Where Are the Strong Male Figures in the Latest Expansion?

Iron swords would be heavier than steel swords. I’ve never checked the weights for an iron sword so you might be right they could be quite heavy, I don’t know. But we’ve been using steel swords thousands of years.

Ultimately though reach is more of a factor than muscle mass with swords, so there’s no real reason to not have bad*** female warriors in fantasy, as I was saying before it was mainly about sanitary reasons, logistics of keeping pace when marching and carrying loads, as well as birth rate impact that kept women from the frontlines throughout most of history. But there were lots of times when women would fight. It’s one of the many things that made the GOT siege of winterfell stupid, you wouldn’t put women and children in a cellar somewhere, they would be carrying extra bundles of arrows to archers, throwing rocks chairs book, vases, anything they could carry and throw from the walls, or weapons is they knew how to use them. An extra body on the line is always better to have.

Yeah, Lothar rubs me the wrong way too. When I saw her I figured she’d be a strong, aggressive zealot of the light, but she turned out to mostly be Anduin’s personal therapist and probably future baby mama. Ironically, I think they didn’t give her enough girl power.

It’s fantasy though.

In the Japanese series Claymore, which ended 10 years ago (so pre woke) all the protagonists (except one) are female monster hybrids who use massive claymore swords.

Some even dual wield, they release their monster energy to get stronger.

What does belief have to do with this? I’m not following your logic here, this isn’t about religion, misconceptions or beliefs.

The earth was considered a globe as early as the 5th century BC, that’s 2500 years ago by the way. This is again about belief in the face of lack of information, it has nothing to do with this topic and no parallels.

It’s still true today in war torn nations, the western world is actually the exception in that we have more equality for women and women can take on these roles. Ok now go to India, China, Russia, not so much. Now go to a war torn country like Afghanistan…

Women are part of the military, this is nothing new, my grandmother served in the women’s airforce in the 2nd world war, but women do not fight on the front lines, this isn’t history, this is today in all nations of the world.

I don’t really know if you thought you were going somewhere with this but I’m not sure where it has any relevance to the topic. But there is nothing unusual about a man working in a bakery, infact the only baker I know is a man. A friends dad ran a bakery, it’s good honest work.

The point is, you folks are against change you don’t like. Which is natural for humans to push back against it.

What you think how white people reacted when black people protested for their rights under Martin Luther King?

Do you think they all went like “yeah, makes sense, let’s do that” right away? No, they pushed back against it.

The same people like you push back against the very idea of having any game with more female lead characters than males.

THAT is the point. Your hate for change.

It merely serves as an example (which is working btw. - no pun intended).

You said it yourself. There is “nothing unusual” about it.

So why should it be “unusual” for women in a FICTIONAL WORLD to be more equal than in the real world?

We can’t change how humans evolved biologically in the past 20.000 years since the rise of our species. But we can create a virtual world where actual equality is a thing because we can decide the rules of the universe.

You and others get mad over the idea of an equal, virtual game world, because you were born in an unequal universe. Think about that.

You are the Harbingers of the very idea you want to fight against.

In other words “I only want equality, as long as it suits me personally”.

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You’re trying to make this ideological when it’s about them killing off or making all the male characters incompetent and weak to replace them with women. How you can’t see the utter ridiculousness of it and how it shatters the suspense of disbelief I don’t know.

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You are massively misinformed, I’m guessing you’re young about secondary school or uni aged?

For example most white people in the usa, agreed on black people deserving the same rights as whites. Do you know how we know this? Because the civil rights bills were passed. White people made up roughly 80% of Americans, if 80% of the society want to oppress 10%, well there’s jack all the 10% can do to change that. Same as womens rights, most men agreed women should be given the same rights as men. If they didn’t women wouldn’t have the same rights as men, because men were the ones with the ability to vote.

Yeah it’s a disingenuous attempt to derail the conversation and brand people that disagree as bigots. It’s the hallmark tactic of ideological zealots.

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Someone else is misinformed, but white people are responsible for the success of the civil rights movement :rofl:

No the black leaders that put forward their voices and behaved with dignity in the face of abuse and media manipulation/character assassinations, and physical assassinations by the ruling elite a responsible for the success. I’m simply stating that the majority opinion of white people agreed that’s why it got passed.

Take race out of the equation, do you honestly believe if 80% of a population, wanted to oppress 10% of the population, they couldn’t?

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No its not. They still do those sword battles today , just see how much force they use on eachother. Its not just swinging a sword, but striking too. Brute strength is still the deciding factor, unless you’re talking about fencing. Women have no place on the battlefield unless there is no other choice.

Again look at the Hema tournaments, women have won them, alot, and there are historical records of female swordsmen.

Yes of course you need to put some force behind a blow, however it doesn’t take much force to do damage with a sword and women are capable of that.

Force is a factor but it’s generally much lower than reach, edge alignment, movement, tactics.

That being said I don’t think I’ve ever seen a women try and fight in plate, and although it’s not as restrictive as people think that could have an impact. Ultimately this is off the topic of.

Can we get some decent written characters in the video game, stop writing morons, wimpy men and egotist as the heroes please.

