The game is in dire need of a LFG tool for M+

Hey, sure, can answer that. But before I do, two biggies.

Biggie №1

I understand that, despite everything I try, you might just never like LFM+. Which is fine and also kinda the point: you shouldn’t feel the need to! The absolutely best scenario for LFM+ would be when whether you’ve chosen to play it or not came from your personal preferences, and you’ve missed nothing by not doing so. But here, I will take it as given that you aren’t entirely against what LFM+ stands for and just need a little convincing that it can be worth your while.

Biggie №2

Gonna say it: LFM+ shouldn’t be better than M+. If it’s better, it will softly replace M+, and I’m not a fan of that outcome. It should present you with a valid, real choice: you care for feature A that much? Sure, M+ provides it in full, but it also lacks it feature C department. You don’t care much about feature A but always wanted feature B to be here? Go into LFM+, but understand that feature D might not apply there. Features E, F, G, and H are working exactly the same in both modes, though! Even if at some point we’ve arrived at the system-template that is so much better than the current system, we might step back and purposely allow some downsides into the design so one wouldn’t entirely consume the other. Which all means, I won’t be selling you the best thing ever here, I’ll only try to picture it as not a complete and utter disaster.

And I’m going to start doing so the honest way, by first admitting, that yeah, you kinda not the biggest boss there anymore. And LFM+ should probably strive to assure and remind it in full force: you won’t get the perfect group, you won’t get the final say, you won’t get perfect and always reliable partners, you won’t get ideal routes, you won’t get to rule and command your faithful DPS soldiers, and you probably won’t even get enough time to discuss the tactics beforehand. You are out into a whirlwind of ridiculous randomness, so you’d better just buckle up and run with it until you’re dead on the ground or at the end boss’s chest wondering what the absolute duck has just happened and how on earth it actually worked.

Such an approach would require us to grease that entry point up for newish tanks, but you aren’t new, so I’m not gonna linger on the options here.

So, besides what was mentioned, you aren’t losing much. Hear me out.
– You still have all the utility need with the power-ups.
– You still get the partners that are at the skill level more or less close to what dungeon you’re doing: they struggle, they lag, you rock, you pull out.
– You still get the rewards, the slots, the gear.
– You’re still playing your class in your role in that dungeon.

And you’re getting a little extra as well.
– You aren’t worrying about losing your key or your score in a bad run. Keys were left where they belong: in premade “friends and family” setups. You just need to do a bit better than you did before to progress.
– You’re probably getting your satchel of cooperation if there are indeed aren’t many tanks there besides you and me. Extra 1k gold or extra crests might come in handy for all the good work you’ve done.
– If you are pro but aren’t in meta, you still get to play. At some point meta will catch up even with the good tanks on bad classes, and no king rules forever.
– My wish: a commendation system. After each run, everyone votes on who was the VIP. You understand who’ll usually get the most positive votes, right? You or your healer!
– They will probably be more straightforward and easier.

What say you!

I never really encounter alot of toxic people. Maybe its because i dont do high keys 99% of m+ i join get completed whitout any drama.

How you gone punish these people. Lets say i stay in the group but the only thing i would do is wand or icelance. At that point i am doing what im there to do that is dps.
I really think you have no idea how resourcefull people will be to avoid a punishment if its a really big one and force you to disband the group so they can leave.

Well this is part off the game we play some people have tw/bl some dont.
I dont know if drums are still ingame where you can have tw/bl from them.

Nobody will join your LFG m+ if one of the punishments would be that at some point you cant play anymore and blizzard will never ever implement sutch a thing.
If blizzard wanted to punish leavers in a m+ they would already have done that.
Now there is a possibility they will give a punishment for the LFG m+ because they do it in other LFG aswell but it will probably be a 30 min deserter just like it is now and NOBODY will stay in the group if thats the punishment.

You can’t do anything.

For late comers this season is already dead
better way for S2 and changes

blizzard missed the mark with season 1 of TWW
Still can’t think of 1 good reason for changes that happend in S4 with keys and i still can’t fathom what the hell they were talking about during developing s1 when they saw how popular was DF S2,3

Isnt it a redflag if the key holder only timed 7 and show a 10 ? It means he did a 10 previous week and so overtime that it didnt overwrite +7 score ? Yeah lets dodge that bullet. 5 crest for 45 mn minimum 1k repair etc… isnt my thing, I mean at best if you end the dungeon.

Is not like you guys are in my pugs either. So nothing changes :stuck_out_tongue:

Dumber than sitting in the queue and not playing at all? It’s fine. I pugged like 200 dungeons this season. I’ve seen everything and I am ready.

My best runs are with SV and Ret. It’s probably the best 2 classes on pugs you can get right now.

The higher you go the more toxic it becomes. The skill level does not increase as much as people think. I think I can almost claim that people who are against “M+ finder” simply didn’t pug enough this season.

