False.
Endgame is not limited to what you ‘deem worthy to be called endgame’.
I definitely do several endgame activities.
Of course I care. Getting stronger is cool.
And the fact that it DOES affect YOU, doesn’t mean it’s bad. It might just not be ‘for you’.
Agree to disagree. I’ve loved them for the first part of Legion. Near the end they weren’t really special or exciting anymore. Just something to grind (or ignore if you had them all already).
simple fix:
build your rotation around it and think before you act. doesnt bother me much.
what is exciting about getting the worst possibly legendary and being stuck with it for months because the system was so bad and nothing else would drop? if thats what you find exciting i might have a painted wall you can watch dry.
they shouldnt be putting systems into the game that just force players to have to endlessly grind for no reason, there should be some kind of system like with the corruption vendor and the vendor the ventually added for the legendaries that give us the ability to get the ones that we want, becuase similar to this whole coevenant thing beinging it back to the initial point, player agency is a good things, removing all choice from players is a stupid and terrible idea
You’re only using the worst possible example to paint that system as bad.
Yeahhhhh. No. For most people that’s not what happened.
The reason is to get more power or that cool thing or… etc. And I disagree. They should. I like to always have something worthwhile to do in WoW.
As for your covenant remark; not getting into that with you again. Been there, done that.
how could you possibly know that it wasnt the case for most people, im basing my view of this system on my own opinion and my own experience, and the experience of the vast majority of people that were in my guild at the time.
and not to mention that level of hate on the forums during the time of soo many people being stuck in the exact same situation of just being screwed because they got the wrong thing, or higher end players actively chosing to level multiple of the same class and then just using the one that got the best legendary, they should never put players into a position where they feel something like that is needed, like in shadowlands people are thinking that they might need 4 of the same class just in case.
the key worse there being worthwhile, if there is a deterministic way for you to get what you want then sure thats fine, like some what with the AP knowing you need a specific amount of AP to hit a certain level…
but the fact that you are throwing yourself at any form of loot drop you can for weeks on end with no real reward is not worthwhile, its a huge waste of time and you are getting little to no real reward for it
take the sephuz example from earlier, i spent weeks farming dungeons and emissaries and everything else i could find in legion to get what a legendary i ended up with sephuz as my first, i literally couldnt proc it in raids, so it was a dead legendary, i spent weeks farming to get a dead legendary, and then i spent weeks farming again to get the next one and it was a legendary that gave me a little bit of a healing buff when i used my filler spells, i think it was boots but i forget the name of it, so after 2 months of grinding through dungeons and raids going for legendaries i was stuck as a DPS player without legendaries that gave me DPS, all the while the other people playing the same class/spec as me had the correct legendaries and were managing to just do more damage than me because they got lucky, which is the same problem we have with corruption. but im not getting into that again
While the idea and design of the legendaries was fine, the acquisition was not. They could drop from nearly any type of content cotent including open world rares. This means people who didn’t want to do all of that felt pressured to do it for the chance of getting their favourite legendary. Isn’t this the exact same issue with “if people can, they will” that you are so opposed to?
The acquisition system was generally very flawed in it’s first itteration, so you stating that they were fine as if it was an objective fact is just being dishonest for the sake of having an opposing opinion.
That it doesn’t bother you doesn’t make it fine. It has quite literally made some classes frustrating to play, like protection warrior ignore pain being on the GCD, or just generally pressing DPS cooldowns for 5 seconds before actually doing rotations. Stop raising your opinions as facts.
No, there were legendaries with boring stats sticks and legendaries that changed how you play. E.g. the legendary belt for shadow priest that gave them two charges on mind blast. I’m not explaining why it’s a neccessary legendary, look it up if you want. No, it’s not a question of “optimal”, it’s a question of “playable”.
And I guarantee you and there were monks who got theirs a year after you. YOU got it very early so YOU were very happy with it. You wouldn’t be saying this if you got it as your very last legendary in 7.3.
Mate RNG is fine and expected, but too much is too much. There’s no need to have several layers of RNG where every layer of has it’s own layers of RNG. You might as well have a random class with random abilities every time you log in then.
