You just play tank because you have more HP and because of the Dragon Charge, which in 90% of the cases gets you killed.
There are no premades, just stories on the forums.
Nobody has to be miserable.
But lets not act like premades didnt throw the first punch.
And thing is - you chosen to who you wonna side with.
Anything you say should be considered a new meta of humor Arteus, you cant even do an impression of an adult in a conversation even if your life depended on it.
Whats an insufferable little thing you are.
Your tiny soul probably strapped itself from all sides in order to not to bang itself of the walls of its vessel.
And the fact that you come back claming victim status is the next shocking thing about this whole situation.
Theres one period in Germany.
People are getting sentenced to this day for it.
You really do not belong on a forum, dude.
If McDonalds is looking for a new face- you should apply.
Youāre a total anecdote.You fail to deliver your message, you fail at structuring an argument , hell- you fail to structure a sentence.
Reasons there are, but the Dunning Kruger is stronger.
Start reading, develop thoughts of your own, learn how logical formulas work, nobody cares what a toddler has to say.
People brought the actual problem.
What are you even talking about ?
I dont hate on you for that. I hate on you because you cant form 2 sentences that have a logical flow and dont contradict themselves right after.
Its annoying to know such thoughlessness exists.
Do you understand what Im telling you or we need to use drawings ?
Im dead serious:
Specifically you , you cant bring any new points to the table.
You cannot defend something indefensible.
And you cannot excuse something inexcusable.
Also even if you were of an average intelligence, bringing something to the table of 10 years of discussion, it will hardly be something original or new, espcially on the side of premades.
Kick rocks already.
1 Like
Heās just a normal player who joined sync premades out of frustration over how incompetent unorganized teams play in epic bgs and he speaks from that perspective.
Sync premades arenāt healthy for the game and our goal should be to convince this kind of player to play war games, rated bgs or epic bgs in small groups.
By insulting this type of player personally and talking down to them, you arenāt convincing anyone to change their ways, you only drive them away and they will continue syncing.
7 Likes
exactly that
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I left the premades because of two reasons.
First: I was done with them being incompetent af themselves, playing with 90% leechers or people who cant even bind their buttons, but think they are so good.
Plus the āgreat leadersā like they call themselves were not able to change their ātacticā, even tho everyone saw we lose like this and me saying it to them, seeing that they were only stubborn and arrogant.
Second: ^this was wrong for me!
I got after some time every BG whispers from people who hated me for doing it and it felt at one point awfull af. (Even name changed after I stopped)
The whispers of people who said thanks for the free win or asked if they could play with me/us were definitely not enough to outweigh this, and it helped me to come to my senses.
Thatās what organised pvp is for (RBG), you can change an epic BG with 5 good people. I know I have done it.
Yeah convince the criminal not to steal, ask him nicely and he will stop. Good plan.
These folk are bottom feeders who arenāt willing to take on challenge like the scum bags that used to target lowbies to gank because they would lose to people their own level. Its basically like a noob stomping club. Donāt expect to find people who are doing this in good faith they know when camping a GY and not scoring they are ruining someones night, they donāt care. They are having fun and screw everyone else.
1 Like
There is a lot of truth here, I can attest most of it by first-hand XP.
Now, I donāt necessarily agree with your conclusions. Let me unpack that (yeah, my PvP queues take forever right nowā¦)
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Regarding players not being interested in epic wargames altogether because
- ā¦there are not rewards - That is a matter of individual interest and participating in them for the right reason (earning Gold, Gear, Honor, Conquest etc. NOT being one of them). It should be for fun, learning, applying strategies and tactics (readers of The Art of War will understand), and social reasons. To get enough people you certainly want to motivate the āaverage andiesā in PvP communities, who have only joined to get (fast) wins and farm honor/achievements, but donāt lose the main focus of those events.
- ā¦the āmetaā strategies are boring - I will explain why Ashran used to be the real BIS Epic BG here. Still, in general, you are right: Most epic BGs donāt allow for much strategic variation and playing defensive is indeed the best plan from a situation awareness point of view in a lot of cases, especially if you feel like your team is weaker in direct fights. I think Fistus replied with some good points here. Since it is a wargame, we can adjust goals and rules as we want, to ensure it is not āoh, lets wait 2 hours until their randoms lose interest and attack firstā. I saw that once in AV and decided not to play with/against those communities again. Waiting for 2 hours just to be able to say āha! we won against XYZā is not. But, as said, we can adjust the rules here as we want!
- ā¦one side is much stronger than the other -
- Problem : Players lose interest fast, this happens especially when the premise is community X vs. community Y. If you lose, it is a ādemotivatorā and even destructive for your own community. That is why ādodgingā other communities while doing sync-premades has become a standard for many. The only community I play with doesnāt do that, and that is why I am still with them. BUT, I understand those other leaders. For wargames though, there is a simpleā¦
- Solution : Try to mix communities and factions. Make it less about community X or Y, more about Team A and B in that particular game. If one side loses, tweak the teams, even after the first zerg. As the organiser, you GOTTA pay attention to stuff like this, or those losing players will never play again.