Well, I am not sure tbh. If someone is actively being stupid but not afk, he at least is wasting his time too, I guess? Honestly, I don’t think this will occur more than you think it will. Think of your current runs. Do people do that? Probably not. And why should they? They know what they are joining, it’s not like they are completely unaware what to expect. So now why even wasting your time being stupid instead of actually playing and finishing the dungeon quicker to not waste your time?
People were afraid about this in Solo Shuffle too and while something like that happened, it’s in 99,9% irrelevant, since most games function just fine. Remember, even tho we all wish something perfect, it’s pretty much guaranteed we are not gonna get it. But that doesn’t mean just because something is not perfect, that we should not have it. Pugs are not perfect too… like it’s everything else than that. But we don’t remove it, right?

I played Solo Shuffle and Blitz BG, of course I know and reality shows it’s not that big of a deal as people think while it only happens at the very low ratings which you gonna rush through quite quick anyway. Unless you think PvE player have a much more committed mentality to be garbage human beings? :stuck_out_tongue:

Same and it’s fine by me. But I don’t think this is gonna be much of a problem. If anything some classes might even get CR like Pala to balance it out. Or every lobby will get it. Idk. Honestly that’s barely a problem either way, I think also for most people. If you want to play but barely get to play, this kind of stuff is really not your prio, trust me.

Yes they will. You just need to leave this idea that everyone wants to join and to ruin everything for everyone. Not everyone is a murderer because they have access to knives.
But the punishments will obviously not be just black or white. It’s not like “you can play” or “you are banned” are the only options. Obviously you have several sort of debuffs that are stacking. Be it queue times, less score gain or not even able to join other group content.

Ye something nobody understands, probably. But it’s not like this is the first time this kind of argument. Before Solo Shuffle everyone said “if Blizzard wanted a solo queue, they would have added that long time ago” but now it’s here. And even with Blitz BG.

Ye I mean obviously it’s something better required and while it probably will not be in the game from the start, it still can develop.

And yet on another post you mention how much PuGs suck and how you are stuck playing with bad people.

Got it. You want a computer to guarantee that exact experience every single pug.

It’s better to play with ANYONE than not playing at all.

That is what you say now.

But you will be back here complaining that you cannot time a single key because XYZ reasons. Or that the quews are too long ect…

Because I cannot repeat it enough: If you wait a long time now, you WILL wait a long time with a quew system. Players will not spawn or change behaviour just like that. So nothing will change.

I can guarantee it. And if its not you (out of pure stubbornness to be right) it will be many others.

Longer queues are still better than not playing at all, while not completing anything is no difference than to pugging. Pugs don’t guarantee you to complete anything either.

You ignore the facts that it’s simply technically not gonna work like that. The players are there, which is why you will get queues. The automated system will not sweat about comps like the players will. The result is more people playing.

The result will turn out just like solo shuffle. DPS will have insane queues.

Why would any tank or healer want to end up with something like 3 moonkins with 1 min cd on their interrupts?

Imagine you go into necrotic wake with a prot warrior, a disc/holy priest and 3 moonkins. Have fun.

Literally doesn’t matter. People are not forced to play it and can go back to regular queues if they don’t like it. Nobody is forcing them to use it just like nobody is forced to use Solo Shuffle.

This is not how automated system works. You want it to be worse than the decision making for pugs but the reality is the opposite. You have 0% chance of the system going for this exact composition but you have a chance for pugs to do so.

This is not gonna happen.

That is how it works. You can end up with any comp if they don’t implement restrictions on what kind of comps it can form.

No.

You can’t because the system will not allow stacking specs. It’s not rocket science.

So popular specs will have longer queue times than less popular specs.

Lmao.

It’s not about perfection. Do you understand what most specs right now are not even get to play at all at some point?
As I said earlier already: Longer queues is are better than not playing at all.
This is the reason why Solo Shuffle got introduced in the first place.

I think you don’t quite realize how soul killing it is for the majority of people to sit in queues to play.

Playing spriest, I get invites to keys as a DPS within 5 minutes of queuing to groups.

With this system you would have a lot longer wait times than that as a dps. And people are not going to be happy about it. Especially not if the run fails on the first pull after 40 minutes of sitting in queue.

which is true. but people have the same option as you do - to swap to disc spec and get instant invites.

There is a reason people want comps. Dont forget !

And I insist. Its not like DKs and Aug evokers (meta DDs) are waiting much less than anyone else. And people want buffs like BL and CR and things like that. And if you completely ignore that in an automated system then you WILL have more depletes. By definition,

Long quews are because there are few healers/tanks simple as that. I dont understand why you keep pretending like its not the case.

I swear. Make your key, and choose the first 4 people that show up. And you tell me how that goes. Because that is how an automated quew would work.

Right now, even with the stupidity of making comps, its STILL an effort to try and get good players in your group. And if you succeed with 1 or 2 players, its enough to time the key.

Longer quews are by definition not playing. What kind of nonsense is that ? :smiley:

I am 100% aware of that and you know what’s more soul killing? Sitting in LFG and getting declined by pugs not being able to play. In an automated system you can queue and do whatever you want until the queue. Right now you have to actively try to get your queue, while having no guarantee to join the group.

Good for you. You are not forced to play it. That’s the great thing about it :slight_smile:

About having a choice? Really? I guess you are right. People are probably happy to not get to play at all eventually…

And this never happens in pugs, right?..