[PVP] AV Russian Premades in EU cluster

WoW Classic WoW Classic General Discussion
101

Right. It’s a percieved issue. Is it an actual one? What’s the extent of it? Is it only the case that you’ve had 3 or 4 bad games out of however many and have the incorrect impression on how things stand? Who knows. We need data. You’re not providing it.

Like I said: I looked through a lot of forum history and haven’t found what you claimed is there. While I might have missed something I’m going to have to assume it doesn’t exist until someone proves otherwise. Lucky the burden of proof is on the one making a positive claim.

102

Aaand more trolling. So sad.

You seem to “conveniently” forget that there are underlying reasons why you can suspect the Russian matchmaking even after the hotfixes. I’ve never once said in absolutes how frequent it is, or what is and what isn’t. It’s up to each player to judge for themselves.

You looked through threads where I haven’t posted in, since you said you only searched for AV threads:

And since it’s impossible to know what you’ve looked through or not, how about you try searching for the name Bewarê in the Classic forum instead? Will probably help you better.

As for why you’re the only one who can do it in a practical sense, is because there’s too much to repeat just because you’re too lazy to find it yourself. Not to mention the precedent, meaning you’d need to repeat it to each new person acting as ignorant as you, which naturally wears out the one needing to repeat everything, and the problem with too long posts is that the longer a post is, the fewer people seems to read it.

Funny how that works, right? Thought we went over this already when you said you’d look at the history.

103

You can’t simply dismiss any and all criticism by callong it “trolling”. Especially when it’s the same criticism you’ve levied in the past. Or were you trolling then as well?

Yes “premading” is possible no matter how many changes you make as long as the playerbase is small enough. How does that prove anything?

Like I said: the burden of proof is on the one making a possitive claim. I have done what I can on my part and have found nothing. While I accept that it’s possible that I missed something I’m going to have to assume it’s not there until someone proves me otherwise.

104

No, I refuted your criticism with:

Saying you’re trolling is just pointing out the reason why you’re acting like this. Just think of it as a bonus.

105

You’re again making very serious claims about group psychology and your ability to determin what is and isn’t possible.

106

As the famous saying goes: “Anything is possible.”
It’s just that not everything is probable. But probability in itself isn’t definitive. Patterns paints a picture though.

107

You’re still making very serious and completely unsubstantiated claims about group psychology.

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108

Spend 15 minutes a day to learn how to transliterate it, and you should be good to go after a week.
Nekart
Dzhiglipu
Bleklok

Those are no harder to pronounce than the average Latin character names.

You mean like those Spanish, Portugese, French and some of the German players?

I have seen people post here in various Scandinavian languages. Does that mean they can’t post in English if they wanted to? Could it be that in this case he didn’t want non-Russian speakers to immidiately understand his message?
During the time Russians were placed in the same battlegrounds as non-Russians I never encountered any issues with them. The only issue I saw was players from non-Russian servers harassing them.

Are you really saying that there are more Russians joining bg’s to sabotage their own faction than there are on other servers? Because that’s the only reason why someone who can communicate in English would refuse to do so. The amount of afkers, botters and people responding to any communication with “don’t tell me what to do” makes me doubt that. If that was the case they would never be able to camp the cave in the first place.

By the same source you provided that shows that most Russians should be perfectly capable of communicating in a bg?

There is a huge difference in the level of English skill required for business talks and PUG battleground communications.

People are spending half their week doing premades, surely they have time to spend a couple of hours learning a bit of cyrillic if it would help them win a few extra games? But yes, Blizzard should implement automatic transliteration of names. It doesn’t have to be perfect, a very basic transliteration would work just fine for what we need.

Because Blizzard provides support in Cyrillic, and matches players who use Cyrillic and Latin alphabets.

2 Likes
109

strange why you don’t care about 100% Alliance loss on AV. I played on a Russian server, now I play on a European one, and the Alliance loses 100% of its games. Think about it.

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110

Yeah it is really easy.
Nice translation bro!

111

Tbh, aren’t russians doing AB/WSG the same? On my journey from rank 1 to 12 I have never lost a single fight against a russian premade. It is always a free win.
So don’t even try to convince horde pugs to “git gud” in AV lol

112

BUMP! Fix This Issue BLIZZARD.

113

just learn russian for fun :smiley:

114

I can already read cyrillic and learned a bit russian.
The player Bewarê is the one who should learn russian.

115

Is this seriously a thread of horde crying about sometimes losing AV?

116

Is that what you think it looks like? It’s about an exploit being exploited to gain an unintended advantage (i.e. cheating), just like the Alliance in EU and NA before the hotfixes. It’s just that the hotfixes doesn’t actually prevent it properly for already-small matchmaking pools.

