This is a bold claim
I know several people who play Orc and love orcs especially because Thrall’s led them back to their noble savage, spiritual shamanistic, ancestor honoring/worshiping roots 
Lets say, ther are many who like and want the “Grrr Hulk SMASH!!!” braindead monsters or the cheap Warhammer knockoffs, and there are people who are happy and like and want the orcs as they are portryed in World of Warcraft - and emberassed by the WC 1-2 incarnations
I know this is a troll post, but let’s do this.
I don’t like the Horde too, but…
You won’t take it into consideration because it doesn’t benefit your overall thesis.
Orcs were tricked into madness. Regular orcs, at least most of the clans were just hunters.
The undead are dead. They were resd against their will.
Tauren are nice and chill.
Trolls are the nicest ones who survived and understood their real position in this world.
Goblins are just trade partners, not actually being the real horde.
Blood Elves got destroyed because of the Alliance prince destroying their sunwell. They became like these because of the alliance.
The allied races are just not serious, for both factions.
Being a slave means you do things against your will.
And at the prison, because of having no access to the blood of mannoroth, they became peaceful and nice.
Which again, started because the alliance prince destroyed their sunwell.
The horde was not even fully participating. It was already divided. Even during pandaria, they stood against their corrupt leaders.
He was never the leader of the horde. Blackhand was.
Without knowing that he is being tricked into it. All races can fall victim to legion’s traps.
He was not educated by humans, he was enslaved and was forced to fight for his life as a gladiator. Humans wanted him to die during a fight. They spit on him, humiliated him, and humans behaded Tarreta, a human girl because of good relationship with Thrall.
And the horde stood against him.
Was tricked by a much much much powerful creature.
And the horde stood against her again.
Yes, but in fact, horde is more democratic. The population chooses the leader, and they can throw him away if they don’t want. But the alliance, somehow humans decided they are the kings, and nobody even questions that. The alliance is more autocratic and tyrannical.
Could it be because of your server?
Stats, please.
The only thing I can agree with in this post.
Sorry,im more into 40k then WoW lore so its normal for me to say Ork instead of Orc.
However,there is no point in us bickering at eachother,we wont get anywhere. Thanks for the discussion Molten. Lets just end it here,agree to disagree and all that.
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Blackhand was just a puppet. Gul’dan and the Shadow Council were the true power in the Horde until Orgrim Doomhammer exposed them and killed them.
You can not rewrite WoW history.
You just bury your head in the sand when it comes to Horde atrocities.
It is not bickering you are just arguing Horde and Azeroth History.
Shall we list the Horde atrocities again?
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Do as you like Molten,make sure to blame Ragnaros this time.
If the Horde decided to move to Dreanor instead, then it would take maybe a decade before the Lightborn start massacreing the void elfs,humans start to murder eachother over land or gold,dwarfs start fighting eachother and the Worgen start launching campaigns to massacre whatever is on the other side of the Dreanor portal.
You can deny the true nature of the Alliance as much as you like.
Wont change a damn thing.
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Lets give it a shot, shall we, then see
What you wrote is assumption; the Lightforged killing the Void Elves, humans start a war over land and gold or the Dwarf infighting - the existance of the Horde not really prevent these things happening anyhow
But not many land remained to fight over… or humans for that matter, if the Ligthforged would decide to go on a rampage, they would kill the handfull of Void elves over an hour and no one could prevent it, especially not the Horde’s existence, and the Dwarves pretty much unified, even the Dark Irons play by the rules
But it would expose the Alliance for what is.
The only true peaceful race in the Alliance is the night elves and Gnomes.
The rest would fall for their nature of greed and killing without the Horde to blame,or to be an outlet.
The Dark Iron already shown their true color by being with Ragnaros(the old ones made me due it,sure)
The Lightforged are zealos and willing to butcher anyone that wont follow “their way of life”
Dont know much of the void elves,since they are fairly new to me,so im clueless of their nature and motivation. Might need to level one to figure that out.