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That’s basically fencing with a different sword. Not much physical stuff going on there.

Just look up, m-1 medieval thats the real stuff.

This is just fencing with a ruleset, a man would cause an engagement and then use brute force strength to kill the woman. Also, combat is usually done with armor, which not only puts a heavy tax on the user, significantly disadvantaging women, but also taking away any advantage a more skilled woman could have that could ever compensate for size, strength and endurance.

There was recently a grappling match between a dominant giant of a woman (Gabi Garcia) world champion and a smaller world champion male competitor Craig Jones. He toyed with her and won. In combat or any athletic sport the physical advantage is massive, in the rare case where a woman would be more skilled it’s not enough.

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Quite frankly, at this point the tide has shifted. Blizzard has even renamed their DEI department due to the overwhelming toxicity around the term and “the soup”, as you put it, by now.

Not making any judgements here, but that’s the situation.

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Pretty much all of the cool guys left are either dead or far, far away. I had hopes for Magni after seeing him protect his son and revive the earthen, which was cool, but then of course he had to put down the mantle for his daughter because she’s better at talking.

It’s just so predictable now that one way or another the female characters end up in favorable positions while the guys don’t. It’s boring, and feels inauthentic because it’s clearly not about telling a good story but rather about preaching how to be as a person, and one thing is “better” than the other (more emotional, compassionate and talkative = good; logic, action/fighting oriented and blunt = bad. That’s prob why there’s little to no horde in this xpack so far).

As a woman myself i guess i was supposed to like this feminizing everything but i don’t, i much preferred King Varian, Illidan, Garrosh who feel like the Warcraft i singed up for, over current Anduin who runs away from his duty even though he has a great mentor in Genn Greymane who went through alot himself, alongside Jaina even who should know a thing or 2 about doing messed up things.
Current Thrall also doesn’t really seem to do anything special yet other than pep talks.

And i also much preffered Jaina, Tyrande, old Sylvanas and Yrel over the new female leads except Alleria who is the only one i can somewhat stomach so far. Xalatath is just evil and smirks at everyone while never being in real danger, not too much depth there yet for me.
Maybe it will change but for now that’s what i think.

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The thing is I don’t think they actually care as a business, I don’t think it’s done to push an agenda. I think they are doing the same thing Disney is, exploiting the hell out of ESG funding while they can.

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As it has been said countless times already:

It’s bad writing.

There is a fundamental concept in literature, film, and other forms of storytelling that describes a reader’s or viewer’s willingness to accept the premises of a story, even if they are fantastical, improbable, or otherwise unrealistic.

This fundamental concept is called “Suspension of Disbelief”.

The term was coined by the poet and philosopher Samuel Taylor Coleridge in the early 19th century. Coleridge described it as a state where the audience willingly sets aside their critical faculties, ignoring the implausibility of a story’s elements in order to engage emotionally with the narrative.

It’s a sort of “contract” between the creator and the audience: the creator promises to deliver a story that is internally consistent and emotionally compelling, and in return, the audience agrees to temporarily accept the story’s premises, no matter how fantastical.

Suspension of disbelief is crucial for the enjoyment of genres like fantasy, science fiction, horror, and even certain types of drama or comedy, where the events depicted would not happen in the real world. For the audience to engage with the story, they need to accept its reality on its own terms.

Without this suspension, the audience might constantly question or reject the narrative, which would prevent them from becoming immersed in the story.

Even in the most fantastical settings, characters should have motivations, emotions, and actions that resonate with the audience. Relatable characters are key to maintaining emotional engagement.

If female characters are portrayed with traits traditionally associated with male characters (such as extreme physical strength, aggression, or stoicism) or if male characters are portrayed with traits traditionally associated with female characters (such as heightened emotional sensitivity, nurturing behaviors, or vulnerability) in a way that feels inconsistent with established norms, it will challenge the reader’s suspension of disbelief.

Readers will struggle to accept these characters if the traits seem forced, exaggerated, or not fitting within the context of the story or world. If a story suddenly reverses norms without adequate explanation or setup, it will break the suspension of disbelief.

Mishandling the inversion of gender traits is a common pitfall for untalented writers.

Untalented writers might accidentally reduce complex gender roles to simplistic stereotypes or caricatures, which can come across as shallow or even offensive. For example, making a female character overly aggressive without depth or nuance might feel like a lazy inversion of gender norms rather than a thoughtful exploration of character.

This results in stories that are inconsistent, unbelievable, and unsatisfying. Like The War Within.

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Finally another orc brother here to talk sense. You said what I’ve been poorly attempting to say, very well. :+1:

Also where’s the damn orc representation in the skin colour of the emojis ffs blizz.

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Yes I am against Faerine being a fighter. She is blind in the left eye so she can’t protect from that side. Left hand is cut almost to the shoulder so how exactly is she caring the shield? She is a Mary Sue.
If she will be a ruler to do it from the throne. But no Blizzard had to make her a strong independent soldier who can do everything! F that diversity.

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Are you posting this as your other post got banned and deleted by blizz?