Mastery is the bleed. 
No bleed proc? No damage.
Your levels of desperation is beyond high right now 
Yeah, the bleeds give the buff that allows all the other abilities to deal the damage.
That means, bleed is still the source of all the damage.
The mastery its not changed, its reshaped for the whiners to shutup.
Blizzard guys are geniuses
It is, if you believe that voidform is the source of all SPâs damage. Or battle shout or any other damage boosting buff I guess.
It is the main source of SPâs damage.
Do damage with an SP without entering voidform.
My 476 shadow can do like⌠30k?
Yes but in the recount, it doesnât say âVoidformâ in the damage list, yeah? It shows things like vampiric touch, shadow word: Pain, etc.
I mean thatâs just an observation from my part, but correct me if Iâm wrong.
it is exactly as you said: An Ilusion. In practice, the damage wouldnât be the same without the buff, even if it factually looks like the damage is dealt by the abilities themselves.
I donât care about whether the damage is due to the result of a buff or from the raw damage of those abilities: If they both make my mortal strike hit hard, I am happy all the same.
It is exactly as you said. A different coloured box, but a different colour all the same. It serves the same function, but in a different way.
It doesnt show your bis stats in recount too, that means they are not the reason a dps does good damage?
It doesnt show your azerite traits in recount, that means they are irrelevant?
it doesnt show your intellect/agi/str, that means its irrelevant?
Get real
Yeah, they absolutely are the reason the damage is great. Nobodyâs denying that.
It does afaik if you have the ones that deal something on their own- Like the survival hunter mini bombs, but I digress. But the point is the same, they obviously matter. Nobody said otherwise.
Exact same as above.
This is what I mean! You agree with me. I agree with you.
Mastery is still the main source of our damage, exactly as you said. The damage just looks different now, which is all we wanted. I mean, nobody asked for the removal of our mastery completely, surely?
So you wanted class changes ONLY because 1 ability was 40% of your damage on recount?
By the way, show us your warrior. Dont be shy 
Yes.
Or well, there are other things too, but they are not related to damage.
I thought you said you could see alts with checkpvp? Well, no matter. My warr is Shenshugoki-Argent Dawn.
So you wanted class changes for a 467 warrior you dont play⌠
A major part of the reason I donât play him atm as much as Iâd like to is because I donât like how my damage comes out. I mean, you can see I have no trouble running a +15 if I so want, but thats not the point. I just donât enjoy it as much as Iâd like, so I just donât play the class aside from PVP, like getting the 1800 set. Now I just do random BGâs with my friends every now and then.
But yeah, I am glad the change happened. It might seem like nonsense to you, as I said, that people want change just because the way how the damage comes looks different, even if the end result is the exact same (hopefully), but thatâs literally what the change is about.
But i thought you said you play what you enjoy playing? Not reading its logs lol
You whined about priest that is not goodâŚAccording to you always because warcraftlogs+rio say the opposite.
You whined about a warrior that you raided 3 times withâŚ
Now you understand what i mean with FLR heroes that complain?
There are people that do miracles with this spec right now and you + a few more egoistically try to take them away the right to shine because you dont like details list while you dont play it
Yeah, and it turns out I do not really enjoy playing him atm because the gameplay of arms warrior feels unsatisfying- HenceâŚI donât play him?
Well, thatâs another issue entirely, but as I have said multiple times, I wasnât denying that priests cant do the content you describe- In fact I even said very clearly they outright shine in raids. In m+ however their representation is very low, especially in the puglife and the community perception is very skewed against them. Like, why would you ever take a priest healer, if you could have a pala or a druid or a monk?
And thereâs also the fact that a lot of priests do not genuinely enjoy playing priests in m+, you can read all about it on multiple threads in priest forums.
Thatâs just my observation as a player.
Yeah, because I want to be able to enjoy a class I have played since cata? Nothing wrong with that.
Yeah I have understood your point from the start, but I disagree with it- As have others in this very thread. In fact nobody has agreed with you, but thats besides the point.
I donât think you should just invalidate other peopleâs feelings on their class based on how high their RIO score is or what type of content they do. But if you want to keep on doing that, nobody can stop you.
Never denied it. Good for them.
No, I (and I believe others either), donât. We just ask for a change because we donât like how the spec plays out. Nobody, (I believe) has asked Blizzard to âPlease nerf arms to the ground at the cost of making it fun to playâ. These are not mutually exclusive things, you know. You can make good changes without making a class perform bad.
