Pelagos exists in game, and discloses such IF and only if you choose for him to do so.
All people are asking is that the character isn’t erased from the game simply because some people hate this. Don’t care about LGBT issues? then just ignore the character like 99% of people seem capable of doing.
These threads wouldn’t exist if people made good on their “I don’t care about this though” and actually practiced what they preach. The problem is they claim they don’t care but they OBSESS and RANT about a throwaway line of text on an NPC they have to CHOOSE to experience, which indicates they care about the issue so much, they’re making a situation they literally have to walk into willingly enough of an issue for them to spam these threads.
The solution is simple, if you don’t care, fine, then just play the bloody game and shut up about it and stop making threads moaning about it for christ’s sake. It’s not rocket science. I’ve done the entirety of Bastion and I saw absolutely NOTHING about Pelagos’ past identity by just following the quest story. It is a complete non-issue unless you decide to make it one for yourself.
Yes, I’m in the right wing spectrum and I don’t want leftist propaganda in the game. Or… if we have it, bring equally right politics - church, God, traditions in WoW.
Mere fact of existence is not “leftist propaganda”.
trans people exist, whether you like it or not (you have to concede this, or you’d have to agree you’re opposing something you don’t even believe is a thing, which is nonsense)
Pelagos exists.
Nothing in the game stipulates an active support of Pelagos, or support of LGBT rights or anything like that. It is simply that “these characters exist in the game”.
So no, there is not “leftist” propaganda in game, because even you, as a right winger, will concede these things exist on their own.
Right-leaning ideals similarly exist in wow, such as conservation, organised religion, opposition towards progressive values or changing values. Like the LGBT inclusion, they’re not particularly promoted, they’re just there.
Sounds to me like you want stronger pushing of these things, because as it stands, both strands have elements in wow, you just don’t like the other one is included as well as your own?
And if you’re arguing for very specific christian type stuff (nonsense) as a gesture, then I don’t know how much more direct you want it. Have you seen a lot of the language and symbology in Bastion?
Fact is even the LGBT stuff isn’t directly copied in the game, it inspires the game (like the right-leaning stuff). I mean, people don’t die and come back as blue glowing people in our world and get to choose another gender, so arguing that Pelagos is a direct insert of Trans agenda is like saying the Light is a direct insert of Christianity.
There are similarities, but direct insert? No. Both have their influences in wow, you just have to live with the parity. You wanting to “actively oppose” those things does not mean the game creators have a duty to promote your view. In the same way they are not directly promoting the other views.
I suspect the issue is you view mere inclusion of these individuals in the game as “promotion of the views” but as said earlier, you yourself will concede these individuals exist, even if you don’t like them. Does that mean you believe the entire world has a “left-leaning bias”, and if you do believe that, how does that reconcile with your religious beliefs?
You don’t need to be ‘aware’ of anything, since all of this, that they put in the game, is something that kinda passively just ‘is there’.
Where/how do they promote identity politics in the manner that you describe it happening?
Because the people simply see what they wish to see.
I think that this issue is srsly plaguing current western world. All the political correctness and requirements for specific % of minorities in your content etc is just BS. Its always so freaking obvious and feels like a punch in the face. If I create a content, I usually imagine what is normal for me, normal ppl I meet every day, my surroundings, local ppl and races, experience, memories…Why do I need to rethink my content and artificially add something that doesnt fit just to hit the required %?
I think these stupid rules simply just create any potential minority hate deeper, nothing else. Some ppl hate anything that is not common for them, but most of us dont care at all. Its not in humans nature to hate different race, religion or sexuality, right? I dont care about whoever’s race, religion, opinions, fat percentage or fetishes. I judge ppl by their actions, not their looks or certificates. Be a purple goat believing in Zeus and marry a carousel. Its your life, do whatever you want, but dont force shovel it down my throat, period. I hope the western world wakes up and start using a common sense again or they will just drown in their own sh*t. Oh wait, its already happening…Im not saying we have no issues here. We definitely have many issues, but I seriously fear the day this crap hits my area too.
Yes, Church symbols exist in the Bastion and Stormwind. So what? Does this change the fact that Blizzard does everything to portray Light not as pure good? Remember Xera? Remember Yrel?
