I agree with this though for other reasons. Allowing the use of crowd control in restricted RP-PvP would also for more strategy, be it for example that a Rogue squad is sent into the backlines to stun and blind the enemy healers while the frontline charges in and sets up a flank. At the same time other people get to shine in defending them as their chars would, e.g. a elemental shaman knocking them back. I feel it would add some depth to restricted beyond the alt-tab fiesta it is now.
This is WoW, I think it is perfectly reasonable for a squad of death knights to grip the footmen out of their little perfect shield wall, which is only mildly effective in a high fantasy setting such as WoW anyway.
Completely agree with both. I think the concern is people getting ‘chain-stunned’, but that can be cracked down on the same way as people coordinating over Ventrilo to burstfire people with six rays of frost at once.
I do have a bugbear against RPPVP healing, though, so take this with a pinch of salt I guess.
I don’t know bros but while roots/slows are pretty ok I feel spamming knockbacks/stuns in a fight where there’s an average of 80 people kinda gets old really fast.
One of the best RP experiences I had for a long while was during the Soggoth campaign last year when we were RP-pvping with the Alliance and it was very common for my Grimtotem tauren to mind control the alliance to their deaths, one by one- By pulling them from their lines and surrounding them with the rest of the horde.
I often very quickly /s’d during the MC that “Yes…Come here…” or something like “Your will is no longer your own…”
To which, 1 paladin replied, a few seconds until the MC broke:
“I obey!”
Whoever you were, human paladin number x, you made me smile.
Yup, I’m just repeating what the people who run these things have told me when I query why we’re not allowed to punch their healers in the teeth to stop them casting.
Idk if anyone’s ever actually trialed an RPPVP campaign where CC’s allowed - might be worth running a proof of concept skirmish sometime.
Yeah - that is cool as well. As Vonasha said, it only is a problem when you’re chain-CCd. But even chain CC isn’t that big of a problem when you have other healers backing you up.
However, when you are alone, I feel like at least in restricted RP-PvP, it’s polite not to hit the only healer (or walk through the defending army to the healer and expect to not be bursted down - imo that should be instant kill…), as that is the only way the fights last longer. Of course, if the point of the fights is to find who wins, do it - but expect the same in return.
I find it hilarious people from one side complain about other side bursting or doing voice comm synced attacks with bursty abilities, when their side is doing the same if not worse.
It’s been allowed in unrestricted, and I’m quite sure I’ve also seen something in restricted, just with a cooldown thingy - eg I could Typhoon every 30 sec or roughly so.
That’s true, actually - I’ve not been in a campaign where CC’s been unlocked, the leaders tend to spring for stuff like unrestricted healing first, followed by letting one class do big damage.
Most campaigns have unrestricted healing, though. Which is why they’re mostly perpetual slugging machines. It’s only recently that I’ve seen this “start restricted but buy unrestricted” thing spring up.
With conditions functionally disallowing total party wipes, battles would do well to be more about objectives, such as holding multiple points at a time or undoing entrenched positions.
Facing the Horde on an open field(!) doesn’t lead anywhere but mutually assured exhaustion.
I find it hilarious people from one side complain about other side bursting or doing voice comm synced attacks with bursty abilities, when their side is doing the same if not worse.
Both sides have bad apples who is guilty of this, not much to really do about it except asking people to not do it. And if they must focus someone at least make the calls IC through roleplay instead.
It’s been allowed in unrestricted, and I’m quite sure I’ve also seen something in restricted, just with a cooldown thingy - eg I could Typhoon every 30 sec or roughly so.
Something i could see work. Though it also brings into question, what would be allowed? AOE CC? Knock backs? Mind controlling someone to their deaths? Would this mean we should also allow interrupts?
Most campaigns have unrestricted healing, though. Which is why they’re mostly perpetual slugging machines. It’s only recently that I’ve seen this “start restricted but buy unrestricted” thing spring up.
