Is a trap.
I’ve been running Never Surrender for months just because I have been wanting to move power away from my Cooldowns to my passive defenses to make my overall playstyle less dependent on Cooldowns.
The ability that boosts Last Stand is not strong enough for me. Hence, I take Never Surrender. I do not know if it’s a mistake. But what I do know is that the Last Stand ability does not increase my tanking capabilities by all that much.
Second, I have been trying to play Heavy Repercussions. This talent is not viable. The Shield Block bonus does not make a big difference to your passive defenses - even with 20 % base haste (29% haste in combat with 3 stacks from into the fray and usually a lot higher than that from the overwhelming power and other azerite traits that boost haste).
The issue I have found with my Prot Tank is that the lack of rage generation makes Booming Voice a must. Tanking as Prot is really dependent on that talent. Make no mistake.
For this reaons, you cannot pick Vengeance over Booming Voice. For the same reason, even though anger management is a lacklustre talent, you still pick it.
In my opinion, the final tier in Protection only has weak talents. New options should be put there.
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You can’t claim AM as a weak talent. Though Ravager is certainly a joke and HR is simply not good enough having your Avatar/Last Stand almost as regular rotation is priceless.
Then again you claim bolster as a weak talent which is simply wrong. Maybe in mythic + you can get away with it but in raiding I’ll kick any prot without it because I’ll claim he doesn’t understand how to tank the bosses. Let’s put Zul as example:
You are a physical damage tank with high mobility. Ideal to tank the crushers then, you can use Last Stand to block every single melee attack from them for bloody 18 seconds. Not even mentioning the healing and extra stamina, making you able to use SB on demand to block one shot abilities like their cleave. On Zul himself is huge on P2 again blocking every single melee attack while you have your extra HP and focus your rage on IP looking for mitigate as much magical damage as possible. While you rotate the rest of your CDs wisely so you are able to survive 5 stacks.
Same stuff with Fetid if you main tank it, giving you space in Zek’voz to always save a a SB for the combo or making Mythrax a boss in which you have pretty much 100% block uptime not counting adds. Hell and even if you off tank Fetid is still useful for the increased HP during the enrage or the extra healing in a clutch.
Pick bolster God damn it.
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Bolster is nowhere near as strong as Neltharion’s Fury was in Legion. It’s a bad talent. End of story.
It’s easily the strongest talent on that row since it increases your block uptime so much while giving EHP on rematively low cooldown with AM. If you want to play a tank that does not rely on cooldowns, then prot is unfortunately the wrong choice.
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I had to log in and thank you. All excellent advice. ![:+1:](https://d1bg94bbsh66ji.cloudfront.net/en/wow/images/emoji/twitter/+1.png?v=6" ":+1:")
But when you use devastate when you can’t use your other rage generation skills, I do notice it procs quite regularly.
I will check though Devastator on e.g. a dummy, see how that goes. But it doesn’t seem that great a talent choice.
And honestly, with AM, booming voice is usable a lot. I don’t feel like having too much rage generation problems, unless you just waste the rage when using skills when they’re off CD. I always try to have rage/mitigation left for when it’s needed. I’m not a pro tank, but it works for me so far,
Well so the discussion we had about bolster and where we are today after patch compared to before…
So I think bolster before was the solution to give AM spec a way to prolong their block uptime (anger management spec: Booming voice, bolster, anger management, into the fray) .
Your points that it was useful Fetid and Zul, and I believe I have said this already in some post on this forum, was only really true for me at the start of the raid when protection warrior was really weak and my gear was the way it is if you have a capped ilvl when a new raid hits. So only then that trait is useful. Otherwise, later on, I can block fetid and I can take hits on Mythrax (one place where I needed bolster to tank/survive) without it by just having Shield block. So Bolster is not really useful, we already have block on Shield block ability.
Today, I feel the same thing stands. If you’re anger management, you can use Bolster on exceptions, bosses that hit you for so long that you need an extra shield block more or less. It’s like an extra shield block and not powerful enough.
If you are running heavy repercussions, then you absolutely do not need bolster for anything.
As I said, bolster is nowhere as strong as Neltharion’s Fury in legion. It’s a “meh”-talent now and it was before too. Before, it was the only way to go (all other options in Bfa release where just so bad). Now it is a more meh-talent than at that time, because Shield block is buffed and because Anger Management is not the Only spec any more and because Never Surrender can be used to gain some advantage now because Ignore Pain is not unusable by the virtue of being on Global Cooldown. Thank god they removed Ignore Pain from GCD.
