WoW community & Cross faction PvP

So, where do we start?

I have played WoW since late Vanilla until BFA where i couldn’t take the PvE meta for PvP. That’s my own personal choice, i just prefer to PvP. I also play Retail now it’s back. I do raid too though!

So my main issue, is the issue of the day and that’s the BG timers for Horde and how some of the community are so hateful and lack any form of rational thought behind what they’re saying/doing.

People say ‘‘You should reroll’ ‘This is Blizzards fault’’ ‘‘No changes’’ etc.

Reroll

I’d say you’re completely ignorant if you think any of the above. Reroll? Yeah, alot of people have played Horde since forever. I have invested so much time in my Horde character, so much money and so many hours, possibly too many hours because i genuinely prefer to play the Horde. Every single time i think ‘I may make a side project on Alliance’ i just can’t, because of my connection to my character. The same thing people moaned at retail for, not having a connection. These same people now want a lot of us to just say whatever and reroll. No. BG timers did fix this, more on that below.

Blizzards fault/No changes

Ok, so tell me how it is Blizzards fault when the community choose what THEY want to play. Because i honestly doubt people would be happy if they put faction caps in and forced you to choose something based on server population.

Yes, the racials are better for Horde, some are good for Alliance too…I get the moans of ‘people want to play horde for racials’ but really, the fix to the queue timers worked. And i will go into the BG’s a bit more below.

No changes - Ok, i am one for this. But at some point people need to stop being so blind to the fact that the old game has its imperfections. Faction balance used to be a thing and we dealt with it because back then, everyone wasn’t so self entitled and just got on with it and people didn’t really know as much as they did today. Thottbot anyone? Times have moved on, but we love the older version of the game. However, with the increased knowledge and skill level of players SOMETHING has to change so accommodate this which will have zero impact to the game. Cross faction BG’s.

BG cross faction, what’s the problem?

I don’t want an argument about this, i want a discussion. All i see on here are 90% Alliance saying hateful and pointless things, some retail players and those who just come here to troll from the community. So let’s keep it constructive.

What is cross faction BG’s actually doing? Some would argue it’s causing imbalance, id say otherwise. Look at the server statistics. Yes, we have more horde but that is a player choice for a lot of people. And some roll for the racials etc etc. When we queue against each other on the same faction, this is doing nothing, how can it be? So what is the actual issue with it? I have seen ‘‘Alliance will be dead soon’’ ‘just reroll’ ‘Allow free faction transfers’.

Alliance won’t die out, behave yourself. People have a love of their faction and if Horde were that good, you wouldn’t have alot of good PvP’ers and streamers still playing Alliance.

Faction changes for free - Ok Blizz could offer this, but do you really think if you offered that to someone they’d just leave? Look at private servers who do this and tell me if that actually solved it, no…it did not. If people thought outside the box you’d realise PvP and PvE communities would break up because say you have a 40 man team, not all will want to leave. So it’s easier to stay.

The only solution which the self entitled and clueless people are saying is ‘Blizz are just putting a bandaid on it’ Well, it works, and it has not been proven to cause any impact on the gameplay itself. It has been tested on Private Servers with no success.

I was having a blast the last few days and had motivation to PvP, waited 30 mins today to get into a bad one, finished it and now i have zero motivation to wait again due to the times. And i know alot of people are the same. So at what point will people stop pointlessly moaning and realise that if this isn’t permanently implemented, BG’s will not be something people want to do. Best thing is, these people will moan then in a few weeks they won’t care or actually enjoy it. Again, the minority are the loudest and spoil it for the majority.

Your thoughts are appreciated, no hate i want constructive criticism and a conversation.

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Tartanangel replying…

probably writing some troll comment about how HvH bgs have caused global warming

Edit: he didn’t disappoint

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Thank you, Kilswitch.

As a PvPer on the otherside it has been a welcome change as it’s ni on impossible to play battlegrounds within a decent timeframe.

I was considering making a twink just to BG before the changes :rofl:

I would love to see the increase in player count both Ally and Horde side during the 4 day testing window, I believe they both would have increased, certainly AV queue time dropped to 20 minutes even though It was not included in the FvF.

