He just wants Quel’thalas back for the Amani and I understand him to a degree, but at this point it’s a pipe dream…
Blizzard have made it clear that they care for the lore of their zones, so it’s impossible to even think about Quel’thalas should return to the Amani -even if rightfully as a Blood Elf fan I agree it belonged to them, technically- but returning them to the Amani it’s basically like throwing into the trashcan not just more than 7000 years of elven lore, but also all previous games since Warcraft 2 and 3, all the sacrifices of the Blood Elves in defending their lands not just against the Trolls but against the Scourge too… This in unthinkable to ever happen during WoW …The Amani failed in taking it back and…that’s it, sadly for them. Maybe in a new game (WoW 2, Warcraft 4) but I still highly doubt it.
But this is valid for others too- Alleria saying that Silvermoon will one day be on the side of the Alliance once again under the Void Elves. This can’t happen either during WoW’s lifespan…zones can only be destroyed by the other faction (like Teldrassil, Undercity) they can never ever switch side and faction. They just can’t, in a MMOrpg setting.
The only smell problem is that of the Forsaken. Have you been to their lands? I know they’ve died, but…personal hygiene…did it forego them?
Ok…complaining about the wine is hardly…“NIGHTBORNE HATE ZANDALARI!!!”
I tried some New Zealand wine the other day and I didn’t like it. That doesn’t mean “I HATE NEW ZEALANDERS!!!” Considering we’re emigrating there…it’s a good thing I’m not that highly strung.
Wanting Blood Elves dead is not wise, when in allegiance. You lost your Amani lands…now get over it.
I’m sure the Amani few can move to a place like Grizzly Hills.
And anyway, the only way we’d ever see Quel’Thalas in the hands of the Amani would be if we went back in time to see the Highborne enter the region.
And with the disaster that was WoD, time-travelling-into-the-past expansions, aren’t likely to happen anytime soon.
I think he’s complaining because the wine is not magical, probably.
I know the inns in Quel’thalas actually have wine with some magical properties (suntouched reserved if i recall correctly) so he would probably like it a lot more…nothing close to the Arcwine, but still better than troll wine for sure.
But I agree that it’s a bit silly thinking he’s hating on the Zandalari for the wine…also he’s just one person
Why? Tyrande cannot be in all the places in the same time. For example during her visit to Stormwind, and while Shandris was away to Silithus, Malfurion was in charge of all people during the War of the Thorns.
In Classic Staghelm had the same rights as Malfurion has right now. Shandris was too busy fighting against Nagas in Feralas. So, maybe while Tyrande was on some another visit to Stormwind, Staghelm have gathered some small group of spies and have send then to spying over Blood Elves…
We have some facts - Tyrande was not hostile to Blood Elves in Warcraft 3. While Staghelm was always a radical. Also Tyradne and Staghelm were always arguing between each others.
He spits in the inn and does complain about it, the fact that he has so many bubble speech shows what kind of person he is.
IT’s just an example that they are still very arrogant people who can behave horrible as guests.
Nope. Besides I was responding to a post that claimed that Zandalari and Amani are enemies because we’re allowed to kill them. We’re also allowed to kill belves in Orgrimmar in Baine extraction scenario and in Outland and other occasions, that doesn’t mean that belves as a whole are enemies to the Horde. THAT was my point.
But it’s her duty to know where the Sentinels are and if not her, then Shandris.
This was before the events of TBC and before the Blood Elven Sunfury sided with the Naga.
At this point in the lore, Tyrande was on route, back to Ashenvale and Hyjal, as Kael’thas accepted the aid of Lady Vashj.
But again, this doesn’t apply to the Sentinels and who they are to and as far as we know, it’s Tyrande and Shandris.
No, because none of this is documented.
This isn’t in the official lore and your trying to whitewash Tyrande from responsibility.
At the end of the day, she still leads the Sentinels and they answer to her. If she doesn’t know where they are, then that’s poor leadership.
And don’t compare this to Lor’themar either and what hostile Blood Elf groups and people were doing around Azeroth, such as in the Thalassian Base Camp in Azshara or Lethtendris in Dire Maul or the Sunhawks on Azuremyst and Bloodmyst Isle
He wasn’t their leader and they didn’t answer to him.
Well that’s a thing with all races.
Don’t get so offended by 1 NPC, who hardly any of us know anyway, for not approving of the Zandalari setting.
A large camp of Blood Elves and Nightborne are working in Zuldazar to uncover lost relics. The only complaints they have is the heat. I mean, what are you expecting?
Night Elves were hating on Nightborne and they were from the same culture. It seems rather pathetic, to be perfectly honest.