Dwarfs are known for infighting,and you better not have a settlememt or fondness of the land when they come digging,because they will kill you.
Humans are like us,so you know their flaws just as well as me.
The Worgen,though understable is just as filled with hatred as any fel ork you find.
Each and one of these can be compared to Horde races of course. So we are the same,Horde just plays the bad guy so certain hero egos and complexities arnt broken.
I guess thats why the Orcs advanced one tree at a time, cuting them down so they don’t have to enter the Forest
Maybe if you would have kept the Highborne mages instead of kicking them over to another continent (well to the sea, the Kaldorei not even knew there was land, it was a death sentance but nicely worded), the moment a greenskin set a foot in the sacred forest BOOM! Arcane SMASH!!!
Like how the Quel’dorei delt with the Trolls
Show them who is boss
Ragnaros the former Firelord was worshipped by some of the Dark Irons but Dark Irons have always forged our own future.
Do not forget that Outland is quite literally the remains of Draenor as the Horde destroyed their own planet. The Scepter of Sargeras is what was used to create unstable portals that blew up their planet.
There was no Alliance that existed then. As the Alliance came to exist BECAUSE of the Horde. Soooooooo where are your Horde apologetics there?
If you are talking about Yrel’s forces. Then it comes down to MEMBERSHIP within the Alliance. The Draenai were not always a member of the Alliance. Those of alternate Draenor was NEVER members of the Alliance despite the assistance brought forward led by Vindicaator Miraad. The Iron Horde menace had to be stopped so it forced the Alliance to take the fight to them.
You also assume that the Draenai led by High Exarch Yrel does NOT have a legitimate reason to wage war against the remnants of the Horde - Iron Horde - Fel Horde. That whole incident about waging war against your people and literally sacrificing their souls to Kaara the Dark Star (void naaru). Yeah just ignore what happened to your kin - parents and ancestors.
The Gilneans and Worgen are long term isolationists. They put up a large wall around their country and have lived independent of the Alliance. It was the Horde invasion - a Gilnean civil war - plague biological weapon that forced the Gilneans to the Alliance.
Assuming you are referring to the pre-emptive attack against the Forsaken in Stormheim during the Legion invasion. Yes the Gilneans are motivated more than anybody to drive the invadors out of their territories. What people won’t fight to get their home back from hostile invaders?
Do you notice that the Gilneans specifically attacked the Forsaken and no other Horde race?
Yes Undead are seen as abominations. Even among the Horde but the Horde turn a blind eye to the Scourge within their midst. EVEN as they turn Horde soldiers into Undead that was murdered by plagues of the Forsaken and not the might of the Alliance. (Plague kill stealing).
Light and Void will always clash. So when that happens the Alliance will deal with its own internal conflicts.
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Burning of Teldrassil and spreading plague through Darkshore turned our hippy tree hugger elves more militirastic. Althought they are more savage than they appear.
The gnomes and Mechagnomes are working together, but are no stranger to conflicts. Troggs and Leper Gnomes is an ongoing bloody war.
Some Dark Irons followed Ragnaros. Many more were too wasted after boozing and partying.
Do not confuse High Exarch Yrel’s forces for Lightforged Draenai led by Turalyon.
It has yet to be confirmed if High Exarch Yrel and her forces are Lightforged or just Regular Draenai.
Do not forget that Auchindoun used to be the burial place, that housed the souls of their dead. Only for the Horde - Iron Horde - Fel Horde to feast on the souls of their dead.
Yrel gave them a choice. They were not purged but they had to make sure that the Horde does not commit further atrocities against the Draenai people. That chose peaceful coexistence with them and done so until the Horde attacked.
Similar to the Alliance. High Exarch Yrel and her forces did not start the conflicts with the Horde but chose to end them. The remnants call themselves Maghar Orcs. The majority peacfully coexist under High Exarch Yrel’s regime.
