It’s is as some people said not only ridicule but terrible , he needs to go !
You and your team not only inserted yourself in your work you aso devastated two core race to oblivion and keep on draggin/rippin that dead horse banshee arc , time for some new blood !
But the story of Warcraft is a character-driven narrative, and so each significant character that shapes the story gets his or her time in the spotlight.
If Warcraft III was an MMORPG you’d all be complaining that it was Arthas, Arthas, and more Arthas!
What about Garithos?
What about Anasterian?
What about…
There’s always one it revolves around, who shapes the events of the story we play through.
That can be Sylvannas or Thrall, or Arthas or Illidan, or Turalyon or Gul’dan, or Jaina or Gamon.
Warcraft’s approach to story is less like The Fellowship of the Ring and more like The Avengers and origin movies.
Wrath of the Lich King enters the room
Hey, did I miss anything?
Edit: But even then your sentiment is a bit… Eeh? Mostly because it’s discounting the other two campaigns with the Orcs and Elves, and Frozen Throne still featuring Sylvanas’ perspectives in the Undead campaign.
It was merely to point out that Warcraft is a character-driven story, which the Warcraft III campaigns show clearly, because you’re litterally experiencing the story from the main character’s point of view, like Arthas (or Illidan, Thrall, Jaina, Tyrande, etc.).
And WoW has opted for a similar approach to story. The best example is probably Cataclysm which has players venture on a long origin story with Thrall and Aggra, before culminating in Thrall versus Deathwing.
And if anyone’s going to complain about Danuser and presumed self-inserts, I got two words: Thrall. Metzen.
You’re welcome, kthxbye, lovely show.
A fair point, but I don’t think it’s as eyeball-rolling as it is with Nathanos and Sylvanas.
Thrall still had flaws and low points. Sure he was Green Jesus for a while and that was well-deserved memeing (Because of how stupid it was)
Got slapped by Mannoroth and couldn’t save Grommash from death, him essentially getting torn to different elements in Cataclysm, lost his Shaman powers because of the events in Warlords of Draenor (A consequence to his actions, I don’t think Sylvanas has faced any such consequences… Yet.).
So while yes it is a self-insert, it’s still a character that isn’t given complete plot armor and can do everything while doing no wrong.
I honestly wouldn’t know.
I can’t say that I know who Steve Danuser is as a person. He doesn’t strike me as the person who stands on a stage and delivers a speech about values and morals and ideals.
Dude just seems to write stories for video games.
Metzen on the other hand spent a lot of time talking about values and morals and merit, and he infused all his hero-loving-persona into his own characters, like Thrall or Jim Raynor.
I don’t think that was wrong and I don’t see what’s bad about it. I kind of like that the characters in Blizzard’s games reflect those who’ve invented them. I like to think that Anduin reflects some of Christie Golden’s character affinity. And if Sylvannas or Nathanos are reflecting some of Steve Danuser’s ideas and story motivations, then great!
But every character in Warcraft has plot armor, because they are the plot!
Blizzard has a story intention with every character, and then they will fit the events and the gameplay in such a manner that the story can come to fruition.
Sometimes it can feel a bit cheesy or corny or over-the-top, but that’s the narrative freedom that Warcraft has always chosen, trading some of the realism and seriousness for unrealistic but cool events and Hollywood action heroes. Gameplay First and all that.
Other fantasy universes choose differently, but this is bread & butter for Warcraft.
It’s arguably been that way since Metzen thought to himself: “Medivh? Nah, he’s not really dead.”
Warcraft III was a story driven RTS with cinematics unlike Warcraft 2 and 1 where they focussed only in the conflict between Orcs and Humans.
Btw wasn’t that supposed to be BFA ?
A return to origins, Ocs vs Humans ?
I remember Alliance players complaining about Thrall killing Deathwing, because they wanted to be themselves to do it.
He isn’t loved on Alliance side.
Many Horde players complain he left Garrosh in charge of all the Horde problems instead of staying and be the one to face them.
Blizzard made a 5 stellar job wrecking two Horde characters that could had easily cooperated during Cataclysm. For the sake of drama again.
Garrosh makes some valid points here:
Another complain from Horde players is that Thrall is too close to the Alliance.
I don’t think that comes as a surprise since he likes the Alliance.