See below as well: Trolls aren’t exactly blameless when it comes to being horrible guests.
Well I remember Tatai was a bad guest in Silvermoon too also he was sent there as punishment because he did something bad so he now has to be the ambassador to the Blood Elves and wait for Lor’themar forever lol. But he’s quite rude, he thinks the city is full of useless magical stuff and also he says something like "why do you need so much space in this city"…
so much space? Silvermoon is actually just half of what it actually was, so Tatai is complaining about the size when Silvermoon was actually a lot bigger lol… and Trolls need a lot of space too…maybe not the Darkspears but the Zandalari built a huge city and empire as well
Shandris is just an general. Army can have many generals. Its not her responsibility to be responsible for each Night Elf soldier in the world.
As for Tyrande, she is a ruler and its her responsibility to command her people. But Staghelm is also the same ruler and has the same powers to control and command his people. In fact we know some cases where he was doing stuff without informing Tyrande at all…
And? Night Elves were also sided with Illidans nagas, when they have seen Kael’thas for the last time…
Again why? For example who was leading Night Elves sentinels and druids during The War of the Shifting Sands? Who was in charge of the Night Elves there?
It was Fandral Staghelm…
Nothing is documented. We cannot blame Tyrande while we do not have proofs. We cannot even say what Night Elves were looking there in Blood Elves lands at all.
As for bad leadership, those were hard times. For example Silverwing Sentinels in Classic were fighting with Warsong clan in Ashenvale. While both of those armies were hiding that they are fighting from their leaders…
Staghelm could just hide from Tyrande, that he have send a small group of spies.
Demon Hunter Trainees.
Not part of Tyrande’s Sentinels.
Again, it doesn’t matter.
We have no evidence to say that she wasn’t aware of this. In fact, the evidence we have presented states that the Sentinels of Darnassus answer to her or Shandris
Shandris is not just a “General.” She is THE General. She is the leader of the Sentinels, so either her or Tyrande must have known, considering the Darnassian Sentinels answer to her.
But we do have the proof - we have the ever lasting line of the Sentinels that are loyal to Darnassus, answer to Tyrande or Shandris, in Tyrande’s absence.
I’ve just checked the WoWpedia page and their is nothing to say that neither Fandral or Malfurion have authority over the Sentinels. Only Malfurion during the WoT when Tyrande was in Stormwind, but we have no reason to believe she was in Stormwind at the time when the Blood Elves of Silvermoon were struggling.
http s://wow.gamepedia.com/Sentinels
The Night Elves weren’t going through as harder times as the Blood Elves were, considering their leader was already in talks with the Legion.
Then why didn’t Tyrande send an official apology when she discovered what Fandral did after sending the Sentinel Spies in Quel’thalas? Maybe with an official apology the Blood Elves would have forgiven the Night Elves and Alliance, and maybe they would have not joined the Horde if they hadn’t already.
Either Tyrande was too proud to say “sorry” for the Sentinel Spies or maybe because she was involved with them too in either case it is bad for her…but we know she is not exactly the best ambassador of the Alliance, she basically alienated the Nightborne and gave the Shal’dorei to the Horde as well…
every Horde elven race is here in the Horde because of Tyrande
he was just an example of overall attitude of this race, just like the Island expedition group is showing off the same attitude. Same goes with archeologis groupthat was digging on Zandalari territory without approval for that.
I don’t know where these relations will go. I had impression that shelves only stick with belves because they share similarities (and apparetnly Thalyssra is really into LTT) . And Zandalari aren’t that progressive people to openly accept everyone with open arms, they wanted to boot the Horde out at the very start, and were only allowed them in becuase PC freed Talanji.
I don’t deny Tatai was rude, but he was going there as Ambassador to determine wheter or not belves are fit to join the Horde, so obviously he was looking for each excuse to not allow for it to happen. He had political power to actually influence it.
And from what I know these ambassadors never made it to actual audience with LTT, I guess that could also contribute to being upset xD
That is getting derailed so I’ll just summarise what I originally was claiming -
just becuase game allows us to kill certain NPCs doesn’t mean that they’re all open enemies. Zandalari aren’t enemies to Amani and vice versa.
I would not call destroying the Amani in their own home twice.
Destroying “The remaining Amani that have bolstered the Zandalari forces invading the northern shores of Pandaria, along with the Gurubashi, Drakkari and Farraki tribes”
And then further killing them on the Zandalari’s own orders in Dazar’alor
As “certain NPCs”.
It is a shame that blizzard is giving them the Scarlet Crusade treatment.
If they would kill them off they would piss a lot of seasoned players. They are still very popular among playerbase and instead the incoming options are suggesting a change in developer’s attitude.