Its a weird concept to say the least. Now that i have tried it myself all i can say is “just don’t”. It adds a level of complexity that should not be there and just makes you ask “Are the enemy faction allowed to do this today or not?” and everyone needs to be made aware what is allowed on day x and what is not allowed then. Instead of having a consistant set of rules on what is allowed and what is not.
Lets be honest here, the only rules you need in restricted are the 5 second rule and the no synced attacks rule. You’re not gonna die to one chaos bolt or a stun if your healers aren’t absolute mongoloids.
Lets be honest here, the only rules you need in restricted are the 5 second rule and the no synced attacks rule. You’re not gonna die to one chaos bolt or a stun if your healers aren’t absolute mongoloids.
Wrong. If your faction is retreating and the other faction stuns you. You die because you wont be getting away. So one stun will absolutely kill you
Within the latest discussions about RP-PvP I’ve looked through I’ve noticed that there’s always a clash of opinions how RP-PvP should be done, with the following points that I’ve seen multiple times:
-restricting the use of specific abilities
-changing or keeping the rules of one ability every 5 seconds
-having or not having a limited time of signups and/or the amount of “randoms” that are allowed in
-how to decide who is the “winner” of a battle, which could be but not limited to rolls, whichever faction is pushed back from the starting position or a predetermined outcome.
Everyone has their own prefered way of RP-PvPing and I won’t point a finger and say their’s is wrong, but I think there’s a problem in joining a campaign and not expecting the way of RP-PvP that would be done upon attending. This is where I think part of drama can come from and it’s similar to other community-hobbies could get their problems from like the “next-in-line rule in an arcade hall” or the “start on your knees in a grappling class”. Without getting what you expected chaos will ensue.
Now I don’t think this is the sole problem to “fix RP-PvP”, personally I don’t see RP-PvP as this broken thing that’s utterly terrible. I honestly think it’s better then Boxing and its multiple orgazinations trying to get a collective set of rules where they can all agree on. (personal grudge, i know)
If I were to host a RP-PvP Campaign myself then I would have predetermined outcomes and focus more on the roleplaying side of it. The only PvP side of it would be that you’re dealing damage (but not killing) the player on the other faction. And if I or someone else does host such a campaign one day I hope the attendees would be well informed about the rules and expectations to be met. Hopefully those attendees would also have fun with it, because if we’re not having fun what’s the point
This aversion to death is also a bit of a potential block in RP PvP.
I’m not talking about character death. I’m talking your Hp is down to 0, therefore you’re out. You’re retrieved from the battlefield and have sustained injury, you can’t rejoin the battle.
Whilst completely unrestricted can impair if we allow this (burst cheese) this whole “it has to be this way to prevent death to enable RP” is jarring.
What is so unrealistic about a character having to be called off from the fight because of injury? It is that hard to interpret your literal HP being reduced to 0 as having sustained injury instead?
With hp bars not moving at all, there’s very little signs that people have to move away, retreat or whatever and again, it largely falls to their good graces. Hence 2 hour battles with no movement. At least allowing character removal via OOC death and making it reasonably likely where someone is overexposed etc would be realistic and add some strategy. It would just require obeying the rules and adding some more maybe (like no sniping targets whom are behind a shield wall for example). Again it’s all down to good faith. It would address how stagnant some battles can feel though where there isn’t a predetermined outcome.
It’s always the rule breakers who ruin this sort of thing. That’s an issue with the rule breakers. Turning the conflict into a huge slogfest of no consequence due to overpowered healing and neutered damage is not the solution in my opinion. It makes it feel less dynamic and essentially turns the conflict into a social event, where players simply begin emote battling NG each other one on one, and don’t necessarily recognise when they’re being flanked by another because they’re too absorbed in their one on one moment.
That’s actually a nice way to explain how it feels sometimes. These huge battles due to said rules turn into a huge congregation of one on one RP spats. This is because the risk of injury is so low and entirely determined by you (and if everyone is enjoying their little rivalry rp In the middle of a battlefield then they are going nowhere)