The problem is: that should not reflect on his character.
https://www.reddit.com/r/wow/comments/7ugi2m/chris_metzen_plays_holy_paladin_on_alliance_side/
He is basically hated by any Horde player that prefers conflict.
Garrosh, Sylvanas loyalists, or players that love other races of the Horde like Trolls or Blood Elves and hate the Alliance.
You don’t need to be a Mad Warmonger who embraces dark powers like Garrosh at the end of MoP or Sylvanas, or someone that betrays the Horde because he has friends on the Alliance side.
At this point as someone who believed in his ideals during vanilla, I would had rather my characters and the entire of the Honorable Horde, Thrall,Baine and Saurfang to had been vanquished by Sylvanas in a last confrontation in Thunder Bluff, like it was suggested in this cinematic:
The Honorable Horde is for me after BFA a terminal patient that isn’t worth saving anymore.
If Blizzard wants to stay true to their Ocs vs Humans conflict let the Alliance players fight the people that are in favor of war on the Horde side and don’t care for moral justifications.
I am sick of being dragged to uselless conflicts for the sake of drama, but i understand people that want permanent conflict.
In the end:
If Thrall needs to be removed so I can get rid of Nathanos so be it
I am sick of Sylvanas.
Cheers.
I have seen at least five interviews with him. To say that he is arrogant is still an understatement. He usually acts like he has the high ground but the moment you question his retcon or make it obvious that the community does not like something, he starts to lament the situation with “humor”.
You can easily tell when he goes into the Nathanos-mode in the video interviews. I dislike him very much for how much power he has over the game’s narrative while being an unsympathetic human being.
But he has his good sides. Doesn’t make his flaws lesser annoying.
Exactly.
I have colleagues that are wonderful persons once you chat with them.
But …
If you are doing their follow up after they’ve worked in the shift before you, than heaven have mercy on you …
Cheers.
the honorable horde was a fluke born from thrall’s naivity towards his own people we already know from wod and the mu that it don’t take cool aid to turn them into a band of mass murdering psychopaths
I’ve seen (heard?) the interview he did with Taliesin, and then the appearances he’s done at Blizzcon and various small journalist interviews here and there.
Strikes me as a nice guy, well-articulated, and good at communicating in general.
I’ve never noticed.
Well he does have a lead role, so it comes with the job.
He doesn’t strike me as an unsympathetic human being though. I mean, he’s just a guy doing his job, not a mass murderer.
i dunno about that he and ion has mass murdered the lore 
Dunno, it works for me. I would certainly argue that as far as lore goes, then that’s something Blizzard have greatly expanded in size and scope over the recent years, much to the benefit of lore-savvy fans.
their “new” lore conflicts with the old lore when all your new lore is basically massive retcons its not good story telling
Fair enough.
What about the following races ?
That was during Warcraft 3.
The Orcs were 1/3 of this army.
Vanilla comes and the Forsaken joined.
You might say this race is more in line with the chaotic Orcs.
TBC comes and the Blood Elves join.
Lor’themar went to the extent of trying to negotiate with Varian, the chance for the Blood Elves to join the Alliance again, during Garrosh reign.
If it wasn’t for Jaina and the purge of Dalaran your character would be on the Alliance side today.
Cataclysm added Goblins.
They are mercenaries, but they are not Warmongers.
Legion comes and the Horde gets:
BFA adds:
So out of all this races an entire faction should be submitted to the will of:
Cheers
I find it quite compelling and more interesting than in earlier expansions and games.
I think Blizzard have become very good at identifying the lore nerds and providing them with story details and fuel interesting lore speculations and theories.
I appreciate that a lot.
I don’t mind the retcons. I don’t notice them and don’t feel the story experience is hurt or jeopardized in any way really. It’s just footnotes for those who are inclined to notice.
i’m saying the new horde as a concept is a fluke because thrall was naive about the nature of the core race that made up the previous horde aka the orcs the concept of the honorable orc simply don’t match reality there are a few expectations but even saurfang is a mass murdering butcher
you can’t go and say a book series is the ultimate lore guide then retcon that lore guide in later issues or interviews its just dishonest
Than probably Blizzard should had the guts to maintain Garrosh Horde if that was their intention.
Not back off and describe Garrosh as the best Warchief ever in alternative universes as it’s been described apparently in the Mag’har Orcs quest scenario.
Cheers.
Omg Sylvie’s end dancing craked me up…