===================
Bonus: I organized such stuff in WoD Ashran with Nepha back then. We got the āknownā Ashran players and leaders, and tried to make even teams (a lot of us played horde and alliance). We came up with strategies like āfeintingā a backdoor attack, but actually turning into a sneaky aerial attack to kill their boss. There are even videos up for those events (timestamp in the URL!):
https://www.youtube.com/live/O6c55GyyPr0?t=7017s
Pretty sure most of you never seen that strategy 
and there were a couple like that. Like Backdooring in general, it can be see as āexploitingā, but if players are aware of those things, it is super fun to have and play such possibilities (leading randoms to do that is almost impossible).
From a Leader point of view (applying strategy/tactics), Ashran (WoD version), was the best kind of large-scale PvP environment ever (assuming no lagsā¦).
Even if the āturtle in your baseā strategy, where you get 30%? more HP and the NPCs, strongly applies here, you canāt let your enemies have the whole battlefield for them, because they can still win Events, farm gadget items/buffs for fights, get AA, get the neutral GY, etc. With all that, they will kill you in your own base for sure (because they can refarm these strong gadgets, and you canāt, if you stay in the base). The multi-goal approach (Events vs. Flags/boss kill) is nice because you can shift as needed, or act like doing the first, but going for the latter. In my 20 years in Warcraft PvP this was the best experience as a wanna-be-tsun-zu ever 
All in all, you see, there ARE legit reasons why some players like queue-sync. The majority is looking for easy honor and stuff, but there are also legit reasons. That feeling of WoD Ashrans was top notch for meā¦
5 Likes
Bring MMR in EBG and maybe things might improve, if anyone is interested in reading my potential solution to tackle this issue, Iād be happy to write an essay about it, this concept Iāve sent it as a feedback via support hoping blizzard would take notes on it, or perhaps incentivise Wargames with better rewards.
This is why I say encourage them to play RBGs and epics in small groups.
RBGs are also played with smaller teams and are not quite the same. The closest thing to premade epic bgs would be war games, but there were few serious attempts to organize them until now. I will talk to a few people in the following weeks and see if I can help to organize something.
In our case, law enforcement and the entire justice system is on vacation and being a vigilante and taking out the criminals (=banning them) on your own is also off the table. You can only reason with them and hope for their cooperation.
But letās be honest here. Your community doesnāt have to dodge anyone because you have quality standards and applicants have to pass a trial to join you while other communities take everyone with a pulse. So your player quality is way higher and not even other organized communities stand a chance. You are the apex predator in this ecosystem and those who are at the top of the food chain have nothing to fear.
Yes, exactly. This is how it should work if you want to organize a sustainable war game community. No allegiance to any leader, just make teams of equal strength and let them fight each other with custom rules to avoid boring matches.
You kinda canāt do that because itās a friendly match and it would quickly turn into: āOK, we both want the rewards from winning 3 war game matches, first we let you win on purpose, then you let us win on purpose until we all have what we wanted.ā
The reward of doing war games would be intrinsic.
The experience of playing in an organized team against another organized team in an epic bg map.
From my experience, if you rely on the other party to cooperate, insults and personal attacks are rarely conducive to achieve that goal. Most people tend to get defensive or aggressive and wonāt listen to you.
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I was playing on the other side with Nepha and we was realy confused (on of my best memorys). But to be fair that was the good old open world ashran with other rules and mechaniks.
The actually version got hard cutted like 1x AA spawnpoint, no Events, no mid GY, weak boss (its a pain in the end of a Seson where 1-2 dps can solo him), no open-world-items and no garnision items (can you remeber the N.U.K.U.L.A.R. ? ), the reduce of items or bugging items (hello arcane prison). Turns ashran in one of the bored BGs.
I remember the fights against you, Zado and the crazy russian with the voice changer we was fihting him for 2 hours with all events up and no one cares, cause we fight them for fun.
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If they have such a big ego, that they at all costs try to prevent admitting or even having a thought about what they do is bad, then sure.
I think they need a wake up call, and sorry but with āhey could you please stopā and āI dont want to be rude to you but what youre doing is bad for everyone elseā brings literally nothing, this you can see over the years.
Ofc there will be people who are narcissistic af and will never care for that, but I still have hope for some of them.
just go merc ull never be vs prems (ally merc as horde) in df merc mode as ally was non existent now nascar is always up if i see prems i switch teams
Yea but then you have the chance to come with them in one BG, means report ā insta leave aswell.
This whole topic is fake news. There is no real evidence of any premades in the battlegrounds. I suggest Blizzard to close this topic immediately.
