I’m not wrong though… But if you want to continue on the road of delusion, then so be it.
The End.
You are. A count of current and past silences has been made. There were more before.
That’s all. Otherwise you’d be able to make a list of both (which we did), and the list of current silences should have more entires (which it doesn’t).
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Nice positioning, maybe don’t blame the game, just blame yourself, excuses don’t make you better. but self criticism does
In fact, such scenarios can happen, but mainly due to the poor position from you, or your teammates.
im not completely against you, i would like to see a gouge nerf too, but everything else looks fine, i mean, even blind got nerfed, in previous xpacs blind was a safe trinket, otherwise he sapped u after blind, if you want to gut the cc even more, u wont see a rogue anymore, but a Warri in leather suit, at this point every class becomes the same, so yeah think about it
I see the bigger problem in things like dk grip into stun, into silence, if your teammate ignores you, its a trinket, or easy death, but even then, its not a 1v1 game.
in this scenario it feels worse to play healer than in the example you gave when it comes to "having influence as a healer
yeah, give everyone a foam sword + sinister strike, and let the guy win what hits the sinister strike keybind faster.
Ofc they do, let them play on Panda Wow, or on a Wotlk server, and they will Reallize how much more annoying “blanked silence really were”
alone the double blanket silence from Affli lock in mop, into a full cc chain
Cata, MM hunters with double silence, double monkey stun into scatter and trap lmao
or how about faking overpower in Wotlk, otherwise you had a big heal Debuff on you
idk if these players are new here and have discovered access to pvp through solo shuffle, or do not understand what the real problem is besides of “Rogues” which is already a problem since tbc and nothing new
It shouldn’t be possible to get locked down like that no matter what you’re doing.
If you want to stop casts you should HAVE TO INTERRUPT. If you can’t hit an interrupt, you shouldn’t be able to just spam someone with things that stops them from casting. Low skill gameplay AF. It should be use interrupt or you don’t get to stop people from casting. It’s even worse in blitz BGs, if a few DPS on the enemy team have a clue on how to press their stops, you basically can’t play the game.
Playing a class that has to cast is basically like playing tank in OW1 when the enemy team had mei, brigitte & mccree. You don’t get to play the game. They realized it was bad design and got rid of it in OW2 but they still keep the same bad design in WoW for some dumb reason.
No, it’s not fine. It’s low-skill gameplay. You just spam stops at people to stop them from casting. It’s like playing m+ in pugs all over again, people don’t even do proper CC rotations, they just spam everything they have to stop you from casting and then kill someone before you can cast, because there’s way too many things that stops you from casting and basically requires no skill to pull off, just send it on someone and they’re locked down.
Like when I tried rogue out briefly in prepatch - it’s faceroll easy to stop someone from casting. It shouldn’t be possible. People can’t even get away from you because your poisons slow them like mad and you have more mobility than any other class in the game, except maybe warriors.
I think locking something down with things that just stop casts is dumb as hell in both PvE & PvP. If you want to stop casts - INTERRUPT. If you can’t, you should eat the casts.
Or they could give us back the things from the old times. Like now when I fight another rogue when playing rogue, there’s pretty much no skill displays there, it’s just 100% scripted fight. You can’t vanish a blind or kidney shot any longer. If someone uses evasion? lol, just shadowstep and kidney, because that puts you behind them instantly and if they don’t have a bot, they can’t turn before you kidney them. Before shadowsteps you had to actually get behind them by moving there, not just press a button to teleport there to nullify their dodge chance. Or you can just shadowmeld(which really shouldn’t permit stealth actions) → cheap shot to nullify it.
Vanishing deathcoils? Yes, that should be a thing. But Blizzard removed it. THAT was skill. This whole “hurr, I can press my stops whenever someone presses a cast” is not skilled gameplay.
Gouging blinks? Yes, that should be a thing. But blizzard removed it. THAT was also skill.
5-8 kiting a warrior to death because he can’t hit nor charge/intercept you? Yeah, that should be a thing. THAT was skill. But blizzard gave them infinite mobility, so you can’t do that any more.
Breaking a rogue out from stealth to deny them the ability to use their stealth moves? Yeah, that was a thing too. Now if you break a rogue out they’re just like “LOL, SUBTERFUGE STILL LETS ME USE STEALTH MOVES HAHAHAHA”. Dumb as hell. Last game I played before SS was shut off the mage on my team got a frost nova on the rogue, he was right by my side but I didn’t have time to cast anything instant on him before I got sapped, even though he was broken out of stealth.
No, I was a duelist as a holy priest in season 1 of TBC, playing a blessed resilience spec. I was a duelist in season 2 of TBC playing frost mage(me)/rogue in 2v2. Season 3 I didn’t get anywhere because the rogue we were playing with had to go back home to dubai(he was studying in the UK) and his family didn’t let him play WoW there and I couldn’t be bothered finding a new rogue to play with. Season 4 I didn’t bother playing, I was raid logging instead.
