PTR Spoiler/Discussion Thread (Part 2)

The other side of the map part bothers me. Why have the Titans been sharing inaccurate maps with us? And themselves.

We already learn in Dragonflight that they’ve carefully curated the history of Azeroth in order to prevent the truth of the Black Empire’s achievements from ever being discovered. Perhaps they have intentionally tampered with all of their maps in order to hide the existence of this other side of the world, as well?

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My point is that “Arathi” is the ethnicity, now.

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My inner anthropologist is screaming.

Could you elaborate?

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Arathorian (oh lord) would not encompass them all as a singular ethnic group, similar to how the romans of the roman empire came from the roman people who were not italian people, but groups of italians (and a multitude of other tribes and ethnicities) also made up the populace of the Italian geographical location of the roman empire.

On a more fantasy pseudo anthropological note, if the Arathor empire (the human one that is) migrated and melded with elves over a timespan as short as roughly two and a half thousand years, the elves within that group would not have adequate time to completely eliminate their ethnic roots and practices considering their long lifespans. We still encounter high elves that were alive during banishment of the highborne.

(all of the second paragraph could reasonably be argued away with a multitude of writer shortcuts)

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We´ve already seen elves transforming their culture within a lifespan of a single elf and forming an entirely new identity. It took few centuries to turn Highborne night elves into high elves, and while their name never changed, their culture was transformed tremendously.

And the whole blood elf/high elf distinction happened over the span of few years, and not even a decade after it happened, we had high elves doing a pogrom in Dalaran against blood elves.

I can easily believe that over give or take 2500 years, the high elves who were part of Arathi Empire experienced another big identity shift where they started identifying themselves more with Arathor than Quel´Thalas, and the Arathi identity surpassed the elven identity as a conscious decision.

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I still don’t like the whole Half-Elven schtick

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Even in Ulduar? I’m suspicious!

They’re hitting us with the Sylvanas gambit again - lie to yourself, just in case there’s an omniscient player watching/reading.

The Titans self-censoring all mention of the Shadowlands stuff sucked. You wrote your damn Chronicles, maybe live within the setting confines you made for yourself instead of dreaming up yet another island secluded by a magical barrier that no one, regardless of how powerful or interested they might be, bothered to look into before.

When they reveal Avaloren was protected by a naaru or whatever, and that’s why Aegwynn never found out about it I’m gonna say “that’s stupid”.

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My initial gut reaction is that, if this is the case, then the Titans are villains no matter how the devs attempt to portray them.

You shall not stand alone.

There are more things in Heaven and Earth, Horatio, than are dreamt of in your philosophy
When you sell yourself a god for as long as them, eventually you start to belive the lie
And the among the first rules of any Higher Beeing is “don’t question our Ineffable Plan”
But those aside, if you want to hide something really good that you can’t destroy, you don’t make maps so others could find out
I don’t think the Titans planned life to evolve to the point of space travel - even before the newer lore additions, the Titans were (and possibly inspired by) the Celestials of Marvel; Celestial required the presence of a large population of sapient beings on the world they were seeded into to “hatch” - thats why Galactus acted as an unviersal countermeasure and devoured such worlds; keeping their number low.
Or if you want a darker interpretation, Brethren Moons of the Dead Space - the result of a Convergence Event; a process that takes place when a large enough amount of organic matter becomes infected with the Necromorph pathogen. This process is triggered by the Marker alongside the mass of Necromorphs accumulated by the outbreak
Knowing the Titan’s VERY advanced technology, it is safe to assume they belived/hoped it will hide whatever they wish to remain a secret untill the Titan is born, then it is not an issue.
And if any point of time the Black Empire or a civilization on Azerroth would become a problem, the Forge of Origination could eradicate all life in the world, allowing it to start anew
Frankly Algalon the Observer a bit confirmed this headcanon/theory of mine
“Perhaps it is your imperfection… that which grants you free will… that allows you to persevere against all cosmically calculated odds. You prevail where the Titan’s own perfect creations have failed.”
But the life on Azeroth was lucky dodged that bullet

Not themselves, more like their servants

You give Aegwynn too much credit I think
She was alway proud, to the point believing herself to be a match for Sargeras’ avatar
And that not really ended well for the world - Sargeras would remain cloaked within the darkest recesses of her soul for many long years and she not noticed
On the similar note, I think a Naaru with their potent technology and/or Titanic technology could easly shroud and hide whatever they want from her - especially if Aegwynn didn’t even knew she supposed to look for something that was hidden
Azeroth was littered with magically hidden palces, like Suramar or Pandaria anyhow

Exactly, the elven lifespan and cultural part could easily be explained because WoW’s setting allows for it. It was the “Arathi as an ethnicity” part that wouldn’t work.

That said, it could be elaborated upon further if we ever encounter the empire proper. Why would a half elf be so quick to dismiss their own lineage? Are high elves looked down upon, are mixed breeds something to overcome even in the Arathi Empire? Is it like Fordola from FF14 who desperately wants to identify as an equal of their superiors because it will bring them better equality, or is it a conscious campaign from the ruling class across millenia to strengthen the control over the empire to keep it from fragmenting like it did on the Eastern Kingdoms?

Or maybe this one NPC saying one thing has gotten my wheels spinning more than they should.

If what we’ve seen is anything to go by, actual elves seemingly don’t tolerate half elves very well. E.g Lor’themar’s response to Kalec in the Sunwell manga; “i must do nothing for you! A half-blood’s demands mean nothing.”

With that said, you’d have to assume the elves that banded with the Arathi are probably more tolerant. Besides when was the last time they interacted with an actual high elf? Eh. I’d probably argue isolation from the rest of the elves so their way of life naturally diverged over time. Not that cultures are a static thing anyway.

Continuity exists to enhance the story, AND IT BLOODY SHOULD CONSTRAIN YOU LIKE A STRAIGHTJACKET!!

Anyhow my only hopium is we get an australia expansion with emulisks at this point.

Oh wow, what a :eggplant: .

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What a chad.

Shame thats gonna change in TWW and he will suddenly like Half-Elves alot, actually. :frowning:

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Wasn’t that made non-canon, related tangent?

Don’t know was it? But it would also call into question the canonicity of the Sunwell raid if it was. Considering Anveena and Kalec are there.

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