Can you imagine the same treatment happening to LGBT? Can you imagine diversity of opinion? Can you imagine a message that changing gender on a whim isn’t necessarily good?
Same goes for racism. Stating BLM is allowed, but WLM will get you condemned, banned from twitter and fired. Oh, by the way - Blizzard employed a far left, feminist and anti-white racist writer. Are there openly Christian writers in the company? I doubt it.
You have classical angelic figures being represented, who have Hands of different Virtues which seem to ape Christian virtues, a lot of circulation around these Vespers (another Christian term) and monastic themes left right and centre about “preparing for service” and erasing personal traits to focus on being virtuous and pure. Stirpping of previous life away is a similar theme which was/is big in many Christian monastic things about having a new identity as a Monk/Nun which is why many take new names to symbolise this and casting off their old life.
I mean how much more direct do people want it? Do they want these Kyrian to literally say “Service to God” or something? Bastion is a gigantic reference to a truckload of greco-romain inspired Christian philosophy and ideas and way more “on the nose” about it than The Light.
To pretend that the character wasn’t written to reflect real-life identity politics would be intellectually dishonest. Video game is escapism, it doesn’t matter which spectrum of the political implications there are, it shouldn’t be reflected in a video game.
I’m not seeing proof of what you say, i’m seeing you saying “yeah well” and then projecting a lot of what you think is the case onto what is literally in the game. You’re also focusing on one specific aspect of light portrayed as bad and ignoring the fact that in 80% or more of other situations where it’s depicted it is shown to be benevolent and good and one of the most powerful (if not the most) cosmic forces in the WoW universe. A’dal literally cures Scourge infection by interceding in the death process in icecrown, a feat which the wild gods were unable to accomplish. Only Anduin’s accord with the Light allows us to escape the Maw where Jaina’s magic fails.
Stop cherry picking examples that suit you and ignoring all the stuff that doesn’t. And again, nowhere is it shown that Pelagos or Flynn/Shaw are “positive” they just “are”. So instead you start ranting about phantom hypothetical enemies like “well imagine if they did,…” which is irrelevant. Focus on what actually IS in the game not what you think would happen if and only if it were.
I could easily say “yeah well if they did this, then they’d do this, which is bad.” and it based upon nothing but my speculation and confirmation bias (like what you’re doing) and that is a really bad reason to argue against something being in the game in it’s current harmless form. It’s a combination of strawmanning and snowballing but however you look at it, it’s thoroughly unconvincing.
If someone can’t argue their case on the facts without referring to “what ifs” or “what might happen” or “yeah but if they did this, can you imagine” then their case isn’t worth arguing with in my opinion because it’s clear it relies on entertainment of prediction and assumptions that go a very certain direction to make sense (usually relying on accepting things as being the case prior, in order to argue why they are) which is a form of begging the question.
At least be honest and say escapism, but its only good when for heteros only, because everything else is bringing “politics” into the game. Terribly hypocritical.
It seems to me that to counter this little bit of “Light bad”, instead of removing the LGBT characters, we could simply add in an evil LGBT character to keep things balanced.
You cannot have a game based on factional conflict involving race-wars (in this case in the sense of species) in an apolitical setting. That is just absolutely ridiculous.
When using the term politics you can’t just decide what suddenly means politics and what doesn’t and then argue “politics doesn’t belong in WoW”. Conflict between different groups and how to reconcile that, and how to arrange society (two of the most major themes in WoW) are the biggest and oldest topics in Politics going, they’re the basis of the entire discipline forming in the first place.
But yeah you keeping complaining how politics doesn’t belong in the game because of someone trans/gay existing whilst ignoring all the above, sure thing.
Elisande was confirmed bisexual (her concubines anyone?) and she was psycho and shown to be flawed, there you go.
We also have the Mother Sharazz boss in TBC with similar.
But my suspicion is they don’t count because they’re female, and female gayness is “okay”, it’s only male gays/bis who need to be shown to be this thing because they’re the only ones that seem to be a problem.
It’s straight out of the “misogynisitic homophobic” textbook.
You’re missing the part that “heteros” wasn’t ever political until current politics made it so. It doesn’t change the fact that current political interpretations don’t belong in a video game where its lore wasn’t based around sex change. If it fits the world, ok, but go ahead and tell me how it does.