Case and point, elemental shamans in Legion. Started our feeling awful, got improved and kept being ok throughout the expansion.
We do play the class- And since we are paying customers (like yourself), we can ask for changes, just as you can. Whether they are good or bad changes remains to be seen, but, all the same, we can.
So your problem is its gameplay.
Yet you whined about mastery that helped the spec shine right now
Because people use what they see in MDI, moadmoad is still 5400 rio while several holy priests are over 4k.
The forum whiners you mean?
Im having alot of fun with it.
The LFR heroes?
I wouldnt expect them to.
The other guy thought im not good because my AD is 15. That means i cant do more than AD 15, not that i dont play it because i dislike it. That person could never agree with a thing called reality
But, mastery is a massive part of a classâs gameplay- Especially for arms. So it does matter to me, quite a bit.
I know I could -shine- with the current mastery if I so wanted but if that shining feels awful to me, itâs not really shining to me, is it?
True, never denied that. Doesnât change community perceives them badly.
Well, maybe you do but their problems are not too dissimilar to the mastery change here- Which we got. I hope they also get their wishes.
True, as I have said several times, you play the game completely different to these âLFR heroesâ. They want completely different things from the game you do.
And then Blizzard has to make up their mind which customer do they listen to. Sometimes itâs the LFR folk, sometimes your kind, sometimes others. Itâs compromises all around.
You canât change other people, but you can change yourself. Try putting yourself in their boots once in a while, maybe?
No I think Arcana AFAIK didnât just know how to check you upon RIO but that doesnât matter.
Anyway Iâm going to go to sleep, we can continue discussing more tomorrow but Iâm glad you agreed with the mastery thing, thatâs all I wanted.
Mastery is about outpout not playstyle.
I cant care less for someoneâs opinion when he/she doesnt play the game.
You can read up, its was not that.
Yeah but output is part ofyour playstyle.
If you took fire mage and changed their mastery to, say, make it so that your spells place a stacking dot on the target that deals damage over time to the target instead of what it does now, fireâs gameplay would change from big boom burst crit playstyle to a steady damage flow.
As a guy that has played the class since cata the mastery makes me feel like a feral druid more than a warrior because my damage is so backloaded. If I wanted to play a bleed spec Iâd just pick feral, not warrior.
They play the game and pay the subscription just as you do. They just like different parts of the game.
Thanks, I was unaware of that functionality. Thatâll make looking up information a lot easier.
Now to get to the core of your new argument. Youâre implying that itâs fine for you to take it easy while and only do the bare minimum of whatâs needed while being unwilling to grant the same reasoning to me by pointing out the date I got all M+ on +15. This is you saying that youâre superior to me and by vertue of having made an absolute statement of your superiority someone has to be inferior, namely me.
I doubt you do this intentionally as you undoubtedly see yourself as a good guy, most people do in their own narrative, after all no one sees themselves as the baddie without serious introspection.
However, your actions (which in this case is the way that you argue) is ladden with maliscious elemenents that come from your subconsciousness, which is the way that you deep down really think.
This reminds me of the sarcastical saying, âif someone spends less time in a game than me theyâre a noob and if they spend more time in the game than me they a no-lifer.â
Does it matter that the mastery is a bleed? Arms is exceptionally strong and one of the best performing specs in the game, you can spec for burst or sustained AOE and all builds do good ST and cleave, itâs extremely capable.
Not only that but mastery isnât core to the gearing and youâre not obsessing over it like in other expansions, haste is (or verse in PVP). And haste has the benefit of making the spec faster/smoother to play and giving interaction with cooldowns, it has incredible synergy with anger management that gives the spec a great flow and it becomes very obvious that you start turning into a god at higher gear levels.
And itâs not the first time Arms had a heavy bleed bias, in WOTLK, in Cataclysm, in MOP it was a bleed heavy spec. In WOD they changed mastery to turn it into a MS/Execute spec and it was busted, since nothing other than the mastery abilities scaled at all, and since mastery was the strongest stat that got worse as the expansion went on, they kinda bandaged it in HFC but rend was largely irrelevant other than creating MS procs, the whole spec revolved around execute.
Legion Arms was good eventually, but while BFA Arms is very different itâs still a really functional spec with only one real weakness, self healing.