I’d point out the Lizard brain would more likely be the one who wants to collect, rather than being able to reason why you shouldn’t be able to collect something that they don’t have themselves. But then I guess a Lizard wouldn’t be able to see that.
Now, stop trying to turn this discussion to petty insults.
I didn’t watch a single streamer, and the thoughts of old content being reintroduced came to me because something extraordinary happened on Thursday - as you probably know, Blizzard fixed the disgusting drop rates for MOP WB mounts.
One way or another, this means they are correcting mistakes, which is a great approach. I would personally like it if they did that on purpose, rather than fixing mistakes due to fixing mistakes (i.e. giving mop wb mounts a higher drop chance due to th evoker bug), but i’ll take it anyways.
So yeah, now that this mistake is fixed, there are 2 more that could be solved aswell:
Not really. It was just a time sink and nothing else. When it comes to classic, people that experienced it, often mistake timesink for difficulty. I always ask this - if I give you 1 penny every day, will it be difficult for you to get 1 dollar? No. It’s just timeconsuming and worthless.
Naxx as a raid failed due to the complicated attunement, massive pre-requirements (geared tanks for 4H, tons of consumables etc), actually getting 40 people online, and keep in mind the game was really young at the time. In reality, the raid should be normally accessible as all the raids are now, since tons of resources were wasted it, for what? That just a few guilds cleared it. That’s the sole reason it returned in wotlk - due to being a missed opportunity back in vanilla.
Yes I have the same experience as you, and I agree with it. It’s only fair. ZA was tuned for the current TBC systems. With wotlk pre-patch talents, it would be demolished.
I paid around 1.3 million gold 6 months ago for whole T3 shaman set from BMAH. 1.3 million gold is very much easily obtainable now days so if you want T3 its very much achievable and you can get it if you really want it.
What i would suggest, that is kinda off topic, but for “future proofing” your account, maybe start collecting achievements on retail when the patch is current. For example Curve mounts, Elite sets from pvp (getting 1800 rating is easy, specially with new Solo Shuffle), that way in a few expansion you will have plenty of timegated content on your account.
Idk mate, I wouldn’t count on that, nor wish for it. Make new transmogs, yes. Maybe recolored versions or updated models, sure.
Just because new players doesn’t have something, it doesn’t mean value of items should be devalued for other, older players. It’s one of things i love about wow. I stopped raiding mythic, purely because i don’t care about CE anymore, so i go and mostly do content that has the rewards that will eventually be removed.
No and no please.
This is exactly why Blizzard shouldn’t re-introduce Naxx for example and all the rewards that came with it. Back then it was just harder. Let people enjoy their hard earned achievements and gear pieces that were removed. If they got them they were and still are rewarded. If not, well… guess they don’t have them.
Timegated content is healthy, because it keeps people attached to the game and if you stay in game and collect the rewards, well then you are rewarded. If not, check what i suggested in the reply above.
Yes! And I firmly agree with that action. In fact, I think all drop rates need increasing.
But increasing drop rates, is not the same as re-implementing old rewards.
But were those mistakes? No.
The only mistake with removing the Longboi was the fact that it wasn’t replaced with an alternative Mount with access to the Auction House. Now we are left with a group of players with an unfair advantage over people who don’t have the mount.
Blizzard wanted to remove the Longboi, because it was an achievement for those who made 5 million gold during BFA (whether through in-game means or WoWTokens). Fair enough imo, making gold in Shadowlands has been much easier than during BFA.
But, the mistake they made, was not replacing it with one of the 4 different recolours of the Brontosaur that are available in the game files. So those who still wanted a mount, could get it (Note: I can’t drop the link here, but check out Brontosaurs on Warcraft Mounts, unused section.)
As regards to re-introducing old raids. Well they were, Naxx was re-introduced in Wotlk to push the story foward. Like ZA and ZG were as well.
What you have written here supports my argument for why it shouldn’t be re-introduced.
The game was young, yes. But those players who supported the game in its infancy, and worked hard to make it through the content deserve to have those rewards.
If it wasn’t for the original 40 man raiding experience in Vanilla, blizzard wouldn’t have realised that 25 man was much better. The main reason why they reduced the raid size was because it made designing the Boss encounters easier. For the raid leaders, only having to organise 25 people rather than 40 was the bonus.
