"beeing finished " means having reached your goals
that is subjective… there is no nice feeling for me… only a feeling of disappointment, that it could have been even better
besides, only base is not the best possible you can get for heroic…
If I can’t reach my goal before the next content drops, then that means my goal was unrealistic, or I was not good enough…
now it means, I was not lucky enough… this is NOT a good feeling… if you get unlucky
A good example would be me reaching my goal during SoO… back then I did normal raiding (is todays heroic, because mythic didn’t exist back then) I got the best gear possible I could get from normal… I was happy, had a good feeling of reaching a goal I worked for and I started repeating that with my hunter… but I ddin’t reach that goal with my hunter, so it was unrealistic
Well if you don’t want to do additional content to advance your character further than heroic in the game and if you want to get the BIS to do just that raid than even the baseline BIS items which you get from it are good enough for you ( the proc on those items is just additional sugar on the top as people use to say for them ) since as I said the Blizzard is not creating raiding encounters around forging.
One final thing to consider here, look at it this way:
this game is constantly changing and evolving
players set goals for themselves that are not explicit “win states” of the game
different players have different goals
The question is, from a developing point of view, how much should you build around existing player habits? Should you not add features that in your mind are pretty cool and could improve the game because 2 or 5 or 10 or 20% of your playerbase might not be able to pursue specific goals? (goals that your game never incentivized in the first place).
It isn’t about “what is good enough for the content I do” because if it was about that, I would just stop, before I even do the content… It is about a goal I want to reach…
and like I said, something like curve, cutting edge is nice and all, but I only do that once…
having a goal of getting the best stats possible is unrealic now… and there is no middle way in between…
getting gear in one difficulty bracket is one thing, but if it leaves the feeling, that I could get even better stuff from said difficulty, it leaves an unfinished feeling for me… It didn’t feel good in Legion, which is the reason I made a break in BFA in the first place (part of the reason was also, that they got rid of masterloot, which got me another layer of RNG) now I returned, because I was asked by a friend, if I want to join him… because they needed a healer)
Yeah, but like I said… Titanforging, the way it is now, was created, because they wanted players to play longer and repeat the content more often, because Blizzard knows, that for a lot of players, the end goal would be the best gear possible (either for their respective difficulty or overall the best gear) they use that habbit to increase the playtime here…
but for me, there is no reason to replay content, if I can not set realistic goals.
because non reachable goals are not worth pursuing… (At least for me)
so in my case here, the titanforging had a completely opposing effect…
I personally view this differently than you, I like the fact that I can always get something more from the content, even after I cleared it, coz if I would get all I want soon and clear everything why would I continue playing even, coz there would be nothing for me to obtain anymore and to improve my character a bit more in the power. In a situation like that I as well could unsub and return back in a several months to the game when the new tier would be released.
Also the worst thing in mind is actually doing content just because there is an option for TF gear. I just do content because i like it, and otherwise i don’t. TF is not a reason to keep repeating stuff.
what is bad for me too, is, that I am a RPG player… I play games like Final Fantasy, Kingdom Hearts and so on… I never expect to get the best gear from a random chest…
If I wanted more RNG in Gearing, I would probably play more gacha games… (I am playing one (Kingdom Hearts Union X), because it has connections to the maingame lore of Kingdom Hearts)
It leaves a strange feeling for me getting a higher reward than I do content for… (and I don’t like that feeling)
I know… but RNG is not that bad in any of the RPG’s I play… there is a chance of an equipment piece dropping or not, but I rarely see a chance of these equipments suddenly proccing higher than they are…
that just means, I kill a boss a few more times, but I am sure, to get the equipment, which is supposed to drop…
in WoW’s case, I kill a boss, I have a chance of getting the piece, I have a chance of said piece becomming stronger, I have a chance of said piece becoming even stronger and so on, I have a chance of said piece getting a tertiar stat, I have a chance of said piece to get a socket…
Yes, but your dungeonmaster maybe rolled a dice for the amount of gold/rewards gear/stuff you would get, but not for an extra strong piece. That would also very difficult to balance for next stories…
My general point is how to me the current gearing system in the game is fun and I like it tbh. And that is the matter of the taste between different people. But anyway, its not in any shape or form preventing the people to progress in the content in the game and to clear everything they want in the season. I would also add how it additionally might help to some to push things more than they otherwise would in the game, and to a lot of the players it does give a reason to play longer because the people want to work more on their characters with it to improve them further in the power.
Ok but then I ask you, why do you as a casual player need gear?
What are you gonna do with it?
You clearly aren’t interested in doing higher level content, you just like that you’re getting better gear out of nothing.
That is hurting the game in the higher tier of content, all because of people who admit it themselves that they’re never really gonna use the gear that was given to them by the game.
Also getting good wf/tf rng makes you skip difficulties that otherwise you would’ve needed to complete in order to get that gear.
Makes it so that someone who should be doing a mythic +5 are doing +8 and are failing hard at it because they’re in way over their head because they can’t get gear from a +5 because it drops lower ilvl loot than they already have.