Reactive defensive abilities like can’t be on GCD. Reactive movement abilities can’t be on GCD. At that point it’s not reative anymore if you have to wait 1.5 seconds to use it. It’s not reactive if you react in your head but aren’t allowed to act for another second. Prot warrior was broken for a long time in BFA because of three of it’s major deffensive abilities, ignore pain, avatar and demo shout were on GCD including both movement abilities, intervene and heroic leap. You couldn’t do anything movement or defense related without having to wait 1.5 seconds in between, becaus haste levels were so low.
And it’s just generally not very fun standing in front of your enemy pressing you DPS cooldowns for 4 seconds before actually using your damaging abilities. I’m not sure if it’s been fixed but early on in the expansion, unholy DKs had to spend something like 15 seconds just setting up their opener before they actually start doing damage. That’s an extreme example, but nearly every single spec got hit by this. To this day nobody knows why the decision to place DPS CDs with 2-3 minute long cooldowns on the GCD in the first place.
for the most part that depends on what you are doing though, i agree with your more so for PvP but as a PvE players the majority of the content basically lets you know what is going to happen before its happening, you should know what mobs are capable of through previous experience, and thus you should know what you need to do and be able to pre-emptively react to it rather than waiting for it to happen and then reacting, like boss mechanics in raid for example they are all on a timer, so you should be ready for it
And you think I am not?
If you do not enjoy the activity itself, maybe, just maybe you should be totally honest with yourself. Are you still enjoying the game? If the answer is ‘not really’ or ‘not enough to go through THIS’, then maye, just maybe, it’s time to move on from WoW. Just a thought.
With great stats. So not dead.
Not what you wanted, sure… but…
It’s fine you think that. I thought it was.
And no, I didn’t immediately get the legendary I really wanted most either. But you know… some people are just more accepting of not always getting your way, as opposed to the kind of ‘spoiled rich kid’ antics that are becoming more and more the norm in gaming today. Ah well.
That goes both ways. That it bothers you doesn’t make it bad.
You don’t do anything that rewards strongest gear possible. In that sense you don’t care. You will never be in a situation that you would be benched from a raid because proper legendary didn’t dropped for you - and that what was happening early Legion.
Not to mention people getting strongest Legendaries first could go out and have fun with big numbers, while those that didn’t get them - could not. One of RNG aspect of the game that was highly criticized.
Your end game better than my endgame?
I tell you something about “for you”. By the end of Legion we had a nice guild, doing HC and few mythic bosses even. Few people didn’t returned for BfA but first tier was ok-ish… but after that we lost like half the raid team. Raiding BoD on HC was super delayed due to that. In EP we had even more problems not to mention Nyalotha. Most people left the game to never return. Some migrated as groups to other games. And none of them is interested in WoW or Shadowlands any more. The game burned away the fun and people left, simple as that.
And we are on Twisting Nether - one of biggest Horde realms. Recruitment during BfA was very low and most people weren’t really heroic raiders.
If the game isn’t fun people don’t play it - simple as that. I played a lot of Legion because it was fun. I played much less BfA because it was unfun/boring. When Nyalotha was coming out I wanted to play Hearthstone Battlegrounds instead of this thing.
So no. We have been given the opportunity to provide much earlier feedback on Shadowlands system than what was for BfA and we will take the opportunity to do so. They can either address them so that so more people have fun or not and just rely on Classic TBC and WoTLK to once again double or quadruple their sub counts.
That’s a workaround, not a fix. It doesn’t bother me much either because the classes I actively play didn’t get hit too hard, but I’ve tried Unholy DK in 8.1 and it was such a slog to play. What bothers me is that it hit a lot of specs pretty hard while it’s a change that wasn’t neede and nobody has ever asked for.
Statistically most people wouldn’t get their favourite leggos early. The legendary pool was too large for that to be the case, not to mention that early on there was a soft cap on how many you could get, so if the first two you got didn’t include your good/fun legendary, you were screwed. I got incredibly lucky on all my characters, but a lot of my friends waited up to year to get theirs. It was just offputting. It’s not a matter of chosing the worst examples. My mage buddy wasn’t happy when I got the two bis, gameplay altering legendaries as the first two on my mage alt while he still didn’t have any of them as a mage main in ToS, two patches in.
really sounds like it
and yet when you are spamming endless forum posts complaining about every little thing you can find in the game, because i have seen you in a hell of a lot of posts over the past year, and someone has made the same suggestion to you… how have you taken that, you have been incredibly offended that someone is putting worse in your mouth and suggesting that you dont enjoy the game.
