125mp5 is not “little”
Same for mages really and locks, they will all be required to use LW+ Tailoring effectively denying them any choice of professions
Worlsbuffs are more obnoxious to use than even 8m drums, and almost everyone used them.
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Blizzard not understanding the problem and “fixing” it makes it worse.
It’s the same completely backwards problems their developers have had on retail since WoD and throughout Legion which possibly boils down to to most of the devs not actually playing the game.
So just because Blizzard is not removing the drums you all want to use them?
Blizzard could just let drums in the game and you guys don’t use it. Doing this would provide the experience that you are looking for.
You can’t even use drums in arena *laughs in pvp".
No, we don’t want to use them but realistically no healer is going to pass up a 125mp5 buff while progressing content. In the same way people don’t want to get WB but its too big a benefit to ignore.
Typically people prefer slightly harder PvE content, and common use of WBs and Drums is simply a direct nerf to all PvE content.
Saying people shouldn’t use it is exactly the same as telling people: “if you want more challenging progression just raid with less gear on”. It’s a dumb answer. MMOs have metas, they are governed by a crowd mentality not an individual.
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Don’t see why this is a dumb answer. People actually do this. They raid with less players or without gear for challenges.
3 players instead of 40 killed onyxia.
other challenges like only use the same class, raiding mc bwl with only mages/paladins/shamans/boomkins…
Apes world first was also basically done with mostly green gear and not even at lvl60 (Ony/ZG buffs are not even available if it’s world first)
Casual guilds basically sh!t on the meta because they just go in with friends to have some fun without caring about parses, clear time.
Meta matters for the top players who want to compete against each other in pve.
GL hf whining until Blizzard frees you from the crowd mentality xD
Yea, they do something like that once or twice a year. It also has clearly nothing to do with progressing content. Enjoy being woke.
I mean how hard can it be.
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Make the regular Drums available for non-leatherworkers (but created by leatherworkers) and keep the 8 yards range (for people pushing their own numbers, PuGs etc) - if it all.
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Make the Greater Drums raid wide (and available from start) with a requirement of 375 Leatherworking (which would mean 4 people out of 25 would “need” it in a guild raiding / more tryhard environment and give value to leatherworkers).
I don’t care about either yet I still want to play my character as best as I can and getting better every clear.
You’re being intentionally lazy at the game and you justify it by being a “casual” player? No you’re just intentionally not playing as well as you could.
Edit: There’s a time and place to play chill and casual, that time or place is not in the current tier of raiding.
Yes, I am intentionally not going to perform as well as it’s possible and I don’t expect it from others. Also using a buff or consumables has not that much to do with playing well. It doesn’t matter if you get drums or worldbuffs and die by standing in fire or pulling threat. For many players it’s just a bluff. They get worldbuffs and consumables just so they look like they are hardcore competent raiders but play like keyboard turners and mouse clickers.
I raided Naxx and was also intentionally not using all the consumables and world buffs that would be available and increase my performance because I did not need them. I also raided MC/BWL in phase3 as a paladin-healer with 0 talents in the holy-tree xD
What I disliked about world buffs was how tedious they were to get, how they encouraged griefing and staying offline to preserve them. Their impact on “difficulty” and more importantly, clear speeds was never particulary bothersome to me. In fact, rebuffing ony and zg was very handy on our first few Sapp and KT kills.
Like, if Blizzard made drums into widely available, no-requirement consume made by leatherworkers, basically guaranteeing permanent 5% haste buf all the time, I would consider that a great “fix”.
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How exactly these “greater drums” fix the “leatherworking feels mandatory” problem ? I don’t even…
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Silblade, I think that what you and some other people on this thread (like that madman, Schmurzeli) are missing is that people aren’t claiming, literally, that “you have to get LW”. You’re absolutely right in saying that it’s optional, per se. But that’s really not what the other side is saying.
What the other side is saying, as far as I understand, is something along the lines of:
“I shouldn’t have to be forced to do something like this just because I want to perform as well as I can”
And, frankly, I think that’s a legit claim. Wanting to perform to your best (not necessarily 100% parse, as that involves some RNG too, but yeah) is a legitimate aspiration for any player, and it’s just as understandable that said player may have reserves about what the game demands of them in order to achieve that result. Stuff like wbuffs, drums etc. are criticized because they add arbitrary and unneccessary burdens to that goal for no perceived improvement to the gameplay experience, at all.
Ofc, you could always reply “by that logic, why not removing consumables outright? After all, if everything’s just a nuisance to the minmaxer… !” But the thing is, you might argue that - within certain limits - consumables do have a positive effect on the game. I have yet to see a convincing argument for why the profession-locked nature of drums somehow adds something to the gameplay, for comparison.
Don’t get me wrong, I am not particularly concerned about drums per se - they’re certainly not as toxic as wbuffs are, as far as I’m concerned. But I think the whole “you don’t have to do it” mindset is misguided to begin with. Either you’re misunderstanding what the other players are asking, or you’re basically telling them “you have no right to demand this from the game”, which I think is just stupid. People aren’t asking to not have any meta, but for the meta itself to not involve certain things.
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Please give us a new bluepost telling you reconsider drums change and making them raid wide (and different drums buffs are not stackable), as community wants it.
Remove the requirement to be leatherworker to use them, problem solved.
The leatherworkers can now sell them to anyone for some profit win/win situation for all.
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What class are you exactly?
Bet if we look at logs, you’re getting carried by people using world buffs + consumes 
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There must be a better solution to this 
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after a brief period of enlightenment during blizzcon blizzard went back to being clowns, what a shame - drum meta isn’t a fond memory of anyone I talked to about this, everyone wants to dodge the horrible LW meta with overfarmed clefthoofs
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Easier for him to troll post from an alt and make claims without proof 
But yea, seeing those logs would be fun (and, I imagine, predictable)
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