There are obviously some unbalances which need to be ironed out, I also do not want to see alliance players unsub, I enjoy killing pink haired warrior gnomes .

GG and Thx

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Your post is full of memememe.

It’s clear this is from a horde perspective as your posting on a retail alliance character and it’s your one and only post your not fooling anyone.

Saying faction balance used to be a thing it is very much self entitled especially when coming from the overpopulated faction standpoint.

Racials is cause and effect it has a much bigger drive for player choices as tbc it’s meta to roll horde for PvE and PvP reasons as much it is a reason to go a dwarf priest instead of a night elf someone posted a good idea to give players a choice on this to remove reasons to roll one faction over the other.

Yes it’s unfair that BG queues are long for the horde but to say BG changes to accommodate that without looking at balance is very ignorant to say this has zero impact.

It is indeed going to cause imbalance if other issues are not addressed immediately alot of servers are already seeing the effect and over population does cause a faction to die out on PvP servers, hello flamelash.

Ganking didn’t stop when queues where implemented being out numbered in PvP servers does cause players to re-roll or quit accelerating the problem to the point that you cannot pve on the server because the community has been decimated.

Private servers used incentive to achieve faction balance and servers that did not were forced to add dungeon finder where it puts you in a group cross faction for dungeons raids and PvP because the server was dying.

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I also forgot to mention which you reminded me. That people moan about the no changes and yet also moan that they should change the racials. Does make me laugh!

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Tartan -

I would like to see the queue times if Horde were 40 % pop with alliance as 60% with the higher majority. My reasoning behind this is I truly believe Horde are more PvP centric than Alliance. Meaning even with the numbers being higher on ally side, I don’t see this as fixing the Horde issue for queue times.

My meaning behind this post is that although horde benefit by being able to play battlegrounds with a normalised queue, I honestly do not think it’s going to impact alliance as much as its made out. I also dont think its beneficial for the alliance faction to brute force players to play their faction when it’s not the players choice its the meta.

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Yes, because i play the game. I cannot talk for everyone else. But i know alot feel the same.

It is from a Horde perspective, i say it in my post.

I played Alliance and Horde back then, not self entitled.

How does faction imbalance which is a player made construct have any impact on cross faction BG’s? We will get to play BG’s in a good time.

The best part of World of Warcraft has always been the community and the worst part of World of Warcraft has also always been the community.

The truth is Horde doesn’t make you PvP centric or better in PvP even with those racials.
There is just more PvP centric people on Horde that would faction change ASAP if Alliance had any advantage or population was 60A:40H.

It’s totally a population issue there is plenty alliance that participate in PvP. There is just more horde that roll PvP mainly because of racial min/max but that won’t be everyone.

looking at server balance via ironforge does not paint the full picture as there will be both alliance and horde that have zero intention of raiding.

Your looking at purely raid logs as a metric for server balance if horde participate in PvP more as you say and alliance as you say we are PvE centric that must mean the balance is worse than you thought if horde have more raid logs than the “PvE” faction

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the argument against is usually based on lore and what not…however IMO gameplay should always come before story and lore…

its not blizzards fault, people simply flock to the higher pop faction. specifically those without hardcore guilds - its so much easier to pug everything on highpop. horde is simply mega casual friendly all round.

solution? well, iv seen dozens of Pservers try different things to combat the faction imbalance from rep bonuses, exp boosts , honor rate increase, free respecs , free flying training etc etc… fact is, those servers were rarly any better than 60/40. people simply prefer horde for what ever reason. there’s no changing it frankly. so IMO this solutions fine, quick, dirty and easy. tho the masks are dumb af.

the people whining would whine about basically anything they disagree with and the vast majority of the moaners are moaning for the sake of moaning or because it didn’t directly benefit them so therefore its bad.

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So what would be your suggestion for the imbalance and does cross faction BG’s in your opinion change that?

I would not no, Alliance do have the advantage of both faster queues and if you minmax it really some of the priest racial’s are much more enticing (dwarf) for instance.

