kindly enlighten me there, how much higher than SL?
My fears is for one that the higher cap will make people push for higher keys than some can complete the elitism in the game will increase further and people with classes and specs that arent currently meta will have an even harder time in the game which is bad.
My prediction is way more failed runs between 18-20 but on the other hand already at a +18 the rewards will just be 3 off +20 for both end of run and weekly chest. And +18 wonāt actually be that much harder than a current +15 from what I could feel on beta.
Sure they increase the scaling somewhat but we also gained alot of power with talent trees, almost every class has been able to combine in alot of cases two in some cases even three output talents we could recently only have one of. Quite a few Covenant abilities has also been added to our kits.
+15 in DF will be easier than +15 in SL purely based on numbers survival wise its another matter completly feels like DF has more abilities both bosses but especielly trash that punish you hard for failing them. Sure some will be tuned but the feeling is that personal fails will increase in DF.
This just feels like a bootleg attempt to push people into crafting, make boosting less prevalent while heavily impacting less than semi hardcore players in group content.
As an ex darts player myself, i can compare the UK darts scene to WoW, so here goesā¦
Pub league- World content
Super League- lfr
Money league- normal raiding
County - Heroic raiding
Professional - mythic
If you need any explanation of tnese,then happy to inform you
Iām a regional archer 
my darts are bigger than yours
#Dartsizematters movement
The goal here seems to be for high end Mythic+ to be an equivilent of a sorts to a Mythic raid rather than something thatās puggable as it has been since inception.
Personally Iād rather they just make Mythic raids easier but this also works. I guess.
I think itās a positive change. I have only just started getting into m+ and last season I pushed for the KSM mount. This time Iām going for +20 all round. Hopefully I can get the teleports to each dungeon entrance 
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Show off 
gonna let you guess where i was playing on that listā¦
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You do have a point there and I completely agree. I feel like this whole thing where they try to balance the dungeons against each other and offer every single one of them in very finely granulated difficulted levels makes for an unimmersive and strange experience, however if they do wish to balance the dungeons in this way then the amount of keystone levels is perfectly reasonable. 20 difficulty levels for maxed out gear. How many are there in raids? Well - there are 12 official item level designations in Dragonflight, but within each range there are harder and easier encounters. Realistically you could argue that there is the number of bosses times the number of difficulty levels, reallyā¦ so itās somewhere between 12 and 32. 20 is somewhere between 12 and 32. Nicely around the middle actually.
Whatās your point? I never said I was an amazing M+ player, although since you seem so interested for no blasted reason I can reveal to you that this is the first season Iāve gotten all +20ās, however itās definitely been due to a lack of interest and not a lack of ability, because in the meantime I was clearing every single mythic raid tier for 3 years in a row while raid leader and at several points even guild master, but itās all besides the point and frankly I donāt understand your rude tone.
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If that is the case then m12 should be at difficulty level of a m20. No loot overlapping, each key would be noticeably more difficult and it simply makes sense.
6 Iāll higher than in SL
A +15 in SL rewards standard Mythic raid ilvl.
Because you have base mythic and high end mythic bosses
A +20 in DF rewards mid tier mythic raid ilvl.
Now has 3 tiers of bosses. 4 āstarterā rewards less than a +20 vault
2 mid tier rewards the same and 2 end tier rewards +3 ilvl
This is a good change. It will reward the skilled m+ players more instead of making it pointless to do anything higher than an easy +15. The shock for many m+ players will be that not everyone deserves to get the best gear, just like most raiders arenāt capable of killing even 1 mythic raid boss.
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Do you realise you have to to 8 +20 keys every week to stay competitive? Iāve done +20s almost every season, but there is a difference between doing it once and making it a chore.
I support achievement rewards like allowing better gear upgrades for clearing all 20s, but making hard content a chore is worst thing you can do.
Also, still no tier set armor tint for mythic+ players.
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Or just do one and pray for good RNGā¦
In the end it wouldnāt matter if one or 8 because you can still only take 1 item.
Also competitive in what sense? Pvp?
Because it only matters in PvE if youād actually push into content where mythic raid equivalent gear is necessaryā¦
There is competition in pve, yes. Those who have best gear get invited first. Even in content that does not require such gear.
Wanna play at your level and push 15s and do heroic raid? Oh sorry there is this super geared guy in lfg for whatever reason, good luck next time.
Wanna join mythic guild? Please do you 8 keys every weak or get benched.
You donāt need good gear if you donāt do hardest content is the biggest delusion blizzard have.
Also you probably donāt play the game at all if you think doing 1 dungeon per weak is enough to get geared. Being able to choose from 3 or more items is a huge difference.
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No it is the big delusion that players haveā¦
You donāt need to have heroic gear to clear normalā¦
You donāt need mythic gear to clear heroicā¦
Or at least that is how it should be.
Should be, but not the reality for 95% of the playerbase.
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Well when you can invite someone geared and make it easier for you why not to do it?
If your game is focused so much on being hardcore, rewarding only the best and always reminding mediocre players they are not good enough itās only natural you will get toxic elitist meta-minmaxing community.
There is absolutely nothing in the game that promotes being friendly and helping each other.
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So the player base needs to change and not Blizzardā¦
That is all I wanted to clarify
Low keys and normal raids are there for a reasonā¦ To learn about endgame and to get better at itā¦
If the players feel that they need to get the best gear just for progressing normalā¦ Idk what to tell you. That is just wrong.
Itās blizzard responsibility to guide players.
You canāt have friendly community if being friendly to another player makes you wipe for 5 hours or deplete key and leave you with no gear.
Im sorry but you are delusional if you think you can have friendly community in a game catered so much towards elitists and itās somehow players fault.
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