Yes, you are right, however other days is the opposite. What we have to realize is that destr warlocks are really broken because of one and only spell.
The issue here is rogues toolkit remained almost unaltered and unpruned all these years giving to the class a sustained level of fun and efficiency no other dps class shares.
Dont you agree other classes should be unpruned too?
2 Likes
Blizzard Guide to Buff Rogues
Step 1: Prune everything (exept Rogues)
Step 2: Prune everything again (exept Rogues and Mages)
Step 3: Give everything new abilities (including Rogues and Mages⌠but exept Warlocks)
Step 4: Nerf everything (GCD)
Step 5: Revert nerf to RoguesâŚ
Rogueâs design is disgustingly overpowered.
It used to be that finding in stealth was punishing for them. Now they donât care, they just use their openers even after leaving stealth for 3 seconds.
Used to be that because they were so good at picking fights and avoiding damage and controlling, that they didnât have self-heal, now thatâs gone too.
Imo their design should look like this:
-
no self heal (doesnât make sense for class who avoids damage and can at will prolong match⌠it rewards prolonging game)
-
opener possible only while stealthed
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stealth movement reduction (to 70% of normal or something like that) - it makes zero sense that stealthed character moves faster, itâs stupid both fantasy-wise and design-wise, it makes them very hard to reveal them, even when they donât care and even when they donât do any effort to avoid getting detectedâŚ
it also makes it possible for them to prolong matches, because when somebody picks the revealing eye in arena, they can just run around, fast af, sprint and avoid getting touched and annoy you for 10 minutes no problem
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Yes please, Arms feels so bad at the moment and itâs sad, because Iâve played warrior since forever.
Here is something I still dont understand. Why does melee class that has already overloaded kit with cc, mobility and selfsustain need more passive control.
Autoattacks apply 3 debuffs with 100% uptime on the target:
Wound poison
Crippling and
Mind Numbing
All affect the healer in some sort of way. And to top it off even if you dispel them the next auto that connects aplies them again. You try to get away from the rogue. Dispel, he just throws poisoned knife again and the poisons are on you again. On the long run the poisons effect start to be so overpowering that you cant even heal through the dmg anymore.
Another thing is absolutely mindless is the shadowstep on assasination, why is this still a thing? This allows rogue to instantly kick people for 5 secs spellock, followed with other over 10seconds of mind numbing control on the target.
Also why can these mongrels sap in combat? Get hit by GP and getting sapped at same time feels so fun.
No, itâs not just chaos bolt. Itâs not just warlocks either, itâs their comps.
On the other hand warlocks face comps that are incredibly disruptive and that pretty much escalates the problem of chaos bolt having to hit hard and warlocks needing lot of ccâs to get them off.
Counter question would be, what spells should be unpruned?
Some spells should be left dead, buried and forgotten. Preferably with some deadly curses protecting the tombs in case anyone dares to get approach them.
I know the consensus of this forum is that âpruning is badâ, but the problem will in the end always be, what should be unpruned?
I think a more interesting question would be, what sort of gameplay would people in general prefer? And since thatâs a rather large and vague question another one could be added, what sort of strengths and weaknesses should my spec have?
Preferably without diluting the specâs and make them all seem the sameâish, which has been an problem as well.
Do you know between what abilities rogues have lost access to?
.<
How about you roll a rogue, play assassination and take shadowstep off your bars?
Already got one
Fel Flame, Shadowflame, Conflag gets its root back, Soulfire, Backlash, Nether Ward but as an absorb or magic damage reduction Shield, Howl of Terror but there Iâd be okay with it needing a decision between another CC of the likes, instant Shadowfury ffs⌠Demon and Fel Armor in their original form, Soul Burn should make a comeback and the DPS cooldown can be pruned away. F*ck cooldown based bullsh!t
Adding to the Rogue discussion: What annoys me the most is that Rogue players always forget that their kit USED to be designed around stealth being a strong mechanic and that came with obvious drawbacks, yet Blizzard removed almost all the drawbacks over time, WITHOUT ADJUSTING THEIR RESPECTIVE KIT.