So now John gets to raid because he got the trinket sooner than you did and at a much higher ilvl while you get benched because of pure rng.
Makes you feel like crap and how all that effort was for nothing.
Nobody would like having to spend 50 runs to get 1 trinket, it’s a waste of time.
Not everyone is interested in doing really high m+ keys, most people just want to finish the weekly and be done with it until next week.
Well guess what? People are different, you would be surprised that a lot of mythic raiders raid because of the loot, while also a lot of them raid just because of the challenge.
But guess what though, you can’t do mythic without good gear, bosses can be so tightly tuned that even with full mythic gear it can be a struggle to meet a dps/healing check and pretty much every raider agrees that titanforging should go away.
Hardest content should ALWAYS reward the best gear, end of.
There shouldn’t be any other way of getting the same quality gear (other than m+).
Titanforging shouldn’t exist in an RPG game, sadly WoW nowadays barely qualifies as an RPG with all of the systems in it.
Yes this is hurting the game so hard. Literally destroys mythic guilds, high keys pushers because they can now invite a random joe who got lucky with their gear.
Are you out of your mind? Read again what you just did wrote.
Like it or not it is hurting the game.
It makes people care less about gear, when people don’t care about gear they leave the game.
It makes things like Raider,io gain popularity, which a lot of the casual playerbase hate, because you can’t evaluate how good someone is because of the massive ilvl inflation.
That random joe someone is inviting to their group may not be good but still gets invited because of his ilvl which means that group has a bigger chance to fail.
Happens all the time, people with 400+ ilvl doing 5k dps and not knowing basic mechanics, because they haven’t been forced to learn the game but have raid quality gear.
Good established guilds won’t be affected much, it’s everyone outside of a good guild that this is hurting the most, but of course they don’t realise this because of all the gear that they’ve been showered in.
Ok, show me a mythic raider that wants titanforging to stay, 99% of them will say that they would rather have titanforging removed than it staying.
People actually want to be done with their character and titanforging pretty much makes that impossible.
No its not, even in the slightest. What is hurting the game is people like you, driven by jealousy and greed.
People don’t care about gear and they shouldn’t. They should focus on what is fun
Gear doesn’t make you good at game and never did. RIO is providing some way to measure skill.
And for you people who play casually doing 5k is issue. Because you can’t stand casual players. Do you realize how selfish that is?
A word of advice, dont speak for others, you will only embarrass yourself. Your number doesn’t mean a squat. You would have to question tens of thousand people but obviously that didn’t happen.
It is you, people of your thinking that is hurting the game most.
How is it greed?
How is asking for the hardest content to provide the best gear greed?
Working for it and then actually getting it is one of the best feelings in the world.
But they obviously do care since they like having raid quality gear for doing world quests.
People can focus on whatever they want, everyone finds different stuff fun, some people find it fun to have bis gear and maximizing their character, others just like the social aspect of the game.
No but it does mean that there’s a higher chance that you’re a good player, there’s a higher chance to get invited into groups.
In the end you can never guess how good someone is until you see them in action.
Well of course I find people who do 5k an issue, they’re someone who is not pulling their weight in a raid or a dungeon group.
Someone who instead of increasing our chances of killing the boss is actually decreasing that chance.
That’s just gonna end them getting kicked after that pull because nobody wants a liability.
I find no issue with casual players, they’re making the game feel alive.
I find issue with the system that Blizzard implemented so that players have no motivation to get better because they don’t see it being worth their time, so if a casual player wants to start raiding they have this mountain to climb in order to get better instead of the game teaching them those things in the first place.
It is because of those systems that the game is in the state it is right now.
I can’t see how wanting for players to get better is selfish, I guess you mean how elitist I am because I have to have the best gear and look down on noobs that can’t even do 10% of my dps, when the only thing I am advocating for is a progression system that makes sense and isn’t reliant on rng to make you feel good.
Ok so you couldn’t find a mythic raider that likes titanforging then I take it?
Can’t say I’m surprised since there’s not a lot of people like that.
In all of my reading on threads like these I think I’ve only ever seen 1 poster that had that opinion, every other mythic raider said the same as me.
No its not, I couldnt care less about gear, its just a tool, a means to an end. Going to be obsolete in few months anyways. Its killing the boss for the first time after 300 wipes is the best feeling in the world.
RIO does provide some insight before, so you won’t shoot yourself in a foot.
Game is in a really good state right now. Except for class balance which is garbage.
I am on of those. And most people in my guild doesn’t have issue with titanforging.
Before you say something stupid again, look up my old main on RIO. Check the logs, around hellfire citadel.
Titanforging frustrates me because it often invalidates effort I put into the game. I can win a 415 piece from the raid only to later derp through some m10 and get a superforged 420 piece.
I don’t think I deserve a 420 belt from what is relatively easy content. If I wasn’t trying to be competitive, I’d be tempted to d/e the stupid thing out of principle.
Another example would be my 415 tailoring items. I was looking forward to these items as soon and I started working towards them. That payoff would have been ruined if I got better from some warfront.
