Its time for the Alliance to unite on AV

[Bewarê-frostmane]

@Mojojo-gandling

This choke point only favors Horde though to defend SHGY it’s actually harder since Horde have 2 routes to attack it and once they got it only one route to defend it.

Yes, ignore the events that happened before it, where the Alliance team in every BG where that happens had already shown they were inferior in the PvP in the first clash where they get reinforcements faster, the same way Horde gets reinforcements faster to IBGY.

Of course you can’t break that choke point if you’re losing in what decides the actual BG, which is the PvP.

@Mojojo-gandling

Fast queues - Because of the queue times it generally makes most Alliance players not really try. Players playing for honor want fast games. AFK’ers generally don’t care as long as they leech some honor and rep and rep farmers only care for doing hand ins. You might get 50% of the team wanting to go for the win but that isn’t enough.

This is part of the real issue, right there. The overall mindset. It’s inherently different between the two sides, and it always was.

@Bewarê-frostmane

Meanwhile, I’ll just quote https://us.forums.blizzard.com/en/wow/t/the-curious-case-of-wolfenstein-av-and-player-perception/435213 again:

Nearly 20 years ago, a game called Wolfenstein: Enemy Territory was being tested. The game had two mechanically identical sub-machine guns, the only differences being cosmetic (their in-game models and sound effects.) However, even those the guns were functionally identical…one was actually performing better. How? Why?

It turns out people “felt” one was better because it sounded stronger. That is it. People thought their gun was stronger, so they were more aggressive and got more kills…while others using the different identical gun thought it was weaker…so they played more defensive and ended up dying more.

Player perception has real, tangible effects…even if they’re based in reality or not.

I think this is what is happening in Alterac Valley right now. I know its not an exact 1:1 comparison, but I think the power of mind-set should not be overlooked. Alliance are queuing up convinced they’re going to lose because they’re at a disadvantage…and why wouldn’t they think that, they have been losing. So now they’re in the fight convinced they’re all ready on the back foot, so why should they try…they’re just going to lose anyways, right? And they self-fulfill their own prophecy.

With Wolfenstein, all they had to do was change the sound effect, unfortunately I don’t see such an easy fix to the perception problem that exists now…other than just bringing to light just how powerful mind-set is.

You all started with that mindset from the trauma caused by the World PvP phase which made them rush out AV and WSG earlier than planned, which is why you Alliance sought strength in numbers with plans beforehand to exploit the crap out of the matchmaking system, because you knew you could since the exploits were known from both refail and pservers already.

So when that got taken away, the psychological blow to your mindsets immediately showed its effects from the PTSD of the WPvP phase, which kept burrowing deeper and deeper in your minds and blaming everything on external factors instead of looking within. (Because nobody wants to blame themselves, right? It MUST be the fault of things you have no control over!)

Like the Wolfenstein stuff, you’re just complaining that the “gun sounds louder and looks better” even though they’re inconsequential to the real problems, which is the negative player mindset and widespread martyr complex.

@Bewarê-frostmane

Seeing the incessant whining on the forum and the real, tangible effects on player behavior in the game ever since the WPvP phase started (the forum history from that time is hilarious), sure does indicate psychological trauma though.

Your arguments are just delusional nonsense.

To help you understand it better, I’ll break it down for you:

The premades Alliance were running were actually seeking out PvP, with the masses helping out the ones that were being “pulled over” by the Horde in the first clash.
Ever since the premades got taken away, the Alliance overwhelmingly only tries to keep running most of the time in the first clash, like a herd of gazelles. (It really does look like that.)

The few times Alliance pugs have TRIED to fight back in numbers, and lost, they quickly started giving up though. Because it “only confirmed what they already knew”. And thus the player perception issues kept growing.

It’s funny, right?

The martyr complex is real, bro.

So a simple comparison: Alliance has way more that gives up much faster, so even in the rare events where they make it to IBGY, the struggle overwhelms them, while the Horde being as confident as they tend to be, always keeps trying.

Horde didn’t become known for turtling based on nothing, you know?

While the Alliance never have the full force that never quits. The few times it was tested in the early days after premades having been rightfully hotfixed to death, they lost because they failed at what decides the BG which is the PvP, so because that “confirmed what they already knew”, it ended right then and there.

Alliance just doesn’t have the mindset to win in AV if they aren’t in a full premade.

Which is why it would’ve been better to just remove solo queue as an option from all BGs in Classic, since the ranking system really doesn’t need it and it’s not like it’s impossible for the “solo casual players” to get into premades if more of them are up and running every day for them to get their rep (they can even do rep farming grinds together!).

With everyone queuing as full premades then the Alliance would be able to make sure there’s the mindset, and realm wars would be more fun than this anonymous gigantic xrealm garbage anyway. (It’d still be xrealm, but each side would be limited to only representing the realm the entire team is from. So it’d be X realm vs. Y realm, and so on.)
It’d also prevent bots from ruining ladders, and AFKers would become practically non-existent since both realm reputation would be on the line and they’d be kicked and blacklisted. Even if they can’t be kicked from the BG, they definitely would be kicked after the BG ends and unable to join for the following ones.

Beautiful, right?

If some fun in casual PvP is what some people want, then removing all rep and honor from such “easy option” BGs would be enough where they can solo queue all day every day for as long as they want. No risk of it devaluing anything, and no risk of people wanting to do premade exploits in it either.