Which side is morally better?

I’ve figure as much :sweat_smile: Be careful with molten… She is very convinced she is right. And she is in fact right cause she said so…

Disagreeing with her is also blind hatred for the Alliance. And it will just get wilder and wilder the more you engage her. :man_facepalming:

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Some just can’t stop speaking my name. Discussing a person not the topic.
Disagreeing is not hate or wrong. Disagreeing with facts is where the problem comes. Once claims are heared and scrutinized or tested. They tend to fail.

One side overlooks the use of Necromancy to create Undead. One side sanctions the use of creating new Undead. One side overlooks their own being turned into Undead. This is not the Alliance. Yet comparisons on morality are being made?
There are lines the Alliance will not cross. What lines haven’t the (already) Horde crossed?

To begin to make an arguement for which side is morally better. You first have to create a standard by which both sides will have to be judged.

You need a base set of morals to make judgements. Something of an objective nature.

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On both occasions it was a small minority who acted without the knowledge of leadership. Or are you saying an entire race should be held accountable for one man’s actions?

The sunreavers are not a race, they are an organization, and what you mention can happen once, but if it happens twice, there are more than enough reasons to dismantle the entire organization.

I have not seen the Sunreavers take responsibility, investigate the guilty ones or judge them for war crimes, therefore the purge was JUSTIFIED.

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Not maybe total purge though, just make your own investigation and send all guilty ones in prison until further notice, the rest try to send back to silvermoon (aka expell from dalaran) also until the diplomatic talks finished. But if they resist then just try to put them in prison as well without further harm.
Or for better solution: speak to their leader and tell them to find all guilty ones and punish them

Typical alliance. Blame an entire race for the actions of an individual or a small group

But Garithos…!

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Im not saying the horde dont also do it :grinning:

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I think it’s a question of culture.

The Alliance is closer to IRL societies, than the Horde is. So many of the “wrong doings”, might seem bad from our “IRL human view”. But not from a Orcs point of view, since they come from Draenor culture, which is a bit more primal in their nature.

It’s the same as if I, a Scandinavian person, were to go to Japan… then many things I do might appear “wrong”, even if I personally don’t see it that way. Like how from what I heard, Japanese people find it extremely rude to talk in phones, while on public transportation, which isn’t a big deal in Scandinavia. :slight_smile:

So while there are both evil and good on both sides, it seems that many of the wars and fights, are caused by the Horde races not being fully integrated into Azerothian culture.

Thralls “new Horde”, I think also spawned by the fact that he wasn’t raised in Orc culture, but in Human culture instead. So his Horde is much more integrated.

But of course the new Horde still has many races, who are still part of Draenor tradition and customs, so the ones who doesn’t integrate, might cause issues that the Alliance (and us IRL humans) deem bad.

That’s my take on it at least hehe. :slight_smile:

Not murdering children.
Only the Horde done that. Draenai children to get to Azeroth. Night Elf children when Telldrassil burned.

A valid point was made. Blood Elves made a choice. To violate the neutrality of Dalaran or maintain the neutrality of Dalaran.
They made their choice. Your deflection is simply: Not All X Are Like That. Enough X Are Like that is the rebuttal.

That is not effective. The innocent Blood Elves will have collaborated with their guilty kin making any and all investigations pointless and could endanger the city itself. As now there is a very real Horde presence not Neutral presence. It will only have been a matter of time until the Blood Elves violated the neutrality and use the Dalaran for Horde campaigns and interests.

Enough Blood Elves cooperated with the Horde. So it led to their deportation from Dalaran.

Yes the entire race is responsible for a minority :clown_face:

Not all Blood Elves was on Dalaran. The Dalaran Blood Elves broke the neutrality of the city so was deported.

Like 3 belfs broke neutrality so Jaina rational as ever turned on the sunreavers

If you have a fortress and 3 people allow the enemy to come through the gate. The fortress can still fall.
You downplay the Blood Elves involvement. However it does not change the fact that Dalaran’s neutrality was violated by the Blood Elves. Choices were made which led to some actions being taken.

Jaina was betrayed by the Blood Elves. Peace was given a chance. The Horde violated it.

I not denying that a small group betrayed the kirin tor. I just don’t feel EVERYD SINGLE BLOOD ELF on dalaran should be blamed for the actions of 3

They were not. They were not going to be harmed. Blood Elf aggression forced Jaina Proudmoore to defend herself. As you already know. Those that did not take up arms were unharmed in the violet hold.

How would you have found the Horde leaning Blood Elves that betrayed the Neutrality of Dalaran?

No point you refuse to listen :man_shrugging:

ig right solution would be perform proper investigation by Jaina and then arrest only these X amount of agents who were actually guilty, and tell the rest that if anyone will do something similar then they also will go to jail if spotted by doing something bad, but not arresting and just giving notice and letting them living in dalaran

That is not a solution. It would have only emboldened Blood Elves and future Horde operations. Compromise. When done once there will always be another compromise.
This way it sends a message to the Blood Elves and Alliance forces of Dalaran. The neutrality of Dalaran is to be protected.

Now the Blood Elves that were placed in Violet Hold only had their kin to blame. Had they not weaponised Dalaran in service of the Horde none of that would have happened. Being held accountable is an unpleasent experience for some. But necessary. It was completely unsolvable the moment the Blood Elves made the violation.

This back and forth reminds me of Vulpera. Vulpera aggression in Voldun when the Alliance came there for the Horde. Vulpera players are crying that the Alliance fought back. Despite our restraint and mercy shown to the Vulpera.