I played retri paladin(rogue(the same rogue I played with in TBC)/ret/disc, ret/disc), rogue(rogue/disc, rogue/ret/disc in 3v3) & mage(frost mage/disc and RMP(with the same rogue as in TBC) in 3v3) to 2.1k in wotlk. I played feral(me)/disc to 2.2k, played feral druid/hunter/disc in 3v3 to like 2.1k.
The game was nowhere close to as frustrating to play in PvP back then as it is now. With the exception of sl/sl lock and resto druid in 2v2 as frost mage/rogue in s2, that was basically impossible to win against unless they were [insert explicit here]. Paladin’s blessing of freedom used to remove stuns back in wotlk.
I pretty much stopped PvPing around Legion and only came back to it in DF. I tried it in season 1 of SL but first game was against holy paladin/moonkin that just convoked me when he had immunities and then I didn’t play more PvP for the whole of SL.
One of the biggest issues is melee mobility. They either have too much of it or they have too much range(like retri lmao). You can’t get away from them if they decide to focus you, unless there’s some serious effort to get them off you from your team. Feral is no longer the most mobile melee, it should be the one that should be the hardest to get off you - nothing should rival it because it can shift slows/roots etc. But just about everything but a DK is better at staying on target than feral is, retri has the stupid long range to make sure they can just continue attacking the target even if they get out of melee range.
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Was that “fun” though? Wasting time “faking” casts sounds super-stupid as a game concept. Maybe in some arena eSport wanna-be situations where few teammates can align their silences and as healer one can track enemies CDs on silence, maybe there someone gives a damn, but for PvP gameplay in general “fake-casting” has always been meh
You can’t even fake cast nowadays because almost nobody even use interrupts, they just spam all their stops on you, lmao.
They implemented precognition to allow people to fake cast and then not get interrupted/CCed if people failed to interrupt due to the fake cast. But instead people never interrupt now and just spam their stops at you, so you can’t cast.
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Again something that may make sense in coordinated Arena, but is just a free-buff in most other PvP formats…
Silence/Stuns/Disarm (and any other CC) should all make sense for PvP in general (not only rated, not only arena, not only when you are with teammates in voice).
Silence vs. caster should be what disarm is vs. meeles. Almost always applicable.
h ttps://imgur.com/a/rw00G0K Currently on Cata classic
We can go through it again. I can give you my point of view, you can agree or disagree. But please don’t answer with facts that aren’t true.
“Back then” there was probably twice the amount of cc there is now. On top of that all the cc that remains in the game has half the original duration.
So you are left with a cc that is very short, and most of it is an instant. With healing being very strong, healers having to cast very rarely this creates a problem.
Every class having multiple defensives + cc being very short basicly eliminates the possibility of winning with a cc chain.
This created an ultra garbage Dragonflight gameplay where every comp just PvEs from start to finish. The only goal is to do max damage while reducing enemy dps/healing with a “micro cc”.
So, why would I try interrupting you and risk giving you a a precog if I have 3 other instant ways to stop your cast and no better use for them?
Exmpl: A warrior will stun a lock 90% of the times instead of a pummel to stop a cast simply because there is no reason to stun a healer. You will get 1s shockwave on your next cast simply because there is no better use for it.
CC being essentially useless is the core problem and this is just the outcome. Brainrot pve gameplay. DF arena was no different from m+.
You should have to interrupt to stop casts.
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I had 3 priests I played in shuffle last season, which isn’t coordinated.
2 had no precog and were running 2x BLS instead, 1 had precog.
The one with precog had the lowest rating, at like 1900, but it also didn’t have anywhere close to as much mastery as the others due to lacking gear. The one with the highest was at 2270ish with a mmr of 2450~, I just didn’t play enough games to get to my CR and mmr to equalize. The other was at like 2190ish with a mmr of 2.3k.
Precog pretty much never procced, people just threw their stops at me to stop casts instead of pressing interrupts. Most useless embellishment ever.
Pummel did in fact silence the target. Back then in Cata and right now in Cata classic
what positioning?
if an assa rogue decides to glue himself to you as a priest, then he will
all you can do about it is press fear
which will get trinketed or dispelled
your team can also come and join you for some aoe triple garrotes too, even easier to heal
not every healer can press bash cyclone behind pillar
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And then you go far from you own team which nullifies cleave damage and makes the spec useless, as you cannot kill if you don’t have bleeds and poisons on multiple enemies. You can’t even sustain your energy bar.
The same way you wouldn’t stand open field against casters you can position better against an Assa Rogue training you, or a Warrior, or this or that.