Night Elves Sentinels. There was no Darnassus at those times.
Shandirs is a general, not a ruler. She cannot be in charge of every armies in the World. Each army, like Silwerwing Sentinels do fallow Shandris orders, but they have their own leaders who decide to inform or not inform Shandris of any kind of operations.
I was pointed out already the War of the Thorns where Malfurion was in charge. All Night Elves without any exceptions were under his command. While Tyrande and Shandrise could not order anything.
Only thing Shandrise and Tyrande could knew at all was from letters, that Malfurion was sending.
But when Fandral Staghelm was a ruler, he could just hide from Tyrande everything, and not send any letters in the same situation…
Sentinels are just Night Elves soldiers. Like orcs in the Horde army. There was a story where Orcs destroyed druids school. That was not 1 second operation, it was a long term operation that started in Ashenvale forest.
And guess what? Garrosh, Horde leader was unaware of that…
And I can give thousand examples like that in other races.
Why? Because racial armies are big. Armies are not 10-15 soldiers. Each big groups has their own officers and leaders. And some times racial leaders and generals do not know what some groups of soldiers are doing.
And Fendral was a leader who could order his people without notifying Tyrande or Shandris.
Yes, he was not a Sentinels General or something, he was even more, he was a Ruler of the Night Elves race !
But Night Elves have lost immortality, and that was a mega big punch for them. Their former capital was destroyed. And according to Classic starting video, only few Night Elves have left in Azeroth after War 3.
Those times were very hard for Night Elves. Malfurion stuck in Emerald Dream. Tyrande was trying to get him out. While Fendral was trying to return immortality for Night Elves (working on Old Gods).
Tyrande was disagree with his methods, and a lot of things he was doing hidden from Tyrande. And he had a lot of Nelf support at those times.
Or maybe she did not even knew that something have happened there. Just like Malfurion in the Good War…
Blood elves did not join the Horde because of the Tyrande.
In fact, Blood Elves joined the Horde only because Sylvanas offered a bargain. She gave Blood Elves a help to fight against the undead, and for that Blood Elves had to fight in the Horde Wars.
“For a while now my people have stood guard in these lands, and it is by my hand that you have any place within the Horde. You will aid us in Northrend, or I shall cease to aid you in Quel’Thalas.”
But Tyrande wasn’t away, during the time of the Night Elves being in Quel’Thalas.
So either, she knew about it or she’s a bad leader, who didn’t know where her own soldiers, who she is the leader of, went.
Yes their was.
This took place during Classic. Darnassus was the Night Elves’ capital city.
The Night Elves at Cenarion Hold were Cenarion Sentinels.
But, until we hear from a credible source, he was not in charge of the Sentinels.
We have no proof that she was not aware. The evidence, at that time, suggests that she was aware.
Well that’s a clever one, because apparently neither did Lorash.
And the writer admitted that he forgot about that questline.
They were indirectly pushed away from the Alliance, because of Tyrande.
They also forgot the fact that Blood Elves can live at most for 3000 years like King Anasterian…
…and said Lorash was actually born in Tirisfal and he was present when the Highborne of Dath’Remar first arrived in Quel’thalas and I think he blamed Malfurion for the loss of his father…
…either that is just another mistake, but if they have not corrected it, Blood Elves can almost reach 7000 years of age now? Not sure if it was labeled as a mistake
Tyrande was forming an Alliance with Alliance. You think she was sitting in Darnasus for 100% of her time till WOTLK without visiting Stormwind?
And again - Tyrande was not the only leader of Night Elves. Fandral Staghelm was the same ruler of the Night Elves. If he wanted he could easily sent a small group of his race without notifying Tyrande.
And no, that does not makes Tyrande a bad leader.
In fact, he managed to grow a World Tree without notifying anyone in the world… And we are talking about small group of spies…
I am talking about War of the Shifting Sands https://wow.gamepedia.com/War_of_the_Shifting_Sands
That war have happened ~1000 years before Warcraft 1. There were druids, sentinels, and even priestesses of Elune. All of them were fallowing Fandral Staghelm commands.
We do not have such evidences.
Questionable. Because many of the Blood Elves in Silwermoon still wanted to join Alliance instead of the Horde.
Well it was funny to hear from him some accusations about High Elves exile, while he is a Blood Elves, who did basically the same thing not so far ago =)
Both the quests, and books such as Shadows of the Horde, seem to highlight certain tendency the Zandalari have to kill “lesser tribe” members for the sake of “keeping them in line”. It seems to be less about them considering them enemies, and more about some weird sort of flex the Zandalari do from time to time.
Its a weird move indeed, but it seems to be some cultural thing trolls have.