i very much enjoy the game, i want the game to be the best it can be, i just know that blizzard are shooting themselves in the foot again based on BFA, they were told azerite was bad, they didnt listen, then they made the majority of the changes people were asking for in 8.1 and 8.2, so why wouldnt they listen to the exact same people that are now telling them there is a problem with this.
unholy DK or frost mage get their bracers and gain like 30-40% dps, i get ring that i cant even use the proc from, its basically a dead legendary, consideirng at the start of the expansion they were much lower item level, incrasing the item level by like 30 doesnt make it a worthwhile drop, they had done the secondary stat squish at that point so it was still basically useless compared to most other legendaries, and consider the word legendary, should that mean oh nice i got a minor item level increase, or should it be something that is actually good and worthwhile and actually legendary?
raiding and dungeons within this game are inherantly a competitive activity, wanting your character to be at a good level compared to other people and not to get screwed over by RNG is not being a spoiled rich kid, its just not wanting the devs to design a system that is terrible, its not too much to ask, considering how many people are telling them how much of a problem it will be, they just never listen.
going back to my earlier point again, the fact that people tell them its a bad system and they never listen and then wait a year and realise themselves its a bad system and change it proves that its a bad system and that they were wrong to begin with. they just have a habbit of not listening to people who play at the top end and have a much better understanding of the games mechanics and waiting untill the casual playerbase actually get affected by something.
Again; not true. Just simply not true.
You just keep looking at all of this with blinders on man.
I just told you I cared. So kindly take my word for it.
Indeed I wasn’t. So? Doesn’t mean I don’t care about my character, or her progression or her power level, etc.
Just one word: Jealousy.
Did I say that? No. Stop putting words in my mouth.
Your endgame is simply different from mine. And that’s fine. What’s not fine is you disregarding my endgame as ‘not worthy’ or ‘not really endgame’.
But what IS fun differs for many, many players.
What is YOUR fun, could very well not be MY fun. This thread alone proves that.
As am I.
Spoiled rich kids got lucky to be born into a rich family. Someone who got lucky with their loot early could be compared to that, not someone who just want’s to work for their goal. Legendaries were the equivalent of getting rich by winning a lottery. Sure, winning a lottery is a hell of an exciting situation, but do I really wanna relly on that? I’d rather just work for my success and get there myself.
endgame is degined by the game not the players, the endgame content in wow is rated PvP, mythic+ dungeons and raiding. there are not different types of endgame, there are just some players that take part in the endgame content and others that dont
I don’t care about your end game just stop attacking people that want their end game to be fun. We care about different things yet you can’t accept that. I don’t care that you don’t want mythic only dungeons but why you can’t accept that I care about covenant abilities balance in high M+ or raids? If you aren’t affected by it why are you so vocal against such feedback?
Fun, character progression, big power spikes.
Yeah! I fondly remember guild chat in those days. If someone got a legendary, it was linked in the chat and everybody was happy and congratulated the lucky person. It was cool. We were happy for each other instead of jealous.
i tried saying that about 16 hours ago and it still hasnt gotten through to her, i would give up now if i were you
its kind of difficult to get happy for someone who has just gotten a legendary that is a waste of a slot though, considering that the stats on sephuz’s secret were not even that good for balance at the time, the low amount of haste was okay, but crit was kinda useless and i needed mastery, so it might not have even been that big of an upgrade based on the stats. considering rings lost main stat in legion
Hold up, that’s as true as truth goes. You’ve demonstrated multiple times that you hate the very idea of high end content. You literally told us that you don’t even do dungeons and raids whatsoever. You, for a fact, don’t do anything that rewards the strongest gear possible.
I don’t think this comes down to jealousy. It’s comes down do being disappointed in a game system that allowed a situation you don’t get to do what someone else does because the two of you got vastly different results from doing the same thing the same way.
If everyone has every covenant, then we might as well not have covenants at all.
The idea of having covenants with different dps abilities that will DEFINITELY ruin the balance of the game was a bad thing. They will not be able to balance things out and it’ll drag on for at least 2 major patches before a resemblance of balanced hits the game.
But, the one good thing about it is the fact that we get to see and we get to choose. Taking the choice away isn’t really something good.
Taken out of context. Quote the entire analogy next time.
It’s not about jealousy. Stop assuming things.