Desperate prayer - Instantly heals the caster.
Stone form - While active, grants immunity to Bleed, Poison, and Disease effects. In addition, Armor increased by 10%. Lasts 8 sec.

vs undead (horde meta)

WotF - Provides immunity to Charm, Fear and Sleep while active. May also be used while already afflicted by Charm, Fear or Sleep. Lasts 5 sec.

DP - Afflicts the target with a disease that causes 896 Shadow damage over 24 sec (huge mana cost)

In battleground’s horde work together more, unless for instance your in an alliance premade / PvP guild.

How does that address the issue ? it’s just the same as the long queue times are a player created issue both are part of the same problem changing the game to fix one issue at the cost of making the other issue worse is not a fix.

They fix your queues great you have fun but at the expense of the underpopulated faction who won’t be having fun watching their faction die off.

They fix your queues great you have fun but at the expense of the underpopulated faction who won’t be having fun watching their faction die off.

So you think there are so many people playing alliance only for lower queue times that if thats gone alliance will die off?

Ok, well as mentioned there is a solution for the BG times which doesn’t effect anything. You say the faction will die, it didn’t back then nor will it now. As i mentioned, there are still tons of high end players, streamers etc playing Alliance. The BG times do not effect Alliance so nothing really changes, they can still play their faction the same as everyone and have the same queue times.

Yes both player made problems, one has a solution, the other does not but haven’t worked on private servers and probably wont work. Because one solution changes nothing and the other is basically giving people incentive to move but they probably wont. One has no decision making involved, one does.

There is already many PvP guilds disbanding re-rolling horde because of the “fix” why not just roll the faction that has everything which in turn lowers alliance pop. Why be apart of an under-represented faction? This causes more to re-roll the dominant faction or quit. Even I’m considering a complete re-roll to horde as I don’t want to be stuck on a dying faction.

This change fixes nothing apart from horde queue times and exacerbates existing problems for the opposite faction. If this change goes ahead then they need to do all the other changes like cross-faction LFD since my faction dies off I can’t find a group for hours, duel spec since I can’t find a tank , personal loot since someone ninja something. This won’t be the last change if all it takes is People to cry on the boards and get any issue fixed with retail solutions.

There is no “fix” there was a test of a “fix” nothing is set in stone, Tartan you do realise 50% of horde will quit the game if this is not fixed horde are PvP centric and not being able to BG is killing the whole TBC game. There will be no ally or horde at this rate.

I know you will not care about this however.

I have 6 days 17 hours and 9 minutes at level 70. Since leveling I have not left Org, I have spent my entire time in BGs.

Currently I have

Helm
Shoulders
Chest
Cloak
Bracers
(cheap) trinket

Also sank about 2 hours in area just for cap.

Do you think that’s stable for most players or acceptable :smiley:

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I see nothing to suggest your faction dying off. There is nothing the X faction BG’s are doing to make people reroll Horde.

You said to me i sounded ‘mememe’ but let’s be honest. You’re saying you basically want people to roll Alliance so it doesn’t die out when many have invested time in Horde even before any of the times being fixed for BG’s.

In short, if the timers stay as they are, PvP will not be great on Horde, they’ll roll Alliance and guess what? Problem exists for Alliance with queue times. And the circle continues…

To assume Alliance will die just because horde can fight horde in a BG is exaggerating a bit.

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There are lots of solutions that would help the situation without damaging an entire faction this test was the most lazy “fix” that is damaging to the game.

  • Free horde to alliance transfers to see the uptake helps both sides this is best Change to start with
  • Removal of racials so people choose whatever race they like increasing likely hood of players rolling alliance
  • Merge of servers to make servers 50% high pop alliance/horde ratio and lock until threshold is achieved. The excess horde would be given the option to opt roll on a 50/50 horde/horde servers with incentive(increased rep riding skill etc) if this was achieved hvh battlegrounds would be fine but have an option to opt out for players not wanting that tainted experience
  • Make PvP servers have a toggle off and increase rewards for participation on servers where there is an imbalance of any faction.
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you mean Potential fix for Faction balance