There was a lot of uproar at the end of Vanilla and at the start of BC, that many players hadn’t finished the raids in Vanilla. Although I wasn’t raiding with them at the time, my guild had only just downed the Twin Emps and were the ranked 3rd guild on the server. which is what led to what was known as the Welfare Gear being introduce (later correctly named the Catch up Mechanics that come with each patch).
But all of that doesn’t mean that the people who went through all of that, to reach the goal of completing Naxx during the very original version of the game. The players who’s dedication and support to the game laid the foundations for the success this game became and why we can still play it today. Why those players can’t keep the prestige of their hard work, just so some Gnome can run through and one shot his way through the instance in Eastern Plaguelands, rather than Dragonblight.
And this is when I realise you didn’t play Vanilla. But it really wasn’t a time sink what so ever… the game as a whole was a time sink. But getting to and completing Naxx required Skill and dedication.
You’ve correctly pointed out the game was young. And so were the players. The reason why Classic was a different experience to Vanilla, is because the players of Classic had 15 or so years more experience in playing WoW, than those who played Vanilla. The player base were simply better at the game. So if it felt like a time sink during Classic, then that’s the reason why.
During Vanilla however, it wasn’t a time sink at all.
Maybe he don’t know
Couldn’t agree less with everything you’re saying. And you failed to understand everything I’ve said. My point was that getting attuned and clearing Naxx wasn’t hard. It was just time-consuming and tedious due to insane requirements. You have an issue of not understanding that time spent does not equal difficult. Classic as a whole, was a time sink, but trivial. Difficult is killing Mythic N’zoth or completing 36 mage towers now, and not spending 2 weeks farming herbs and killing mobs to get the required rep with the Argent dawn.
No. They wanted to remove the longboi, because tons of people unable to reach 5m gold panicked at the end, and bought tokens. I personally know people that did that, and I’m willing to bet there are tons of more people like that that I don’t know of. It was a bad decision, and yes, what you’re saying is true regarding the ah adventage.
Story or no story, both Naxxes and both ZA/ZG could easily live on.
I did. And now after so many years, this is the sole reason why I think like that. I didn’t clear Naxx or even get attuned to it due to IRL reasons, but I stick to my opinions no matter what.
Removing content and making FOMO is always bad.
Yeah raids are harder now than they were 15 years ago, that’s a fact.
That’s a lowkey definition of hard my brother.
Let’s take this a step further and put Zidormi in all the Cataclysm revamped zones so players could play their classic versions as well. I mean we have the technology so why not use it?
I disagree. As told to the other poster above. If I give you 1 penny every day for 100 days, is it gonna be difficult for you to get 1 dollar? I don’t think so. Just very time consuming.
And this is what vanilla was. If you gave everyone the attunement, and everyone the loot (don’t forget that bosses in 40 man groups dropped 3 items on average), people would blaze through the raid. Just compare MC to Naxx for example, which was way more accessible.
Every boss except 4h and maybe instructor was a loot pinata in Naxx. As soon as you stepped in it, and as soon as you had 40 geared people there, it was a guaranteed thing. Just getting there was hard enough.
Also - in classic there were no alternative gearing methods or catchups. As said above, I didn’t raid Naxx, but I damn well remember how it was when someone stole a tank from your guild, as that happened to my friend. A guild stuck on 4H stole a fully T2 geared warrior tank. You know what that meant? Weeks if not months of progress to get a 2nd tank. It’s not like offspecc was a thing back then.
The difference between mythic Jailer and Naxx was that let’s say 900 guilds cleared mythic Jailer, while tens of thousands could see him. And around 900 guilds stepped foot in Naxx and killed KT, and majority of these killed him.
Time Locked Content.
FOMO is a concept of your mind. It doesn’t represent the reality of what the content actually is.
Now in some cases it might be used as FOMO, I’ll give you that. But if you’re falling for FOMO tactics, then that’s on you, and not on anyone else. There is help out there for gambling addictions (p.s. I’m not accusing you personally of this).
I have a big collector friend in the game, and he’s quite happily got his FOMO under control and hasn’t resubbed for the Pre-Patch yet, because he knows that he can collect everything on the last day. If he had FOMO, he would have subbed the moment it went live. Sensible in my opinion.