There are better positioning in every situation against every spec always, no matter what people decide to do.
i mean about positioning, that the rogue cant setup his cc chain everytime, i have seen multiple healers, especially at 2.1/2.4 solo shuffle what staying in Melee range, or some healer (which isnt the healers fault) have the Problem that the clueless Dps guys (also a common thing in solo shuffle at low rating) kite the enemy Rogue near by the own healer
have nothing to do with cyclone, infact rdrood is more “mobile” than a priest, and can avoid these kind of scenarios more often, but it doesn’t change the fact that you don’t have to tank every garrote or gouge, when i clone i just spin my mouse in a circle, so he cant gouge me instantly, its still 50/50 but idk atleast u can do something in your own, and like i said, i dont mind to see a nerf when it comes to gouge. it´s a annoying spell to play against, but even then, gouge isnt a new ability.
i mean u have fade aswell, and your pillar, of course it depends on the scenario and you can’t dodge everything, but you don’t have to tank everything either, which is what people like to do on 2.1/2.4 solo shuffle, it’s not a flame either, just that people often exaggerate in the forum
it´s indeed of a Problem, not the Main problem but also a Problem, also some casters have too much to escape a Meele scenario, it´s just a arms race between caster and meele, and this is a problem
some people said its also because of m+, but i have played 20+/24 keys and i can tell you, u dont need so many gapclosers there (maybe tanks) but dps? u just need many interrupts, kicks/micro stuns thats it
so they should take a step back when it comes to mobility when it comes to caster like mage, and meeles like warri, dh etc
well, convoke got nerfed really fast, to a point where it was just “fun” or for some youtube clickbait videos, and convoke, was atleast kickable, i have played against 3x rogue what where frontpage in this time, they just shadowstep shadowstrike me, and i was instantly dead, and if they failed, they had also 3x the mythic wing trinket from the first boss, so they onetapped u, doesnt matter how many cds u use
i dont want to sound toxic, but orginal tbc was how you want the current pvp in retail, close to no blank silences, no stuns, or mby 1 short stun per class
tbc was most likely close to no utility, just auto attack, pressing 1 button every 3-5 seconds, and having close to no stuns but an impactful kick
but its most likely because of short cd on gap Closers, short cd on deff cd´s and the high amount of micro cc´s
like i said, im not against u, i pref giving rogue the old blind back, but remove gouge instead
for me the game was more fun, when cc like sheep/trap/blind last longer, but micro cc´s wasnt a thing, or had close to no impact at all
i mean it still works with shadowmeld, but even this, is not constant, and never was, but felt good when u did it.
yeah toxic talent, it should count mby only for 1 cheap shot instead of 3 and give him more evis or envenom dmg instead
ofc not, especially in solo shuffle, its just a zugzug party, i get what you are saying, but, u also dont (play 1v3) even when some dps in your team are trolling, but still u have team mates what can also prevent the opponent from playing the game
thats the problem with micro cc, why i prefer long cc´s with a longer cd, over short cc with short cd
but u still can avoid some situations when u positioning (which is not easy in an not cordianted environment)
ngl, if a dps chaise the oponent dps behind a pillar, and u have to move into the middle, (what makes u vulnerable to cc and rogues) I would rather let the other one die, maybe then he will learn
i already got tired about, chasing my own “solo shuffle” teammate behind a pillar and getting hoj because he thought it is a good idea to charge a ret pala with wings rdy and no trinket.
im anyway not a fan of shuffle
Lmao no, nothing like it is currently. Some of you have selective memories…
Because it takes skill to actually interrupt someone, knowing when to interrupt, and knowing if they’re gonna fake cast.
Where’s the skill in smashing a button and going hurr durr, you’re now silenced.
Lmao what.
Only if they actually interrupted with it…
People like that seem to think you’re actually able to position yourself when taking heap loads of CC.
I mained healer in S2 and S3. Im not a good player or anything but i do prefer PvP in its current state more than I do WotLK.
Sitting 9 second Sap into 9 second Blind into 9 second Poly etc is fun to me.
Everyone will have there own opinions of course on when they most enjoyed PvP.
For me personally I liked MoP and BFA for arena (I didnt play WoD or Legion).
We actually had a stun from polymorph. Impact stun. Blanket silence from counterspell. Instant polymorph and ring with presence of mind and deep freeze. Oh and frostjaw silence.
Feels bad man. Used to have so much cc now I’ve got to pick between dragons breath and supernova. Or spend a hero talent on supernova to make it worse.
Used to? Lmao. Frost has insane amounts, and you want more?
Yea man. Mages are gutted. We lost so much cc and utility. Used to nova blanket silence into deep into poly for eight seconds. And if they’d kick you could freecast ring and still get it in time. Can’t do that anymore. People can actually stop our cc now. Only class without a proper stun.
They used to have MORE that’s what you fail to understand. REGARDLESS of how much is available right now, there used to be EVEN MORE. You can count to verify.
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