Start balancing all specializations the right way for M+ (The 5-10% nerfs are not enough)

Community General Discussion
43

i find those %5 buffs nerfs etc. meaningless

44

They’re very well likely to be, none of the changes here or last week rocked the boat. If your spec was very good before, it still is, if your spec was very bad before, it unfortunately still is.

The only exception might be mistweaver that might’ve had the wind taken out of its sails a little with the cooldown alignment change.

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45

for example i keep seeing ww monks complaining about the playstyle and all blizzard done is giving dmg increase . i can’t say if the playstyle is bad or needs a rework but that’s what majority of ww monk players say

46

Surely that must have been something to do with the fight rather than havoc itself, though. I mained it in late BfA and it truly was brain dead simple.

From what I’ve seen (playing BM hunter in M+), most DHs do less damage than me. You can mash buttons and do enough damage to time the key as long as the other players are more competent/overgeared. If I’m in a group with a good DH, they wipe the floor with me in dps terms. They’re at least 10-15% higher on the meters. The difference between a good and bad DH player is significant, and I feel like that’s something the devs haven’t taken into account with the nerfs. After these nerfs, havoc will still be meta, BM will probably drop out of the top keys altogether.

I honestly don’t know how you’d define feral’s difficulty level. It’s one of the reasons I always find it interesting when people talk about it. It was my main for 3 seasons (and I’ll most likely have gone back to it by the end of this season because I can’t stay away), I played DF alpha/beta and was very much involved in giving feedback and suggestions during the rework, so I know it inside out, and I still couldn’t define its difficulty. There’s a lot going on, but it feels intuitive to me, and not difficult at all, which is why I feel that difficulty and skill cap are such subjective things.

47

From my understanding the ToD playstyle is a current problem in AoE yes, but moreso the ongoing issue is WW has no stat scaling in its base kit, meaning it falls comically behind as expansions go on. WW has had great playstyles in the past and still performed terribly because of this, so the fact it keeps happening through every iteration of the spec wears very thin. It’s kinda the same with shadow having no real AoE unless Blizzard accidentally overtune something. You’d think after nearly a decade of modern WoW design they’d have these things worked out.

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48

The low hanging fruit was simple, is my point. The spec was not overtuned, it was arguably slightly under tuned for the average player, but what could be done with it if you did everything made it really something else. This is also pre corruption vendor. After people started getting optimal corruption builds things changed a lot.

49
  • Have enough haste to get 3 blade dance casts in one demonic window.
  • Only press eyebeam when blade dance is (or is coming off CD)

I don’t remember it being more complex than that.

50

It was the movement / what you could do with it to gain uptime. I guess maybe a better way to describe it is even if your spec doesn’t require a great deal of thought to get you 80% of the way there but that last 20% is like getting blood out of a stone, then if 80% isn’t enough to be competitive then you’re gonna have to at least get some blood out of a stone.

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51

I would like to quickly pop in and note an issue with this - and why they shouldn’t do it.

If you buff every damage dealer to have damage equivalent to the currently best one, and the meta keeps shifting anyway (it will, trust me) then this will inevitably lead to power creep but only on damage as you’re forced to buff one class after another, and then it’ll even go around to the same class again for multiple rounds. This will in turn lead to much higher enemy health and it will break PvP.

In addition, if you apply the same logic on healers, then the health pools of players become too small relative to healing output, and consequently mobs need to do very high damage to compete, and if they do that then health bars will yoyo and healing becomes very stressful.

So let’s not do that. Just nerf the specs that are OP. As frustrating as it might get from time to time, the alternative is much worse.

Should it be desirable that the best spec doesn’t “lose keylevels”, so to say, and that the other specs can do the same key levels the nerfed specs could before as well, then I suggest nerfing the keystone difficulty for the rest of the season instead.

52

Yeah i agree. There’s only a few overtuned specializations right now. Nerfing those would be way easier then buffing all the others.

I really hope blizzars fixes this as soon as possible. Hunters and DH are still dominating by quite a large margin as seen in the logs and as i previously stated the nerfs did not do justice. Blizzard be more agressive with nerfs and tune everything correctly please.

53

Look at destro lock and affliction lol. Two specs of one DPS class are unplayable. Blizzard is trolling or just ignorant, PTR is the place for balancing. Everyone knew which specs are op, btw demo is also should be nerfed for m+

54

Just look then what classes are played on all key levels, on high, low, etc. Raider Io has that statistic. It’s not normal that so many classes are not playable.

55

Literally unplayable :clown_face:

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56

So what? Just if there are some people who have rating in premades, doesn’t mean it’s a playable spec.

57

Whats the definition of an “unplayable spec” then please?

Because if a spec is capable of making it to 3k (ie all keys completed at about 23?) it doesn’t compute that its ‘unplayable’.

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58

Dude, stop strawmaning. Go and toggle the specs played from +20 and up in raider Io mythic leaderboards and you will see that both of those warlocks are the least played specs, yes more less than poor we. (Funny, because those lock specs are better on higher keys than lower). That’s a single indicator of a bad spec right there. Stop arguing for the sake of arguing. Now, gonna ignore you :wink: go troll and harrass someone else or get a life.

Oh and btw, saying that locks should only play demo is ridiculous, just saying as sp is fine because disc is good now. Lol

59

Stop spamming? You’re the one posting post after post on the same thread?

So gotcha, you’re just bad at communicating and by “literally unplayable” you mean “less played than the broken OP one”.

Normally happens when you’re not smart enough to make a point and stomp off in a tantrum. See ya.

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60

LOL
really? :smiley: OK hahaha

61

Look.

Its just not fair to complain as much as in 10.1.7.

I get that Aug evoker is still secretly FOTM, and DH DPS as well.

But its FAR from 10.1.7. There are options, and many. And “unplayable” what does that mean? Cause ANY class is playable. Literally. Its just that Havoc is easier to produce that DPS requirements. Thats all.

Healer wise, its a really good balance going on. Like REALLY good. Tanks too. Only 1 or 2 outliers. All others are Gucci ready to tank anything 1 or 2 keylevels lower than the worlds best of the best. Which is fine IMO.

And they WILL nerf Havoc. Just bit by bit. And Aug will stay where it is because Blizz did not grow the balls to do what must be done.

Thats about it. I get there is imbalance. But where is the drama?

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62

It means “my spek is not FOTM OP and I dont get insta invites and wipe everyone on the recount with 2 buttons”.

Thats what it means.

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