^^ Blood in the snow scenario demonstrated the unification of the council of three hammers. More specifically the 1 v 2 against the Dark Iron Dwarves by the Bronzebeards and Wildhammers.
Humans were busy humaning until the Horde fed them to the Fel. The sacking of Stormwind by the Horde shows that the Horde are incapable of mercy especially in victory.
Restoration of Gilneas and to have it under Gilnean control once again. VERY different to demon blood drinking Orcs. Once again orK is Warhammer 40K and Warhammer Fantasy.
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Always an excuse for the actions of the Alliance,but you keep cutting all the Horde with the same knife.But the Horde will play its part so you can excuse the murderus tendencies you know you see in the mirror.
Would love an expansion where the Horde and the Alliance just went and did different things,with no interaction what so ever.
It is not an excuse but explanations. Since the defeat of the Iron Horde and Fel Horde alternate Guldan and Archimonde the Alliance left. Maghar Orcs even joke about the Garrisons that were completely abandoned.
The Alliance is not responsible for the actions of High Exarch Yrel those Draenai are not members of the Alliance. The Iron Horde and Fel Horde are no longer a threat to Azeroth. So mission accomplished the Alliance went home.
I agree with the last part. Outside of the war campaign. Zandalar and Kul Tiras had just that. Both factions dealing with individual interests and problems.
Sounds almost like the Wood Elves of Warhammer Fantasy. Fiercely territorial even picking a leaf could be fatal.
It is telling that the Horde Druids done nothing about the deforestation efforts of the Horde.
But I was thinking more of the war of the Saytr. PR campaigns have hidden the savagery of the Night Elves.
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ypu ignore that thralls horde is differant. you ignore that garrosh went crazy and the horde revolted. you ignore that sylvanas was working against the horde instrest since WRATH ended.
you literally refuse to accept that the horde isnt evil and that you could be wrong
he refuses to listen to any opinion but his own
The Horde had its fair share of unforgetable and unorgivable warcrimes under Garrosh and Sylvanas, that is without a question, I think we can all agree in that , like how the Alliance was always the reactor, not the agressor - even tho’ not everyone in the Horde gathered the matches and any flamable for the Teldrassil burning for example, and “just followed orders”, was bound by Blood Oath to obey are always there; those crimes are shared. Many were ashamed, horrified by those crimes in the Horde, but a few decided to act or turned their back the only home and community they knew.
Thrall’s Horde was and is different and now with the Council the Horde is indeed could follow that vision and spirit Thrall, Cairne, and the others dreamed when banded together to survive and live in peace
Denying those crimes unavodiably leads to tragedy, but equally, reminding the Horde on every opportunity, chaining them to their bloody past is just as wrong
Let’s try to be… friends
Or at least acquaintances who won’t kill each other at first sight
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Stop pretending as if it is not the same Horde talking about. You consistently try to shift the goal posts.
General Nazgrim in life was always Horde. Loyal to the Warchief even if it costs his life. Horde civil war does not make either side any more or less Horde than the other.
Warchief is similar to King and earns or commands loyalty.
Ah the Horde are recipients of the evils commited by the Horde.
The blood and souls of Draenai children purchased the Horde’s entry into Azeroth. The few that objected to the sacrifice of draenai children that they would make orphans. Also came through the dark portal.
The Tauren would have lost their war against the Centaur had the Horde not interfered. Dark Spear Trolls as well. Forsaken without the Horde will have already been destroyed. The Kingdom of Lordaeron would have been restored and RETURNED to the living surviving Lordaereons.
Everything that the Horde does comes down to the children sacrifices.
no i really dont
the reason for the war was garrosh betrayed what it means to be horde.
the horde from the past that was defeated with the second war not the current horde which you always ignore
Could say that the capital city of the Alliance is built upon betrayl,decite and the butchering of unpaid stonemasons then…
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but but but that was onyxia. only works one way only one faction is “evil”
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