Winning or losing isn’t the issue. It’s the matter of a few “bad apples” breaking the rules.

Although they should either be excluded entirely from the matchmaking, or their names should be automatically translated for the rest of EU for the purpose of recognition and communication. Either or.

It costs less to just isolate them entirely though. It also conveniently solves the problem of them being the only ones capable of premading past the limit of 5 people. Win-win.

inb4 someone starts talking about “it’s not an exploit because they’ve never banned anyone for it”, then look at the PTR changes to AV, where they literally call things like jumping on the wall to get around IWB to the entrance and vice versa, and the backdoors to each base, as actual terrain exploits. Yet they don’t ban people for that either.
Blizzard described the AV premading during the time of the hotfixes early this year when they made big changes to the matchmaking as well as increased the premade limit to 5 people, as “unfortunate behavior”. Which is pretty much the same as when Trump said “very fine people on both sides”. Doesn’t require much to read between the lines, when they even had to go out of their way to put in sweeping changes to the matchmaking just to address the problem.

117

Hitting a button at the same time isn’t an exploit and unlike cliff jumping was never labeled as such by Blizzard. Calling sometning “unfortunate behaviour” isn’t even close to calling it an exploit. The fact that Blizzard changed something to work differently than in vanilla because people were complaining doesn’t mean it was an exploit other. They increased black lotus spawn rates because people complained. Does that farming black lotuses was an exploit?

Russian only BGs aren’t an actual solution to this percieved problem as you’d essentially be throwing all Russian players under the bus since their queue times would be ridiculous because they’d suddenly have a much smaller player pool. You also wouldn’t actually solve anything even if this were an issue by making BGs Russian only as you’d just be making it not your problem but the Russian Horde’s problem instead. Thinking that making your problem someone else’s problem is a solution to it seems pretty selfish but maybe that’s just me.

118

Oh look, more obfuscation.

Fun fact: Exploit has an actual definition in game terminology.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Video_game_exploit

If you check the link, you can see it’s vaguely defined to say the least, but the way it goes against the clearly intended game design is clearly there.

Then you have Blizzard’s own definitions, like:

cheats; i.e. methods not expressly authorized by Blizzard, influencing and/or facilitating the gameplay, including exploits of any in-game bugs, and thereby granting you and/or any other user an advantage over other players not using such methods;

Now take that all into account, and look at the actually designed limitation to the amount of people you can “premade” with for AV.
To “game” the matchmaking system is, and always will be, exploiting.

Same as wintrading, that’s just queuing into each other on purpose to let the other win, like in for example arenas in retail for the purpose of rating which would then be earned illegitimately, and so on. That’s also done by matching the timing and the MMR. Yet it’s also an exploit.

Funny how that works, right?

Oh right, and if you want further clarification of intended game design by Blizzard, I’d argue doing two hotfixes close to each other with the expressed intent to prevent the “unfortunate behavior” and how it made such big changes to the matchmaking system that it prevents the premade exploits for the gigantic matchmaking pools, is a pretty crystal clear indicator of what’s intended and what isn’t.

You know, that and of course the actual limit they themselves put in as an option for the queue. Which is 5 now, because of those hotfixes. It was 1 before the hotfixes.

Just fyi, since it seems you don’t know anything about matchmaking systems, is that the number of people queuing in Classic WoW doesn’t actually determine the speed. 100k people queuing at the same time isn’t necessarily faster than 5k people.

What determines the queue times is the amount of people queuing from each faction. When one faction has more in the queue than the other, it leads to longer queues for the side with more people queuing. Get it? The total amount is pretty much irrelevant.

Then there is the hypothetical possibility of internal server queues as well, the servers can throttle the queue to limit the load and so on.

119

Clearly that was not part of the design limitation since it was perfectly possible in actual vanilla. They also implemented the 5 man queue along side the change to the queue system. Why was that put in place if getting into a match with people you knew was against the design limitation? Before if you wanted to play with friends you had to hope you get into the same match if you queue at the same time and now you don’t have to leave it up to chance. And like I said it was never labeled as such by Blizzard. Not then not now. Something being “unfortunate behaviour” doesn’t make it an exploit. Stockpiling resources to sell later could be called “unfortunate behaviour” but they couldn’t be called exploits.

Saying that the size of the pool doesn’t affect queue time is ignorant at best. It’s only true if you’re dealing with very large pools. Once you have few enough players you start getting queues on even the less populous side since you have to wait for enough people to queue for the BG. Also none of this addresses the fact that your proposed solution doesn’t actually solve this “problem”. It just makes it someone else’s problem.

120

Don’t even need to read the rest of your post.

Enjoy. You’re basically calling wintrading fine by saying premading past designed limits is also fine.