By the way, to clarify what I mean when I am saying that Bolster is nowhere near as strong as Neltharion’s Fury was in Legion. Why would I say that? I just want to make an allegory to explain how useless Bolster is most of the time. Neltharion’s fury was not liked by the Protection community very much. However, as I found out after a while in, it had its uses (and you know them too). It could block very strong attacks - not just block, but completely negate their damage more or less. This was its nieche strength and a pretty good one. I used it many times. But we did not need Neltharion’s Fury. We could do without it. Bolster does not have nowhere near that power that Neltharion’s did for blocking out special attacks. Being far behind a not useful talent makes it really bad indeed.
its really good to see my post alive for that long! means PROT WARRIORS ARE ALIVE!! I personally really enjoy prot warrior atm and my favourite part is when charge in many mobs activate my blockcs + dmg buffs and BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM!! Have fun everyone
So who uses never surrender over bolster at the moment?
Every time never surrender
I do, i have no problem with physical damage… But the pain on magic where i see never surender is the most usefuel one over the others.
Is this a meme?
Never surrender is terrible and should never be picked over either of the other talents it might be the worst talent that prot warrior has access too.
reason being is that it scales linearly with missing health meaning you have to be almost dead to get the full 100% extra damage prevention.
if you feel like you need extra survivability against magic the 10% extra health from Indomitable is CONSIDERABLY better.
and want to know whats even better than that for survving magic damage?
Bolster
because it reduces the CD of Last stand by 60 secs.
want to survive a big magic hit? 30% extra health will help with that the fact that bolster turns Last stand into a shield block as well is just the icing on the cake making it an excelent cooldown that can be used against any type of damage.
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Yeah ,the thing is you will use it once at that situation and mostly it wont take you another 45 second till its back. but with never surrend you stack two goodies which are last stand if needed and the boost of never surrend even if it was a 50% boost only against magic. Being able to spam that while keeping the heals will help a lot.
cant see that 10% is worth it ,what it gives …25k or near to that .with 50% of 60k ip i get almost a spamable addition 30k …even if it is on total 50% , 15k spamable which can be increased with versatility and higher pressure . for me is way better than a solid 25k.
its always there with no cd’s. Bolstering is a maybe in occasions but untill now for the magic damage ,i see Never surrender is the best.
ogboyherewego.
why does the warrior community seem to be inhabited by the most rude, abusive and cretinous of players?
does the thought not enter your head that my warlock might be one of several characters that I play at 120?
That I might have been a warrior player since vanilla and have played through every iteration of the class from stacking resistance gear to be able to tank bosses like MC raggy, the hliarity that was arms pvp with stormherald in BC the short lived prot dps spec with Gladator stance in Draenor and many many other memories and experiences.
and dont get me started on your punctuation… christ above.
yea i don’t care and i doubt others care as well.
If you’re encountering lethal magic damage more than once in a minute, you have bigger problems than your choice of talents.
But hey, you do whatever you want, your head is so deep in the sand I’m not gonna repeat myself for the billionth time in this thread why Never surrender and Devastator are trash. Just don’t come here to tell your terrible advise to someone who might be looking for legit advise on how to play this spec when you clearly don’t understand it yourself.
If you want to play prot warrior in something more then normal raids and m+ just for weekly chest you got only one talent set option for prot Itf/x/UF/Bolster/x/BV/AM
you shoud focus on you strong sides and make them even more OP not try to fix weakest points of warr
Prot have two strong sides phisical reduction and op tank dps, wast majority of damage you will take is phisical so you shoud focus to reduce that not some ocasional magic damage, and with new sesonal afix reaping prot AoE potential realy matter
Devastator and HR are weak options because extra rage and deff they provide fell behind BV/AM combo, and DPS they provide is OK on SINGLETARGET but prot power is AOE dps and they do nothing to improve aoe
NS coud be competative option for Bolstering if you woud have 3xBloodspor trait and AM wasn’t a thing but AM is a thing and Bloodsport is not so good trait and shoud be only pick if you are unlucky with azerite ( like i am)
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Maybe i prefer to play my game with all options. i wasn’t talking about Devastator ,but its still good with the right talnets. However it doesnt matter what you see as a bad advise sense you’re an idiot who cant explore new things and play the game like a bot which is being told what to do and never try out by him self. so thick and closed minded.
Somebody comes to you offering a brand new Ferrari or a rusty old Lada that is partly on fire already, do you pick the Lada just because you prefer “exploring new things”? Frankly those people who have written those guides, who sure know a lot more about tanking as a prot warrior than me and you btw, have already done the exploring and come into conclusion what is the optimal talent build to make it as easy as possible for yourself, the healer(s) and everyone else in the group thus enabling you to push further and further into high M+ or harder raids. And they have the numbers to back it up which I’ve already provided in this thread.
That’s cool and all and there’s nothing wrong with that. Just keep it to yourself then. Somebody comes into this thread looking for help on how to seriously improve as a prot warrior, they see your terrible build and go into a dungeon/raid, get their butt slapped and then they’re like “gee, prot warrior sucks”.
Protection warrior talent tree is merely an illusion of choice and we can’t do much to the fact that Blizzard has decided to put talents there that completely outshine the other options in their rows. The only choice we pretty have is between an aoe stun and longer single target stun. Blame Blizzard for that and their lack of willingess of fixing that. Because being able to choose without voluntarily gimping yourself surely would be nice.
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