ok. You do you.
I never once mentioned placements? I merely stated that Steed is an obnoxious cooldown, and then I explained my reasoning as to why I believe what I believe. I don’t really mind its placement, as long as it is fun to play.
You are confused. The “lolret” meme was given birth during Wrath of the Lich King, actually. Not WoD.
That’s a super poor strawman fallacy right there, as I did not link you any videos, or talked about viability, or talked about WoD in general, or how fun it was. I simply stated that I miss Empowered Seals.
Errr… not really, though? Also, imagine thinking that you can use this as an excuse to completely abide by a semi-bugged mobility cooldown that no one asked for.
As if Steed is able to catch up to the mobility of others! xd
So according to you, Ret mobility is fun only when it is on par (or better) than that others, and WoD Ret mobility was super bad, but Steed is somehow super good. Alright, gotcha!
All ive wanted was a gapcloser, thats it. Speed boosts matters little to me atleast, any form of them, they are to compliment our other tools, not be the sole provider of mobility.
Never said this, but it also had, for the 58th time, emancipate. The main reason mobility for me back then was bearable even pre LaotL.
Again never said this so ill now question your reading comprehension, do you understand words? While not having emancipate, having a faster speed boost is better then a slow one so you can actually get somewhere during freedom, Thats it! Its still freaking horrible, still boring and offers very little gameplay options!
But missunderstand me some more please and draw wild conclusions over the words i say.
Blizz are intent on resetting our mobility with the miniscule advances we made over the years now for the second time and wont be the last, while other classes stockpile mobility and CC like there is no tomorrow. And still you dream about your past… from over a decade ago when ret were just as welcome to parties as it is today, well not due to mobility but all the other issues. All of them unchanged or worse in DF.
Er, you, eh… kind of did, even though it was in an indirect form. How else/In which other way would you interpret that sentence of yours? xd
Which I literally mentioned in my first reply back to you.
Which you probably didn’t even read, and from which you, very conveniently, dodged tackling all of the points I was making.
I’ll regard this as soft-trolling, and treat it the same way I would treat some junk mail:
Send back to sender.
Absolutely wild coming from you, someone who literally pulled a strawman out of their rear end on me a little while ago, but ok.
Oops, and there it is again! Would you look at that? Another strawman!
I would like to at least tell you that you’re rather good at this, but oh, believe you me, unfortunately, I’d then be deviating a lot from the thin line that is the truth.
Anyways, it is clear that you are not here - on a forum, btw - to exchange opinions, but to force down your own unto others. I do not understand why you are here then, but it is clear now (after reading about 10+ comments of yours on this page) that you have very little input to offer, and most of it is of questionable quality.
… Where is one countering the other here? Wild conclusion drawn yet again and on and on it goes for the rest. So yhea, words are not your thing here. Continue with your smilies as thats clearly the form of your conversation skills.
Played some rated solo shuffle today, exactly as I thought, my bubble just vaporizes - the biggest defensive we have - gone in 0.5 seconds even before the gcd from casting it finishes.
Well, counter play doesn’t work without counters. Bubble (Divine Shield) makes you immune to all damage for 8s. That’s pretty hefty, considering that’s 8s for us Paladins to attack without taking any damage. Seems just fair to me that people can dispel our very triggering and annoying immunity.
We need to adapt to that, that will take time. But eventually, we will find tactics and strategies to overcome that obstacle.
I don’t even want to have bubble. I want a modern defensive CD on a shorter CD that actually works, like blur, evasion, die by the sword, enraged regen, astral shift etc…
Bubble is useless even if you can’t dispel it. The only good thing it is good for are offensive plays, but defensively it is too long of a CD. I would gladly give it up for something that is actually useful defensively.
On Retribution = Divine Protection (20% damage resistance for 8s with a 1.4 min cooldown)
On Protection = Ardent Defender (up to 30% damage resistance for 8s with a 1.4 min cooldown)
On Holy = Divine Protection (20% damage resistance for 8s with a 42s cooldown)
…This has been the case for well over a decade? Not sure why you thought something would change with the prepatch.
Other then Monks Karma, what can Rets counter? You know with the mobility we have, a counter to our bubble is just run away or pop their own bubble. Why are others deff CDs non counterable, like say DKs AMS, Rogues cloak, Hunters shell, Warriors reflect, Priests mist or pain supression, Monks green bubble etc etc? Ours is “Divine” yet its devinity is very lacking.
The current cost of still having bubble is, less mobility, less deff CDs and less dmg outside wings. To me that is an anchor more then anything else.