Sap should be 6s at most, not 8. Cheap Shot needs to be redesigned aswell. Everything that would be busted if it didnât have the restriction on only being usable while stealthed shouldâve been adjusted to account for all the changes.
Like they moved 50% slower during stealth, not mount speed they move atm.
They couldnt just build 5 combo and instantly swap before. They had to build the combos from scratch.
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They can do it since cata. It would be great to get back redirect for them thatâs for sure
Look how Warlocks design idea was maintained trough couse of Xpacs - A slow caster, with variety of demons to serve, with wast self-fealing capabilities, and wast CC toolkit.
And now what we have?
Slow - Check
variety of demons to serve - check, but nerfed and pruned as hell.
Self-healing - pruned.
CC - pruned.
How Rogues design idea was maintained trough couse of Xpacs - a high risk - high reward damage dealer, with cast CC capabilities, and good mobility, with no self-healing mechanics.
Mobility - was improved significantly over the couse of Xpacs
CC - was improved significantly over the couse of Xpacs.
high risk - high reward style - now it is a âno risk - high rewardâ class.
no self-healing mechanics - no self-healing mechanics - now has good self healing tools.
What the hell is this?
While i as warlock lost whole mechanics like metamorphosis, that was given in slightly diffirent form to the Spriest, my healing tools âhealthstone was transformed into healing potion, with same restrictions(1 use per combat)â while rogues has recieved a crimson vial - a 30% healing spell on 30 seconds CD. While i lost half of my CC abilities, and that was left baseline was nerfed to the ground like shadowfury is now castable, and fear now breaks from 1 point of damage, rogues CC was left intact or was being improved. My baseline escape spell - demonic circle was made into a talent, while rogues has recieved new talents to improve their current mobility or add new ones.
Yes Destro damage is broken, but what destro would be if chaosbolt will be nerfed? Like in Legion affli was good only because of overpowered self-heals, destro now good only because of chaosbold damage. I would like to rebalance our damage, but only if we as warlocks will recieve a well-thought rework, because right now, my class is nerfed, pruned and just broken. And see how classes as mages/rogues was improved and polished, makes me to quiestion blizzard class design team.
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Making a character that is designed to sit on a target with tons of pressure without crowd control and then complains that they donât have the same toolkit as one that is balanced around it
Yeah outlaw as well, feral however does a lot of bleed damage which is still physical by bypasses armour.
The point of the thread is how it isnât balanced at all compared to ~9 other classes ![:slight_smile:](https://d1bg94bbsh66ji.cloudfront.net/en/wow/images/emoji/twitter/slight_smile.png?v=6" ":slight_smile:")
At some point Rogue might have been balanced around it, but in no way is Warrior sitting on you more dangerous than Rogue.
Itâs not about damage.
Itâs about utility.
Currently Rogue utility has no downside. Which is retarded. Stealth should slow you down, so you have to move more carefully and play well, leaving stealth should disallow using stealth-only abilities, so again, you have to consider playing careful and well.
And you shouldnât have self heal, so you donât just Vanish whenever you please and heal to full, until the target dies. Thatâs bad design where one target is directly inferior.
Currently if I play 2s, out of 5 most common teams I meet, 3 of those contains Rogues.
They can use CC to avoid damage, they can use cooldowns to avoid damage, they have DR on 15 sec CD and they can vanish whenever they risk dying and come back whenever they are full HP and vanish off CD again.
3 Likes
Looks like we got a 6% buff on some abilities, but not Bladestorm.
It feels good that we received at least something, instead of nothing.
At this point, I think we wonât be seeing a class ârevampâ until the next expansion.
um yeah, didnt blizz basically confirm that like 4 months ago?
We donât need it. We have the best class design ever
Looks like Ion said Warriors had too many abilities removed in the latest video:
Rise of Azshara Developer Insights with Ion Hazikostas.
Warrior talk begins around min 25~
I have hopes for warriors!
Did you count them one by one or just copy-paste in word and see how many words?
Rog too much cc mobility utility everything on 1 class like ww 's .
But why rog kick 5 SEC ? other all melee kicks are 4 sec ? really strange .