This is what Iāve been trying to get at.
I never said it was the golden standard, or the solution, but it seems the only other options are either to not enjoy the game or stop playing altogether.
Yes yes Wargames RBGs etc. Hit me up when you have a guild or community that can do with the flex schedule on fluid times, Iād actually love that. I just have a hard time planning anything because life has a big tendency to get in the way.
2 Likes
And im telling him multiple times why he shouldnt be frustrated.
Its a normal bg, not rated, if he thinks hes better than these still learning players, he should move to the next skill appropriate bracket.
Issue is he wants his cake and he wants yours too, type of situation.
And stays here and keeps repeating the same logical fallacies and it just has to be called for it.
Im mostly going on him over this, rather than him premading.
Im not trying to change his ways, im trying to tell him he has too high confidence thinking hes better than his bracket, too entitled to win, and too ignorant of this anty intellectualism his spilling in a forum.
The inconsistency of expecting beginner players to suddenly not be beginner plays though he has been one not too long ago, the moment he pops up in the Bg.
The inconsistency of him thinking ge can allow himself to write arguments like a toddler in a place of thought- a forum.
And the entitlement for both plus the feeling of entitlement for wining and then justyfing it with that same entitlement had to be called out.
What he does is not constructive.
Illogical yapping mixed with childish entitlement can never be that for a logical conversation.
I rahter spare my empathy for someone whos actually a victim.
This guy is not it.
Also:
There is no good reason for premading.
Its simply cheating.
āHonorā doesnt excuse it.
First because āhonorā implies honor and theres no honor in cheating.
Second because these premades are not undergeared, non of them needs honor gear.
You can also get all the gem enchants in a day or two, even without premading.
And last but not least nothing justifies holding an entire bracket a hostage.
Its a weird form of monopoly and the mob is asking me for empathy, LOL!.
You are all being inconsiderate.
If you feel this way towards truth, imagine what your actions do to these new/casual players who have the audacity of quing up in pvp.
Ill say it again since you all seem to not get it:
Normalizing premades will only make the practice become from a mediocre one to massive. Which automatically means you will have elitism in newcommer brackets, something that people dislike about rated PvP from day one.
Premading will become mandatory and with skill level evening out in these massive groups of premades will have to seek advantage in the form of asking for achievements, skill and gear.
Do you really wonna do that?
Be rational for once in your lives, your moment of weakness can ultimately bring only misery.
āboohoi, im 1.5 xp and im so much better than this new player. I should definetely resort to cheating, and ruin this new players experienceā - Arteus.
Is this really someone i should approach with empathy ?
4 Likes
Nice how you complain about elitism and then proceed to rating bash someone in the next paragraph. 
People behaving the way you are drive new players away from PvP too you know.
No1 cares about your empathy, multiple people just pointed out that you are doing yourself and what you are trying to express a disservice by communicating it the way you do.
Even if the leaders of these premades read this, and some clearly do, your attempts to be rude and insult just encourage everyone to do the opposite from what you want.
You turned your own thread into the forum equivalent of a āragewhisperā to a ganker. And the people commenting here arenāt even the ones who āgankedā you.
3 Likes
there are so much reasons:
- people cap flag and donāt defending it or went afk watching youtube
- people take demo/siege/glaives and drive them into death
- people take AA and go hunt PVE mobs or gift them to the opposite
- people do fake calls, spamm quest share or just trolling on chat
- people call for balinda we lose the front+BG
- people call for magetower we lose the front+BG
There are way more stupid things people do that let people start forming groups to reduce the amount of trolls/failers.
And Blizz is fine with it cause you can que as group. The amount of groups syncing together is a problem, yes. But dont blame people forming groups, blame people that turns BGs into a clowns fiesta aka youtube-afk-lobby over the years
edit: im talking about EBGs
4 Likes
This is the worst kind of excuse i can think of. Your so desperate to win you canāt allow anything but what you think should happen. None of these excuses are good, they sound like whiners excuses to me.
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People afk is rare at least in my experience you might have a couple in the epic BGās but rarely in 10/15 man BGās unless your being farmed by a premade.
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People do dumb things with tanksā¦noobs are bad at the game? who would have thought your likely losing your temper over a 12 year old not playing the way you want them toā¦
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People hunt mobsā¦in Ashran and AV that used to be what they were there for.
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People do fake calls? Never seen this, trolling in chat is rare, mostly nobody says anything. Or they call and the person turns around is that a fake call?
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Balinda is fine, 30 seconds to burn down Galv for alliance and we still win without issue. If your a rogue just go straight to the enemy base and ninja cap it and you increase chances of winning massively.
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Mage tower? Eye of the Storm? again a tactic that can work. Works in RBG tooā¦ not sure why you think that would be wrong. Holding 3 bases in better than the flag and 1.