Why does Holy get a better version? Why must Ret choose between Divine Protection and Sheild of Vengeance? Take a look at shamans general tree and see one of their first options are, armor means nothing as most dmg done in this game is not physical so that they have mail is not an excuse.
Priests had to sacrifice a PvP talent for the decreased cast time, which was not worth it for them most of the time. Now they don’t - they can get it baseline from the normal talent tree.
Outside of that, the 1.5 sec cast was kickable in a fair many situations. With 0.5s - good luck.
Tbh didnt know that, was mainly thinking you meant pre-casting whenever they see a paladin go down some distance away.
This is often the case with other classes talents or skills, they often just dont add 1 single thing. Its dodge + dmg red… for a longer duration on a shorter CD, base skill btw.
Same thing with the talent that improves it, it doesnt just add 10% dmg red but something else.
Many of our talents should be combined, like most of the steed talents, most of the consecration talents, imp BoP should be included in Unbreakable spirit, imp judgment should merge with any other Judgment talent oh and the Bubble debuff should be long gone by now, just like its GCD or better yet the talent itself.
Idk man, it saved my life now several times when I played PvP. Seems to work for me.
Because Holy apparently is designed around casting Divine Protection and then spamming the life-sacrifice heal ability to heal your allies. At least that is what a Holy Player told me yesterday in my own Holy Paladin Thread.
Because one reduces damage, the other blocks it and can potentially damage your foes with AoE damage. One is meant for survival, the other for offensive damage tanking.
I don’t play shaman, can’t look at a tree.
Afaik DH have no heal abilities, which Paladins have. They also don’t wear plate armor, which Paladins do, meaning they have less damage reduction in general.
And Rets are designed to die fast… Btw do we see this the other way around? Like Wings having a longer CD for Holy and prot? Ret getting more dmg on their shared abilities? We usualy dont get the better version, its the same or worse. Like prots healing hands earlier expansions healing them for 250% VS our 100%
Not sure why explaining their diffrences is your excuse for not having both at the same time.
Astral shift: 2 min CD (same as our original duration) 40% dmg reduction (double ours) for 8 sec (same as ours)
Ethereal form: (the very next point) 30 sec CD reduction (so 1.5 min VS our 1.4 min… yay a win!!!) PLUS a 4 sec duration increase… again a talent that gives more then one thing.
I typed it out as i dont think you would click the link.
Guess you have never faced a DH either.
And here came the plate excuse, remind me again how many of our attacks do physical dmg? Its 2! Crusader strike and Blade of Justice, rest is Holy dmg, meaning nearly everything we do ignores armor. And basically the same for DHs, DKs and enhancement Shaman. For rogues its much shadow dmg, poison dmg, bleeds etc, so much of their attacks ignores it aswell, think this goes for ferals also? Or are you gonna count AA having a massive impact on pvp other then the procs they provide?
And then theres Warriors, the pure physical class (with some bleeds i think). Arms colossus smash used to make their attacks ignore armor, currently it increases their dmg with 30% for 10 sec on that target, 45 sec CD. Has talents to further improve it.
Fury weilds 2x two handers… armor means nothing and hasent for a long time.
I did several times. I just accept that Paladins can’t do everything like it is supposed to work on a class. We have limits. I deal with the limits. Nothing more, nothing less.
Yes, as same as Holy is meant to spam their health sacrifice, Retribution is meant to die more faster but deal more damage (hence why shield/onehand is not suitable on Retribution and vice versa). Again, that’s how specs work. One excels on one specific task while others don’t. It’s just logical.
One has no psychological pressure while the other has. A simple damage reduction won’t damage the enemy, while the offensive shielding does. It isn’t much damage but still could kill you at the worst timing.
Shamans have less passive damage reduction due to armor, unlike plate classes.
I have several times. I am speaking of actual healing spells that can be used on others too, not just self-heal.
Yeah, because the stat “Versatility” is the main pvp stat. If you want to have a fun time in PvP, crank that stat up. It literally reduces your incoming damage and increases caused damage and healing.
Every class is in their own way damn annoying to play against. That’s what makes PvP in WoW so unenjoyable. It is not fun, but also not really unfair either. Each class has their broken abilities and spells that annoy the opponent the same as our damn godshield does when playing against it.
? What about Fodder to the Flame, Metamorphosis, Soul Rending, Charred Warblades, Collective Anguish, The Hunt, ?
Pretty sure you either don’t play PvP at all or are just trolling with this comment. → Chaotic Imprint, Glimpse, Illidari Knowledge, Aldrachi Design, Demon Muzzle.
DHs are immortal in comparison to a retribution paladin