But do they need to? No, not really.
Instead, Classic Naxx, now represents the Players who invested into it in the original days of the game (I’m not going to repeat myself again, I’m sure you can appreciate 
).
If you want that experience, it’s in Classic at the moment.
Now, I do think Blizz should put some kind of promotion to encourage a new Round of Classic play at some point in the future. A new set of players, I am sure that the right drive could encourage enough to play it.
Although I don’t like the idea. I do think that promoting that “add these removed items to your collection by reliving the classic experience” being a much fairer compromise than allowing our gnome friend (with a dapper moustache) to one shot some old raid because he can’t be bothered to play the game the way it was designed.
As I say, I’ve gone back to pick things up myself for the “just incase it collections gets merged” scenario. But that doesn’t mean I think it should happen. That’s not my decision. I just argue why it shouldn’t. Prepare for the worst, hope for the best.
That would certainly drive an entire new set of players to the Classic realms, and would be a good experience if the current Classic boosting experience was in place (i.e. Boosting ended).
Of all the things that could return to Retail from Classic Naxxramax is the one that feels less interesting. I would prefer more the return of old zones and dungeons, in those there are more differences between Pre-Cataclysm and Post-Cataclysm than between Vanilla Naxramax and WOTLK Naxramax
People care too much for a bad textured gear set from Naxx classic…you can literally get the same ones…just a re-color, yet people have this idea to spend millions of Gold on ugly looking sets from black market, or wanting items that’s “legacy” so badly, the current transmogs and gears…QUEST items in retail is better polished than the classic sets, I swear.
When I see a person with the tier sets on retail, I don’t go “WOW” I go…mkay kewl, you either spent money on blackmarket, or you actually got it back then, if they have the achievements, or other items that’s showing off they are actually a real classic raider, call me impressed.
But if you bought in on black market, I’ll roll my eyes.
thats why people still want them, cant think of a single wotlk naxx recolor that looks better than the ones from OG naxx, and some of them actually still hold up to current standards tbh. I dont personally own any of them, but T3 priest is one that I think looks better than majority of priest sets in this game that I do have.
This should be done for all removed content not only Naxramas.
Whilst I wholeheartedly agree with you on the subject.
I respect that some players enjoy that aesthetic. Tastes differ on that account.
I personally collected a few of the BC sets because they reminded me of when I played BC all those years ago. They are sets that really represent the classes to me. Where as sets from WOD and Legion mean next to nothing, because I didn’t play those expansions.
You know most CE guilds need a few months before getting a mythic kill on final boss? So your penny equation could be the same for retail raid progress.
I still don’t understand what you’re trying to say here, what is it now, is retail harder or classic harder, because from what you are typing you mixed you statements a couple of times brother.
Yeah and who is going to adjust the numbers every single season of an expansion? That’s probably a lot of hard work for totally unnecessary reasons. Rather devs and company focus on future content, rather than fixing old ones.
Again, classic is for that kind of purposes.
I just farm them so I can have 100% Shaman collection under my appearance tab. 
I really wish they would add some kind of achievement like Mountacular for mounts, except its for transmogs achieved. Ehhh one can only dream, but hey we can’t have everything
They really should.
Special sets for collecting a certain amount of sets.
His penny equation is rubbish.
It suggests that each day that passes you get a little more gear. He’s suggesting that eventually you’ll just overpower the challenges.
Whilst there is some truth to that. The reality is, if that were the case then more guild would have completed the raid. But the time was infinite and the guilds never became geared enough to overpower the bosses.
The bosses required Skill to defeat. (and in 1 case, required Ion Hazzakostas to do some mathematics to prove that C’thun was impossible to defeat in its original form).
Whilst in theory, could be correct. He’s failed to take time into account, and he’s also denied the skill required to defeat the bosses. In the reality and practice, he’s just talking complete rubbish.
You’ve argued yourself that Mythic Raids now, are harder than those of Vanilla. But you need to also recognise, that the player base is far more experienced, better at the game, and have far more resources available to them when undertaking these challenges.
Not as long as removed content is re-added for farming purposes and the content doesn’t scales up higher than the expansion it belongs to. No need to tune numbers or adjust mechanics as long as they are soloable at higher levels.